Is Interscope/Geffen Blocking The Next Album's Release?

[D-GenerationX]

Well, they played more shows than one of the line ups many consider classic. Which means we can put the "its not a band" shit to rest. So in that sense it's a success. All the "Axl can't keep a band together" shit is irrelevant.

But people claiming this is barely a band do so because we have been told, point blank, this current group hasn't written a note together in 8 years.

We are well aware that a group of people have performed the same 20 or so songs under the name Guns N Roses for the past few years.  No one is really disputing that part.

[sofine11]

1 more or less unpromoted album in the 18 years that Axl has been sole owner of the Guns N' Roses name is disheartening, at best.  Especially when you consider all the finished music he's allegedly hoarding.  I just have a really hard time wrapping my mind around the "whys" there.

[D-GenerationX]

1 more or less unpromoted album in the 18 years that Axl has been sole owner of the Guns N' Roses name is disheartening, at best.  Especially when you consider all the finished music he's allegedly hoarding.  I just have a really hard time wrapping my mind around the "whys" there.

Agreed.

And even falling back on lauding the touring has its problems.  Because if you want to point to all the shows they played, fine.  But you must also include an entire tour cancelled that Axl somewhat dubiously claimed he knew nothing about and found out about via the internet.  And the initial North American tour that was an unmitigated disaster.

[jarmo]

1 more or less unpromoted album in the 18 years that Axl has been sole owner of the Guns N' Roses name is disheartening, at best.  Especially when you consider all the finished music he's allegedly hoarding.  I just have a really hard time wrapping my mind around the "whys" there.

David Bowie released a new album last year, his first in about ten years. He didn't tour or do interviews to promote it. But only Axl does that kind of stuff right?

Dr Dre still didn't release Detox, an album that's been talked about for a while. But only Axl does that right?


Why do these artists do things like these when it seems like the whole world is appearing on morning TV, doing interviews, never breaking up bands, releasing albums that everyone loves every year and so on... Because everybody is different! What works for you, might not work for me.



/jarmo

[JAEBALL]

i personally don't care about what David Bowie and Dr Dre do....


i just know what Axl does or doesn't do .. and anybody else's situation is not comparable anyway

[sofine11]

1 more or less unpromoted album in the 18 years that Axl has been sole owner of the Guns N' Roses name is disheartening, at best.  Especially when you consider all the finished music he's allegedly hoarding.  I just have a really hard time wrapping my mind around the "whys" there.

David Bowie released a new album last year, his first in about ten years. He didn't tour or do interviews to promote it. But only Axl does that kind of stuff right?

Dr Dre still didn't release Detox, an album that's been talked about for a while. But only Axl does that right?



/jarmo

Those artists aren't basically sitting on loads of finished material.  

David Bowie recorded an album, released it in a timely matter, and promoted it with a few videos.  He cannot tour due to a serious heart condition.

Dr. Dre released The Chronic 2001 in 1999, back when the Sean Beaven produced Chinese Democracy album was supposed to be wrapping up production, only to be delayed and reworked for 9 additional years, though admittedly some of that was due to the label, some not.  I believe he has released several singles for 'Detox' over the last few years, with videos, something Axl has yet to do for the follow up to Chinese.

[D-GenerationX]

Jarmo brings up that David Bowie example all the time.  Examples of how other bands operate are permissible if they help the Axl side of things.  Otherwise, not relevant.

And I am a huge, huge Dr. Dre fan.  So, sticking with the comparisons we are now cool with, let me assure anyone and everyone within earshot that Dr. Dre fans absolutely do not laud him for his inactivity.  Or commend him for "not compromising" or any of that crap.  The overwhelming opinions are frustration and bewilderment that 'Detox' can take this long to get together.

[sofine11]

Let me clarify my stance.  I DO NOT believe that Axl Rose is solely responsible for the lack of Nu-GNR albums over the last 18 years. However, I also do not believe that the label is the sole colporate.  I think its absolutely 50/50.

If Axl wanted to get another GNR album out "soon" bad enough, he could get it done.  He's Axl Rose.  On the flip side, if the label wanted another GNR album out "soon", they'd figure out a way to motivate Axl to give them whatever tracks were meant for the next album, master 'em, and put them out.

I do not believe either want another GNR album enough to do what it takes to make it a reality.  Otherwise, we'd all have Soul Monster & The General blasting on our ipods, etc right now.  Simple as that.

Someone is not doing their job.

[D-GenerationX]

Let me clarify my stance.  I DO NOT believe that Axl Rose is solely responsible for the lack of Nu-GNR albums over the last 18 years. However, I also do not believe that the label is the sole colporate.  I think its absolutely 50/50.

If Axl wanted to get another GNR album out "soon" bad enough, he could get it done.  He's Axl Rose.  On the flip side, if the label wanted another GNR album out "soon", they'd figure out a way to motivate Axl to give them whatever tracks were meant for the next album, master 'em, and put them out.

