LA Times: Axl Rose's appetite is for today's Guns N' Roses

[LongGoneDay]

First off, "We take for granted that we know the whole story, We judge a book by it's cover, And read what we want, Between selected lines", still more than valid words 20 years down the road, just look at the length of this discussion, all the twisting and turning.

Surely Axl is talking about the reunion because the topic keeps popping up and is kept alive by people who smell money (in addition to those who simply want to sniff some nostalgia). He is pretty clear that easy cash is not his motivation. In addition to being quite dedicated to the current line up, he is also clear that 40% of the original line up could not cope with the demands of a tour and simply that fact is enough to rule out a reunion tour even if all involved had the will to do it.

Would I attend a reunion concert? No. I would not mind hearing a song or two at HOF just as a one time nostalgia thing if all parties would have a motivation to do it, but why would I pay money to hear the old songs (surely none from CD could be included) played worse than the current band does them (yes, you can dream of the past but it was never that great alive, in all honesty, despite all charisma and perceived chemistry). I can't see the old line up being creative together again, I just don't see them sharing a vision of what kind of music they'd like to create together and I have no interest to hear old songs played by some tribute band that is dead creatively. I know many will disagree on this and that is their prerogative, but i also know quite a few will agree. 

Wow, tribute band?
One of the more off base terms I've read.

Guns N' Roses have always had the reputation of being a great live act. I understand it's of some peoples opinions that the new lineup plays other peoples music better, and that's all well and great. I disagree. Pop in Live at the Ritz, or even the Illusion DVDs if you need a refresher. GN'R was every bit, and in my opinion more of a powerhouse live back then. Axl gets around pretty damn well for his age, but not like he used to. It doesn't make sense to me how he could run around the stage like he did and still manage to sing in tune(most of the time). Slash was as entertaining on stage as he was in the studio.

Not so sure they are dead creatively. Their last album of original material, however long ago it was, clearly states otherwise. There is no evidence to support they still couldn't create quality music together.

Do I expect them to reunite, pump out great albums and tour the world like it's 1992 again? No, but let's not get carried away. Guns N' Roses is a house hold name today because of the amazing records and tours they produced on the backs of Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, Steven and Matt. Not the other way around, as your "tribute band" comment seems to suggest.

[StardustGirl]

First off, "We take for granted that we know the whole story, We judge a book by it's cover, And read what we want, Between selected lines", still more than valid words 20 years down the road, just look at the length of this discussion, all the twisting and turning.

Surely Axl is talking about the reunion because the topic keeps popping up and is kept alive by people who smell money (in addition to those who simply want to sniff some nostalgia). He is pretty clear that easy cash is not his motivation. In addition to being quite dedicated to the current line up, he is also clear that 40% of the original line up could not cope with the demands of a tour and simply that fact is enough to rule out a reunion tour even if all involved had the will to do it.

Would I attend a reunion concert? No. I would not mind hearing a song or two at HOF just as a one time nostalgia thing if all parties would have a motivation to do it, but why would I pay money to hear the old songs (surely none from CD could be included) played worse than the current band does them (yes, you can dream of the past but it was never that great alive, in all honesty, despite all charisma and perceived chemistry). I can't see the old line up being creative together again, I just don't see them sharing a vision of what kind of music they'd like to create together and I have no interest to hear old songs played by some tribute band that is dead creatively. I know many will disagree on this and that is their prerogative, but i also know quite a few will agree. 

Wow, tribute band?
One of the more off base terms I've read.

Guns N' Roses have always had the reputation of being a great live act. I understand it's of some peoples opinions that the new lineup plays other peoples music better, and that's all well and great. I disagree. Pop in Live at the Ritz, or even the Illusion DVDs if you need a refresher. GN'R was every bit, and in my opinion more of a powerhouse live back then. Axl gets around pretty damn well for his age, but not like he used to. It doesn't make sense to me how he could run around the stage like he did and still manage to sing in tune(most of the time). Slash was as entertaining on stage as he was in the studio.

