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Author Topic: Donald Trump & 2016 Election  (Read 148965 times)
pilferk
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Marmite Militia, taking over one piece of toast at a time!!!


« Reply #3480 on: October 10, 2019, 06:36:43 AM »


The alternative to leaving would have been staying. And we would have needed to send more troops in if we decided to stay. With Russia,  Iran and now Turkey having their military there, think that would have been a bigger mess.

 

Yes, we would have had to stay until we could craft an actual solution, and not just take our ball and go home, all while creating a power vacuum in the region. One that everyone and their grandmother could see Turkey was going to fill. By invading.

Nobody was going to invade as long as the US military (even if it was 5 troops, not 50) in the area.  As long as we had a stated patrol, nobody is going to risk that confrontation with the US military.

So...no mess.  Same situation we've had for years now.

And I agree: We've been there too long.  But you can't just pack up the tents and leave. Not without creating a humanitarian and military crisis.  Oh, and never mind betraying the Kurds just gives ISIS another recruiting tool, and ensures that, if ISIS resurges, we won't be able to count on the Kurds for the kind of help we did this time. 

This is exactly why Trump is so bad at this: He doesn't understand the nuance and complexity.  Or, rather, he doesn't care about it. 

Even Repubs are worried and kvetching about this one.  It's a poor decision.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2019, 07:12:18 AM by pilferk » Logged

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« Reply #3481 on: October 10, 2019, 06:38:30 AM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....
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« Reply #3482 on: October 10, 2019, 08:52:01 AM »

Trump is justifying this by saying the Kurds didn't help us in Normandy rofl. You literally couldn't make this shit up.
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tim_m
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« Reply #3483 on: October 10, 2019, 10:01:14 AM »

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/florida-businessmen-who-helped-giuliani-ukraine-arrested-campaign-finance-charges-n1064606?cid=sm_npd_nn_fb_ma&fbclid=IwAR1mtwsUSgDNhXSatzNa3zaz8eD12h4jXsOffEMLgFoaJQMVMPFIMb_6cmM
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pilferk
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« Reply #3484 on: October 10, 2019, 02:27:08 PM »

Just, you know, so we can put the "the whistleblower is a partisan hack/biased" bullshit to bed:

https://compassrosepllc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/2019_1009_-Statement-Concerning-Bias.pdf
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pilferk
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« Reply #3485 on: October 10, 2019, 02:31:03 PM »


Once again, Trump surrounds himself with the corrupt and the corruptable.

I'm SHOCKED to see another instance of campaign finance law violations, with foreign nationals contributing, associated with another of the President's close associates. SHOCKED!!!

And two who, apparently, helping Rudy to dig up dirt in the Ukraine?  Isn't that ALSO a foreign campaign contribution of a sort.  They are providing something of value (their time and labor) to benefit a presidential campaign.

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« Reply #3486 on: October 11, 2019, 03:24:32 AM »


Once again, Trump surrounds himself with the corrupt and the corruptable.

I'm SHOCKED to see another instance of campaign finance law violations, with foreign nationals contributing, associated with another of the President's close associates. SHOCKED!!!

And two who, apparently, helping Rudy to dig up dirt in the Ukraine?  Isn't that ALSO a foreign campaign contribution of a sort.  They are providing something of value (their time and labor) to benefit a presidential campaign.



Now we have this. https://thehill-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/thehill.com/policy/international/china/465283-trump-adviser-claims-china-gave-him-info-on-hunter-biden?amp
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« Reply #3487 on: October 11, 2019, 04:16:54 AM »

https://amp-cnn-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/10/11/politics/donald-trump-rudy-giuliani-ukraine-impeachment/index.html?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCKAE%3D#referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F2019%2F10%2F11%2Fpolitics%2Fdonald-trump-rudy-giuliani-ukraine-impeachment%2Findex.html
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tim_m
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« Reply #3488 on: October 11, 2019, 04:44:25 AM »

https://thehill.com/policy/international/europe/465312-giuliani-planned-to-fly-to-vienna-a-day-after-arrested-associates
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« Reply #3489 on: October 13, 2019, 09:40:39 AM »

https://www.axios.com/isis-detainees-northern-syria-turkey-kurdish-ec58db13-93c0-4c9c-8158-6d4b8dbb6e9c.html?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=organic


Raise your hand if you saw this coming.
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pilferk
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Marmite Militia, taking over one piece of toast at a time!!!


« Reply #3490 on: October 13, 2019, 12:26:18 PM »


*raises hand*
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« Reply #3491 on: October 15, 2019, 08:02:54 AM »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/politics/bolton-instructed-former-russia-adviser-to-talk-to-nsc-lawyer-over-ukraine.amp
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Senator Blutarsky
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« Reply #3492 on: October 16, 2019, 12:47:10 PM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....

Now Pelosi is saying she will not be holding a vote anytime soon.

She is totally going against precedent as impeachment investigations in the past (Presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton)  were all began after the full House voted to approve. 