I do not believe either want another GNR album enough to do what it takes to make it a reality.  Otherwise, we'd all have Soul Monster & The General blasting on our ipods, etc right now.  Simple as that.

Someone is not doing their job.

This is pretty much my stance as well.  I absolutely do not think either side is exactly moving heaven and earth to get this done.

My personal belief is that Axl has little to no interest in doing anything constructive, and the label isn't exactly holding their breath anyway.

I think my biggest objection to this narrative about the label being against Axl is the simple fact I doubt they give him much thought, pro or con.

[sofine11]

Let me clarify my stance.  I DO NOT believe that Axl Rose is solely responsible for the lack of Nu-GNR albums over the last 18 years. However, I also do not believe that the label is the sole colporate.  I think its absolutely 50/50.

If Axl wanted to get another GNR album out "soon" bad enough, he could get it done.  He's Axl Rose.  On the flip side, if the label wanted another GNR album out "soon", they'd figure out a way to motivate Axl to give them whatever tracks were meant for the next album, master 'em, and put them out.

I do not believe either want another GNR album enough to do what it takes to make it a reality.  Otherwise, we'd all have Soul Monster & The General blasting on our ipods, etc right now.  Simple as that.

Someone is not doing their job.

This is pretty much my stance as well.  I absolutely do not think either side is exactly moving heaven and earth to get this done.

My personal belief is that Axl has little to no interest in doing anything constructive, and the label isn't exactly holding their breath anyway.

I think my biggest objection to this narrative about the label being against Axl is the simple fact I doubt they give him much thought, pro or con.

Yep. 

It's the ultimate rock n' roll riddle of the Sphinx: What happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object?  We don't get an album and have to spend our days arguing with Jarmo as to why exactly that is. 

[bev]

If Axl releases another album similar to the last offering then why bother?

Whilst I acknowledge that music is very much each to their own, for mine, Chinesse Democracy was weak & didn't warrant any kind of fanfare or promotion.

The album lacked any energy and was bereft of spirit.  Forget the length it took to be released. I wouldn't care if it was (15) years or (15) weeks, it was stale and lifeless upon its release.

As far as promotion goes, not all great albums need big singles, however the great albums will take you on an emotional journey & demand the listener to constantly revisit the album because of the feeling it generates within them. 

Axl's past works ensured that Chinesse Democracy received significant publicity & promotion, with very little effort on his or the bands part - i.e. if the album is good enought then it promotes itself on the back of one of rocks most legendary figures.  However, it was a lukewarm offering, at best, and received a similar reception on its release.  Six years on from its release, no one, outside of these forums, is commenting what a hidden gem this album was & how astonishing it is that it wasn't received better by music fans.

I tend to feel the time spent touring this album could had been better spent doing anything else.  This album did not warrant this much touring, it should had been put to bed many moons ago.

I honestly believe that Axl & the bands next offering is very much make or break for all concerned. 

Make no doubt about it, the wider listenning audience has very much moved on from Axl Rose, a long, long time ago. 

Axl needs to regain his hunger to dominate, otherwise he'll only ever be known as a great frontman for unbelievable late eighties, early nineties band.  Not bad in itself, however I am rooting for him to want to show everyone up again, on his own terms. 

Whilst he will always have his audience, as evidence to forums like this one, I tend to think that Axl and middle of the road doesn't sit well, on any level.

Lets hope this next album is raw, honest and an absolute killer of an offering!

[jarmo]

Jarmo brings up that David Bowie example all the time.  Examples of how other bands operate are permissible if they help the Axl side of things.  Otherwise, not relevant.

Yeah, and you keep ignoring the facts that there are other artists out there who do things their way.

I'm not buying the idea that the more albums we have out by GN'R, the happier the fans will be.



/jarmo

[sofine11]

I'm not buying the idea that the more albums we have out by GN'R, the happier the fans will be.



/jarmo

If you're saying that GNR fans wouldn't be "happier" if they announced the next album, oh, let's say, tomorrow....Then I don't know what to tell you...

Of course the more music GNR puts out the happier fans will be.  How can you possibly dispute that? 



There's always going to be that select minority of fans that can never be pleased.  Every band has their peanut galleries.  But, c'mon...

[Ali]

On the original topic:  As I posted last week, the label has rejected a GN'R album before, when Axl wanted to mix CD, but was told by Bob Ezrin, acting as the A&R guy brought in by Jimmy Iovine, the album wasn't ready to mix.  Yes, this is the same label that rejected MIA's recent album multiple times because of its "dark" tone.

So, of course it's possible the label may not be happy with what they hear for stylistic and/or commercial accessibility reasons.

Off topic:  Of course many GN'R fans would be happy with a new album, myself included.  Others may complain if it isn't stylistically to their liking or closer to the traditional hard rock sound of the old band.  Others will complain if the record contains songs written with Buckethead and Robin Finck.  Others yet will complain simply because it isn't the old band.

So, I don't think any album would universally appease and satisfy the fanbase.