Not so sure they are dead creatively. Their last album of original material, however long ago it was, clearly states otherwise. There is no evidence to support they still couldn't create quality music together.

Do I expect them to reunite, pump out great albums and tour the world like it's 1992 again? No, but let's not get carried away. Guns N' Roses is a house hold name today because of the amazing records and tours they produced on the backs of Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, Steven and Matt. Not the other way around, as your "tribute band" comment seems to suggest.

Quite honestly, I cannot perceive any other reason for a reunion tour save for money. It has been 20 years (25 if we are strict) since the original line up created anything at all together. After the UYI tour ended they had quite a few years to come up with something. You really think they could work together now and agree on the directions of the music when they barely were able to do so earlier? Seriously? People have moved on and I doubt it's in the same direction.

The band certainly had some special energy and appeal in their old live performances (although they did not always hit it by the note), no one is denying that, but you really think they could still find in themselves the motivation and the chemistry to match up? Really? No, I see no magic in playing old songs for money.

[LongGoneDay]

First off, "We take for granted that we know the whole story, We judge a book by it's cover, And read what we want, Between selected lines", still more than valid words 20 years down the road, just look at the length of this discussion, all the twisting and turning.

Surely Axl is talking about the reunion because the topic keeps popping up and is kept alive by people who smell money (in addition to those who simply want to sniff some nostalgia). He is pretty clear that easy cash is not his motivation. In addition to being quite dedicated to the current line up, he is also clear that 40% of the original line up could not cope with the demands of a tour and simply that fact is enough to rule out a reunion tour even if all involved had the will to do it.

Would I attend a reunion concert? No. I would not mind hearing a song or two at HOF just as a one time nostalgia thing if all parties would have a motivation to do it, but why would I pay money to hear the old songs (surely none from CD could be included) played worse than the current band does them (yes, you can dream of the past but it was never that great alive, in all honesty, despite all charisma and perceived chemistry). I can't see the old line up being creative together again, I just don't see them sharing a vision of what kind of music they'd like to create together and I have no interest to hear old songs played by some tribute band that is dead creatively. I know many will disagree on this and that is their prerogative, but i also know quite a few will agree. 

Wow, tribute band?
One of the more off base terms I've read.

Guns N' Roses have always had the reputation of being a great live act. I understand it's of some peoples opinions that the new lineup plays other peoples music better, and that's all well and great. I disagree. Pop in Live at the Ritz, or even the Illusion DVDs if you need a refresher. GN'R was every bit, and in my opinion more of a powerhouse live back then. Axl gets around pretty damn well for his age, but not like he used to. It doesn't make sense to me how he could run around the stage like he did and still manage to sing in tune(most of the time). Slash was as entertaining on stage as he was in the studio.

Not so sure they are dead creatively. Their last album of original material, however long ago it was, clearly states otherwise. There is no evidence to support they still couldn't create quality music together.

Do I expect them to reunite, pump out great albums and tour the world like it's 1992 again? No, but let's not get carried away. Guns N' Roses is a house hold name today because of the amazing records and tours they produced on the backs of Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, Steven and Matt. Not the other way around, as your "tribute band" comment seems to suggest.

Quite honestly, I cannot perceive any other reason for a reunion tour save for money. It has been 20 years (25 if we are strict) since the original line up created anything at all together. After the UYI tour ended they had quite a few years to come up with something. You really think they could work together now and agree on the directions of the music when they barely were able to do so earlier? Seriously? People have moved on and I doubt it's in the same direction.

The band certainly had some special energy and appeal in their old live performances (although they did not always hit it by the note), no one is denying that, but you really think they could still find in themselves the motivation and the chemistry to match up? Really? No, I see no magic in playing old songs for money.