Considering how this has all been handled so far, it really gives Republicans a reason to question the legitimacy of all if this.  It is much more of a political exercise.
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pilferk
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Marmite Militia, taking over one piece of toast at a time!!!


« Reply #3493 on: October 16, 2019, 02:13:08 PM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....

Now Pelosi is saying she will not be holding a vote anytime soon.

She is totally going against precedent as impeachment investigations in the past (Presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton)  were all began after the full House voted to approve. 

Considering how this has all been handled so far, it really gives Republicans a reason to question the legitimacy of all if this.  It is much more of a political exercise.

Like McConnell ignored precedent by changing the rules for approving Supreme Court Justices? Like Ryan ignored precedent by ignoring intelligence agency concerns in 2016? 

Every time the conservatives "ignore precedent" and change the rules, their voters say "there are consequences to elections" and "the majority makes the rules".

Well, then the majority makes the rules.  There is no mandated way for the House to open an inquiry.  And, in the case of Nixon, the inquiry began LONG before there was any vote in the house.  There is precedent for NOT voting right away, too.

I get it.  You have to really TRY to make things look illegitimate, because you can't actually defend his behavior.

They're doing exactly what the constitution allows them to do: Providing oversight of the executive branch in the manner they see fit, as strictly defined by the constitution.
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« Reply #3494 on: October 16, 2019, 02:41:48 PM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....

Now Pelosi is saying she will not be holding a vote anytime soon.

She is totally going against precedent as impeachment investigations in the past (Presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton)  were all began after the full House voted to approve. 

Considering how this has all been handled so far, it really gives Republicans a reason to question the legitimacy of all if this.  It is much more of a political exercise.

Like McConnell ignored precedent by changing the rules for approving Supreme Court Justices? Like Ryan ignored precedent by ignoring intelligence agency concerns in 2016? 

Every time the conservatives "ignore precedent" and change the rules, their voters say "there are consequences to elections" and "the majority makes the rules".

Well, then the majority makes the rules.  There is no mandated way for the House to open an inquiry.  And, in the case of Nixon, the inquiry began LONG before there was any vote in the house.  There is precedent for NOT voting right away, too.

I get it.  You have to really TRY to make things look illegitimate, because you can't actually defend his behavior.

They're doing exactly what the constitution allows them to do: Providing oversight of the executive branch in the manner they see fit, as strictly defined by the constitution.
It still amazes me anyone is even trying! There's been so much leaking out since the closed door testimony the other day.
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Senator Blutarsky
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« Reply #3495 on: October 16, 2019, 07:39:48 PM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....

Now Pelosi is saying she will not be holding a vote anytime soon.

She is totally going against precedent as impeachment investigations in the past (Presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton)  were all began after the full House voted to approve. 

Considering how this has all been handled so far, it really gives Republicans a reason to question the legitimacy of all if this.  It is much more of a political exercise.

Like McConnell ignored precedent by changing the rules for approving Supreme Court Justices? Like Ryan ignored precedent by ignoring intelligence agency concerns in 2016? 

Every time the conservatives "ignore precedent" and change the rules, their voters say "there are consequences to elections" and "the majority makes the rules".

Well, then the majority makes the rules.  There is no mandated way for the House to open an inquiry.  And, in the case of Nixon, the inquiry began LONG before there was any vote in the house.  There is precedent for NOT voting right away, too.

I get it.  You have to really TRY to make things look illegitimate, because you can't actually defend his behavior.

They're doing exactly what the constitution allows them to do: Providing oversight of the executive branch in the manner they see fit, as strictly defined by the constitution.

I wouldn't call what Schiff is doing as " oversight" His mind is made up &  he is trying to figure out a way to get there.

And McConnell was following the precedent Harry Reid set.
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« Reply #3496 on: October 16, 2019, 07:40:48 PM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....

Now Pelosi is saying she will not be holding a vote anytime soon.

She is totally going against precedent as impeachment investigations in the past (Presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton)  were all began after the full House voted to approve. 

Considering how this has all been handled so far, it really gives Republicans a reason to question the legitimacy of all if this.  It is much more of a political exercise.

Like McConnell ignored precedent by changing the rules for approving Supreme Court Justices? Like Ryan ignored precedent by ignoring intelligence agency concerns in 2016? 

Every time the conservatives "ignore precedent" and change the rules, their voters say "there are consequences to elections" and "the majority makes the rules".

Well, then the majority makes the rules.  There is no mandated way for the House to open an inquiry.  And, in the case of Nixon, the inquiry began LONG before there was any vote in the house.  There is precedent for NOT voting right away, too.

I get it.  You have to really TRY to make things look illegitimate, because you can't actually defend his behavior.

They're doing exactly what the constitution allows them to do: Providing oversight of the executive branch in the manner they see fit, as strictly defined by the constitution.
It still amazes me anyone is even trying! There's been so much leaking out since the closed door testimony the other day.