Ali

[sofine11]

So, I don't think any album would universally appease and satisfy the fanbase.

Ali

Of course not.  As I said, every rock band has it's unquenchable critics who never go away.  Hell, when Metallica finally released Death Magnetic in 2008, an album that saw them return to their roots in a way no one thought they could, fans cried to high heaven about what they deemed to be a terrible mixing job.

Being unable to universally please the fanbase is no reason to shy away from an album release.

[Ali]

So, I don't think any album would universally appease and satisfy the fanbase.

Ali

Of course not.  As I said, every rock band has it's unquenchable critics who never go away.  Hell, when Metallica finally released Death Magnetic in 2008, an album that saw them return to their roots in a way no one thought they could, fans cried to high heaven about what they deemed to be a terrible mixing job.

Being unable to universally please the fanbase is no reason to shy away from an album release.

No one said it was a reason.

I'm just offering my take on Jarmo's point about more albums=happier GN'R fans.

Ali

[jarmo]

I'm not buying the idea that the more albums we have out by GN'R, the happier the fans will be.

If you're saying that GNR fans wouldn't be "happier" if they announced the next album, oh, let's say, tomorrow....Then I don't know what to tell you...

Of course the more music GNR puts out the happier fans will be.  How can you possibly dispute that? 

I didn't say that. Most fans would be excited. And then once the album was out, depending on the kind of fan you are, you'd either listen to it a lot or just once. 

Because when you get something, you'll start thinking about what you want next. Just like a kid who gets a new toy.... 


For example, if you buy an album by some artist or band, for how long do you listen to it? Do you give it one chance and if it doesn't do anything for you, do you just put it aside and basically forget about it?

How long before you start "waiting" for the next album? If you know you're getting a new album every two-three years, do you give an album more attention since you already know the next one is around the corner? Or do you give an album more attention when you don't know when the next one is coming?




/jarmo

[norway]

Yes, this is the same label that rejected MIA's recent album multiple times because of its "dark" tone.

h8 how everything "incorrect" gets snuffed out, it kills artistic integrity

Rock records from rock acts are released every week of every year.

From the up and comer right on through the arena tour level.  Every week, every year.

ok fine! those darn reunionists!

it seems 2 me that the most support (from companies) goes to >>> not rock, unless it is established bignames.
dunno if I'm right

[russkwtx]

If Axl releases another album similar to the last offering then why bother?

Whilst I acknowledge that music is very much each to their own, for mine, Chinesse Democracy was weak & didn't warrant any kind of fanfare or promotion.

The album lacked any energy and was bereft of spirit.  Forget the length it took to be released. I wouldn't care if it was (15) years or (15) weeks, it was stale and lifeless upon its release.

As far as promotion goes, not all great albums need big singles, however the great albums will take you on an emotional journey & demand the listener to constantly revisit the album because of the feeling it generates within them. 

Axl's past works ensured that Chinesse Democracy received significant publicity & promotion, with very little effort on his or the bands part - i.e. if the album is good enought then it promotes itself on the back of one of rocks most legendary figures.  However, it was a lukewarm offering, at best, and received a similar reception on its release.  Six years on from its release, no one, outside of these forums, is commenting what a hidden gem this album was & how astonishing it is that it wasn't received better by music fans.

I tend to feel the time spent touring this album could had been better spent doing anything else.  This album did not warrant this much touring, it should had been put to bed many moons ago.

I honestly believe that Axl & the bands next offering is very much make or break for all concerned. 

Make no doubt about it, the wider listenning audience has very much moved on from Axl Rose, a long, long time ago. 

Axl needs to regain his hunger to dominate, otherwise he'll only ever be known as a great frontman for unbelievable late eighties, early nineties band.  Not bad in itself, however I am rooting for him to want to show everyone up again, on his own terms. 

Whilst he will always have his audience, as evidence to forums like this one, I tend to think that Axl and middle of the road doesn't sit well, on any level.

Lets hope this next album is raw, honest and an absolute killer of an offering!

It would be hard for me to disagree more. True, AFD was raw and clearly the best GNR ever did. But CD had, IMO, some really great songs that are or will become classics. Songs like Madagascar, TWAT, Better, and Sorry are good examples. And I could even add The Blues, Shacklers, IRS, and This I Love as very strong songs. So I think that CD is a very strong album that could have and should have done better in sales if there had been some decent promotion and a video or two. Whom to blame for those shortcomings, I do not know. But to castigate the album in the way that was done is not accurate IMO.

[AXLRIVERS]

Im not sure..On the whole CD was a good album. Not great. The problem wasnt the songs per se - it was it didnt flow like an album should. probably due to the time span the songs were written. It was a batch of songs thrown together that didnt quite gel. Anyway, off topic we've gone probably. Soz. (slaps hand)-
 However, In relation to post - agree bit of blame in both camps Id assume. Neither is probably pushing for anything to happen 'soon' one way or the other.