Axl is the only one I've heard that has said anything remotely negative about playing "old" songs.
Slash, Duff, Steven clearly enjoy playing them, as they continue to do so in their projects since leaving GN'R.
You really think it's that far fetched to think that the guys who actually created those songs could enjoy playing them for fans who have never had a chance to hear them live? But on the other hand, you have no such reservations about guys that had no hand in creating or have any emotional attachment play them?

I'm just like everyone else in the world, I have absolutely no idea if any chemistry is left, or if there is any magic left to be captured between the alumni.
I don't believe it's as far fetched as you suggest, but I could very well be wrong. All I know is, plenty of bands have had problems, worked them out, and carried on doing what they do best. I can't think of many bands worth a damn where everything was roses at all times.

Money talks, but these guys aren't starving, save for maybe Steven. I don't think they would do it solely for cash. I think if they chose to reunite even for one night, it would be on their terms. They would have to feel like the bullshit was behind them. Can I envision them putting on a killer show if they shared the same stage at the RRHOF induction? Yes, that is not hard for me to envision at all, really. I've seen todays GN'R. I've Velvet Revolver and Slash with Myles. They all rank in my favorite live acts of today. I have a harder time envisioning them putting on a lackluster show to be honest.

[StardustGirl]

First off, "We take for granted that we know the whole story, We judge a book by it's cover, And read what we want, Between selected lines", still more than valid words 20 years down the road, just look at the length of this discussion, all the twisting and turning.

Surely Axl is talking about the reunion because the topic keeps popping up and is kept alive by people who smell money (in addition to those who simply want to sniff some nostalgia). He is pretty clear that easy cash is not his motivation. In addition to being quite dedicated to the current line up, he is also clear that 40% of the original line up could not cope with the demands of a tour and simply that fact is enough to rule out a reunion tour even if all involved had the will to do it.

Would I attend a reunion concert? No. I would not mind hearing a song or two at HOF just as a one time nostalgia thing if all parties would have a motivation to do it, but why would I pay money to hear the old songs (surely none from CD could be included) played worse than the current band does them (yes, you can dream of the past but it was never that great alive, in all honesty, despite all charisma and perceived chemistry). I can't see the old line up being creative together again, I just don't see them sharing a vision of what kind of music they'd like to create together and I have no interest to hear old songs played by some tribute band that is dead creatively. I know many will disagree on this and that is their prerogative, but i also know quite a few will agree. 

Wow, tribute band?
One of the more off base terms I've read.

Guns N' Roses have always had the reputation of being a great live act. I understand it's of some peoples opinions that the new lineup plays other peoples music better, and that's all well and great. I disagree. Pop in Live at the Ritz, or even the Illusion DVDs if you need a refresher. GN'R was every bit, and in my opinion more of a powerhouse live back then. Axl gets around pretty damn well for his age, but not like he used to. It doesn't make sense to me how he could run around the stage like he did and still manage to sing in tune(most of the time). Slash was as entertaining on stage as he was in the studio.

Not so sure they are dead creatively. Their last album of original material, however long ago it was, clearly states otherwise. There is no evidence to support they still couldn't create quality music together.

Do I expect them to reunite, pump out great albums and tour the world like it's 1992 again? No, but let's not get carried away. Guns N' Roses is a house hold name today because of the amazing records and tours they produced on the backs of Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, Steven and Matt. Not the other way around, as your "tribute band" comment seems to suggest.

Quite honestly, I cannot perceive any other reason for a reunion tour save for money. It has been 20 years (25 if we are strict) since the original line up created anything at all together. After the UYI tour ended they had quite a few years to come up with something. You really think they could work together now and agree on the directions of the music when they barely were able to do so earlier? Seriously? People have moved on and I doubt it's in the same direction.

The band certainly had some special energy and appeal in their old live performances (although they did not always hit it by the note), no one is denying that, but you really think they could still find in themselves the motivation and the chemistry to match up? Really? No, I see no magic in playing old songs for money.