Why is it even closed door? You cant impeach a President with closed door testimony !
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« Reply #3497 on: October 16, 2019, 07:44:33 PM »

Every once in awhile we get bipartisanship in Washington. Even if it is for the wrong reasons. Ron Paul put the whole Syria thing in perspective. This is a good read, he is pretty spot on here  - https://www.fitsnews.com/2019/10/14/ron-paul-washington-is-wrong-about-the-kurds/

Ron Paul: Washington Is Wrong About The Kurds


“Another bipartisan ploy to keep the ‘forever war’ gravy train rolling …”



by RON PAUL || When President Trump Tweeted last week that “it is time for us to get out of these ridiculous endless wars,” adding that the US would be withdrawing from Syria, Washington went into a panic. Suddenly Republicans, Democrats, the media, the think tanks, and the war industry all discovered and quickly became experts on “the Kurds,” who we were told were an “ally” being sent to their slaughter by an ignorant President Trump.

But it was all just another bipartisan ploy to keep the “forever war” gravy train rolling through the Beltway.

Interventionists will do anything to prevent US troops from ever coming home, and their favorite tactic is promoting “mission creep.” As President Trump tweeted, we were told in 2014 by President Obama that the US military would go into Syria for just 30 days to save the Yazidi minority that they claimed were threatened. Then that mission crept into “we must fight ISIS” and so the US military continued to illegally occupy and bomb Syria for five more years.

Even though it was the Syrian army with its Russian and Iranian allies that did the bulk of the fighting against al-Qaeda and ISIS in Syria, President Trump took credit and called for the troops to come home. But when the military comes home, the military-industrial-Congressional-media complex loses its cash cow, so a new rationale had to be invented.

The latest “mission creep” was that we had to stay in Syria to save our “allies” the Kurds. All of a sudden our military presence in Syria was not about fighting terrorism but rather about putting US troops between our NATO ally Turkey and our proxy fighting force, the Kurds. Do they really want us to believe that it is “pro-American” for our troops to fight and die refereeing a long-standing dispute between the Turks and Kurds?

It was a colossally dumb idea to train and arm the Kurds in Syria in the first place, but after spending billions backing what turned out to be al-Qaeda affiliates in Syria to overthrow the Assad government, Washington found that the Kurds were the only willing boots remaining on the ground. While their interest in fighting ISIS was limited, they were happy to use Washington’s muscle in pursuit of their long-term goal of carving out a part of Syria (and eventually Turkey) for themselves.

We can never leave because there will be a slaughter, Washington claimed (and the media faithfully repeated). But once again, the politicians, the mainstream media, and the Beltway “experts” have been proven wrong. They never understand that sending US troops into another country without the proper authority is not a stabilizing factor, but a de-stabilizing factor. I have argued that were the US to leave Syria (and the rest of the Middle East) the countries of the region would find a way to solve their own problems.

Now that the US is pulling back from northern Syria, that is just what is happening.

On Sunday the Kurds and the Syrian government signed an agreement, brokered by the Russians, to put aside their differences and join together to defend against Turkey’s incursion into Syrian territory.

Now “our Kurdish allies” are fighting alongside the army of Syrian President Assad – who we are still told by US officials “must go.” Washington doesn’t understand that our intervention only makes matters worse. The best way to help the Kurds and everyone else in the region is to just come home.


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« Reply #3498 on: October 17, 2019, 03:24:36 AM »

Rep Lee Zeldin schools the media on the Volker testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI-U1NwrqLU

As we have seen a few times, the Republican "hot take" on testimony (or reports) isn't always super trustworthy.

I agree: Release the transcript.  But the text messages we have make me doubt, highly, the Repubs "take" is the truth.

I've no doubt there's material in there they can try to spin to their advantage....

Now Pelosi is saying she will not be holding a vote anytime soon.

She is totally going against precedent as impeachment investigations in the past (Presidents Andrew Johnson, Richard Nixon, and Bill Clinton)  were all began after the full House voted to approve. 

Considering how this has all been handled so far, it really gives Republicans a reason to question the legitimacy of all if this.  It is much more of a political exercise.

Like McConnell ignored precedent by changing the rules for approving Supreme Court Justices? Like Ryan ignored precedent by ignoring intelligence agency concerns in 2016? 

Every time the conservatives "ignore precedent" and change the rules, their voters say "there are consequences to elections" and "the majority makes the rules".

Well, then the majority makes the rules.  There is no mandated way for the House to open an inquiry.  And, in the case of Nixon, the inquiry began LONG before there was any vote in the house.  There is precedent for NOT voting right away, too.

I get it.  You have to really TRY to make things look illegitimate, because you can't actually defend his behavior.

They're doing exactly what the constitution allows them to do: Providing oversight of the executive branch in the manner they see fit, as strictly defined by the constitution.
It still amazes me anyone is even trying! There's been so much leaking out since the closed door testimony the other day.

Why is it even closed door? You cant impeach a President with closed door testimony !
To protect the witnesses perhaps? We are investigating the president. Let me guess you eye just fine when the Republicans did the same during Benghazi.
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« Reply #3499 on: October 17, 2019, 05:50:21 AM »

Elijah Cummings has passed.
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