Axl is the only one I've heard that has said anything remotely negative about playing "old" songs.
Slash, Duff, Steven clearly enjoy playing them, as they continue to do so in their projects since leaving GN'R.
You really think it's that far fetched to think that the guys who actually created those songs could enjoy playing them for fans who have never had a chance to hear them live? But on the other hand, you have no such reservations about guys that had no hand in creating or have any emotional attachment play them?

I'm just like everyone else in the world, I have absolutely no idea if any chemistry is left, or if there is any magic left to be captured between the alumni.
I don't believe it's as far fetched as you suggest, but I could very well be wrong. All I know is, plenty of bands have had problems, worked them out, and carried on doing what they do best. I can't think of many bands worth a damn where everything was roses at all times.

Money talks, but these guys aren't starving, save for maybe Steven. I don't think they would do it solely for cash. I think if they chose to reunite even for one night, it would be on their terms. They would have to feel like the bullshit was behind them. Can I envision them putting on a killer show if they shared the same stage at the RRHOF induction? Yes, that is not hard for me to envision at all, really. I've seen todays GN'R. I've Velvet Revolver and Slash with Myles. They all rank in my favorite live acts of today. I have a harder time envisioning them putting on a lackluster show to be honest.

Do you remember why we are discussing this in the first place? That's right, the interview Axl recently gave. In which he said quite explicitly that he has recently fired a manager who was advocating a reunion for money. Axl also made clear that even if all differences were put aside, he does not think the original 5 would be capable to manage a tour - even if all wanted, it could not happen. Is there really much more to discuss?

[LongGoneDay]

I was responding to the comments you made that made very little sense to me.
First referring to the original lineup as a tribute band. Second, inferring that the original lineup were not capable of playing their own songs well.
Third, trying to pass your opinion that old Guns was not very good live as fact, when in reality, they have received far more praise then any incarnation since.
Hence the undying interest from fans all over the globe for a reunion, 18 years later and going strong.

I'm not sure why Axl is talking about a tour anyway. The RRHOF isn't a world tour, it's one night.
I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen.

Also, what Axl thinks, and what is reality are not necessarily one and the same.

[StardustGirl]

I was responding to the comments you made that made very little sense to me.
First referring to the original lineup as a tribute band. Second, inferring that the original lineup were not capable of playing their own songs well.
Third, trying to pass your opinion that old Guns was not very good live as fact, when in reality, they have received far more praise then any incarnation since.
Hence the undying interest from fans all over the globe for a reunion, 18 years later and going strong.

I'm not sure why Axl is talking about a tour anyway. The RRHOF isn't a world tour, it's one night.
I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen.

Also, what Axl thinks, and what is reality are not necessarily one and the same.

So, what Axl thinks is not necessarily reality, but you think Izzy and Steven could handle it and that's closer to reality than what Axl thinks

I presume Axl is talking about a tour because that - once again - was proposed by the previous management that was fired over it, and Axl perhaps wanted to make a point about it for those who urge for a reunion, as in it is not happening and why, from his point of view.

Like I said before, a one off nostalgia thing of playing a few songs at HOF would be nice if all involved were to agree. I also cannot see where have I ever said that the Old Guns were never good live? I believe I expressed my opinion to be quite the contrary. Surely the old guys can still play their old songs, but based on what I've seen both live and on YouTube it is rather doubtful they could do it better than the current line up. I also dare to maintain that it would be a sad thing indeed to have the old guys go around and play the old songs (20-25 years old!) just because it pays well. In my mind Guns has moved forward, there is new music out there that in my opinion exceed even UYI songs in maturity and depth and I would love to see the band grow, something which I cannot see would happen with the old guys, as sad as that may be.

[LongGoneDay]

I never said Izzy and Steven could handle it. Just like Axl, I don't know.
Only Izzy and Steven know what their bodies can physically handle.

I'm not sure why it matters to you that time has passed since they played together? or how that would make it a sad affair.
I see it as the opposite.

I appreciate that your of the opinion the Chinese Democracy songs show more depth/maturity than UYI.
Many people, including myself would strongly disagree. I'm of the opinion that Axl's lyrics in particular sorely regressed from UYI to CD.
Musically, it's apples and oranges, because you can't evolve, or mature from something you were never involved with from the beginning.

I'm holding out hope that Axl will feel more inspired with new guys like Ashba and BF involved in the songwriting process this time around.
If we were to play the reunion scenario, I could see there being a chance that he would feel inspired by the alumni, as he was when they were a band all those years ago. It's not unprecedented. Stranger things have happened.

You keep bringing up the money issue. I'm not sure you could make the argument that Richard Fortus and Tommy Stinson playing songs they have admitted to not being fans of before being hired is somehow more credible than the very people who wrote them. For the record, Richard and Tommy are getting paid too.

[StardustGirl]

I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen.

If this is not saying that you think the guys could handle it, then I don't know what is. Rather confusing to me that you claim otherwise.

All the original guys went their separate ways years ago and have each done their own thing since. Axl made a point in the interview to acknowledge how committed he is to the current line up. Also many of the guys have given signals that they are approaching creative stage. Axl fired a manager because he suggested abandoning the current band and going on a reunion tour. According to Axl the suggestion was motivated by the manager's urge to make more money. Does this sound like Axl is going on a reunion tour any time soon? Why would the old guys want it either? Have you heard anyone saying they'd like to (maybe Steven...)? Most likely motivation would be money as most people believe there would be loads of it to be made were a reunion tour a reality. Really, have you even read the interview?

[LongGoneDay]

I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen.

If this is not saying that you think the guys could handle it, then I don't know what is. Rather confusing to me that you claim otherwise.

All the original guys went their separate ways years ago and have each done their own thing since. Axl made a point in the interview to acknowledge how committed he is to the current line up. Also many of the guys have given signals that they are approaching creative stage. Axl fired a manager because he suggested abandoning the current band and going on a reunion tour. According to Axl the suggestion was motivated by the manager's urge to make more money. Does this sound like Axl is going on a reunion tour any time soon? Why would the old guys want it either? Have you heard anyone saying they'd like to (maybe Steven...)? Most likely motivation would be money as most people believe there would be loads of it to be made were a reunion tour a reality. Really, have you even read the interview?

If you don't pick and choose pieces of what I write, and instead read it all in the context it's given, I think I've been pretty clear.
Here it is again.

"I'm not sure why Axl is talking about a tour anyway. The RRHOF isn't a world tour, it's one night.
I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen."

In summary, I think Izzy and Steven could handle playing one night, the RRHOF induction ceremony. As far as an entire tour? No, I don't know. Neither does Axl.

[faldor]

Entertaining banter between you two.  I get what Stardust Girl is saying though.  While I'd LOVE to see the original lineup, or even the UYI lineup go on a massive tour and try to recapture what once was, because I never got to experience it the first time around.  I wouldn't want that to happen solely for money, and I think that's the only way it would happen.  Axl is clearly committed to GNR in the present day.  Slash is having a blast doing his own thing with Myles and his band.  Duff is doing his thing with Loaded.  Steven is the only one who has been pining away for a reunion incessantly.  The rest of them, their hearts don't seem into it at this point.  So why go there?  So I, and countless others, can selfishly get to re-live the past?  As long as Axl wants to carry on with GNR in terms of touring and creating/releasing new music with the current lineup, I'll take that.  And that's just the way it is, so all this reunion talk seems to be all for naught.

With that being said, I'll be in Cleveland for the ceremony and I hope to hell I get to see something special for that ONE night.  Then, things can return to normal.

[new gnr fan]

But it would be a MUCH bigger deal, when the whole Afd-Line Up would be included. And i think, he is not interested because Dizzy never was in a same line up with steven (ok, maybe a few weeks...). so when there is a reunion, i think, there would be this line up

axl
slash
richard
duff
frank
dizzy
(chris maybe)

[LongGoneDay]

I wouldn't want to see them mail it in solely for money, either. I totally get that.
I don't see a reunion happening, and really, I'm okay with that. I've had 18 years to get used to the fact that I'm probably not catching that lineup again live.
That's life.

Just for shits and giggles, to kill time, which is what forums are good for in my opinion...if we are to visit the land of make believe, and discuss the reunion, I don't see them doing it solely for cash, because if that was the only motivation, that offer was always on the table. I don't think they need the money much more today than they would have in years past. Most of the alumni seem to be enjoying the most success they have had in their post GNR careers.

Anyways, good talk StardustGirl.
Gonna switch gears here, and actually try and get some work done.

Maybe we can pick this up later.
The good thing about these types of debates is that they never really get resolved, or end (unless a moderator ends them for us).

[Buddha_Master]

Maybe it would be cool at the HOF for the old Appetite lineup to just perform one song together. Axl could get that monkey off his back and say he did for the fans and put that motherfucker to rest. If he doesn't do that I would personally just say right the fuck on Axl 'cause I have his back and understand what having your bros backs mean. These guys (the cool motherfuckers in GNR today) are his bros.

Either way fuck it. I am seeing GNR New Years motherfuckers HAHAHAHAHA!

[GNR4L]

There was a time and place for this band.  1987-1993 Guns N' Roses was if not the biggest band in the world.  Times change, people change. The alumni was known for their raw, sloppy playing ability that was big during that era of music.  Today we have a band that is note by note kick ass, group of guys that can play old and new material.  What Guns is about today isn't about the past... It's about touring and writing new material.  For those wanting a reunion... wouldn't you want  to  hold that moment in time as something special ?  Axl is probably right in when he says that he doesn't think Izzy or Steven could handle it.  Izzy seems to do what he wants, Steven all you gotta do is turn on the  TV to figure that one out.  All I'm saying is if you get the alumni back, would it tarnish their legacy if things didn't work out ? I for one would like to remember them for what they did for music during that time.  Guns N' Roses today is something special too and its now their turn to shine. 

[bazgnr]

Entertaining banter between you two.  I get what Stardust Girl is saying though.  While I'd LOVE to see the original lineup, or even the UYI lineup go on a massive tour and try to recapture what once was, because I never got to experience it the first time around.  I wouldn't want that to happen solely for money, and I think that's the only way it would happen.  Axl is clearly committed to GNR in the present day.  Slash is having a blast doing his own thing with Myles and his band.  Duff is doing his thing with Loaded.  Steven is the only one who has been pining away for a reunion incessantly.  The rest of them, their hearts don't seem into it at this point.  So why go there?  So I, and countless others, can selfishly get to re-live the past?  As long as Axl wants to carry on with GNR in terms of touring and creating/releasing new music with the current lineup, I'll take that.  And that's just the way it is, so all this reunion talk seems to be all for naught.

With that being said, I'll be in Cleveland for the ceremony and I hope to hell I get to see something special for that ONE night.  Then, things can return to normal.

Agreed.  I'm hoping for that one night - and only one night - when the AFD-era members can share the stage and celebrate what they accomplished, as well as the legacy that they left behind.  It's not about invalidating the current era Guns, but about paying tribune to the journey the original members made together and how they truly changed the face of rock and roll.  They owe it to themselves to share in that moment, and - as a fan who lived through that time and saw them live - it would mean a lot to see that happen. 

As for a reunion, there's just no need.  The UYI-era members were unwilling or unable to embrace the musical directions Axl envisioned for the band and choices were made.   It's the current lineup who has realized those visions and will carry them into the future.  But on that one night in Cleveland, I hope to see something amazing happen.