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Author Topic: Donald Trump & 2016 Election  (Read 136359 times)
PermissionToLand
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« Reply #3180 on: July 27, 2019, 05:53:45 PM »


And the obvious counterargument here is:

He did say it. You didn't provide an opinion. Just a quote.  A quote isn't "fake news", even if it was clarified later. If anything, it's simply incomplete context.

And his clarification didn't exclude Trump, either.  It was just not SPECIFIC to Trump (though it was, in a wink wink nudge nudge way...because what else was the topic of conversation). That was his clarification: Yes, if a president commits a crime in office, he can be indicted after leaving office.  And....as Mueller clearly says during the hearing, some of the interactions and acts of obstruction would rise to the level of criminality.  I mean, you have to put 2 and 2 together, here...he's not shouting 4 to stay inside DOJ guidelines.

His point was that he couldn't indict a sitting president, his report didn't exonerate him, and there were precisely two ways to pursue justice in cases like this (independent of Trump...in all cases) according to DOJ guidelines:

1) Impeach
2) Indict once they are out of office.

The implication here is pretty clear.  His clarification was a CYA, since DOJ told him to stay in bounds of the report, and, as he said, they couldn't even consider indictment (which, of course, means they would have without the standing opinion).

As we both know, the Fake News is the news shouted by Trump, and parroted by conservatives, since Barr was allowed to give a dishonest summary of the report:  NO COLLUSION!!!!! NO OBSTRUCTION!!!!!

Absolutely, and I didn't know it had been later clarified, so there was no context for me to withhold. But of course, trying to explain something calmly like a rational adult is too much for ol' Sandman to grasp. He only sees the world in hyperbole and histrionics.

It is pretty ridiculous though, that Mueller wouldn't even read parts of his own report verbatim out loud. Saying "it's in the report" is one thing, but refusing to even corroborate what is in the report is just obtuse.

Also this whole "precedent" not to indict a sitting president traces back to nothing more than a DOJ memo from the Nixon administration, of all places. What a perversion of the entire concept of precedent, to follow that of the single most corrupt prior president on the subject of his accountability...
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« Reply #3181 on: July 27, 2019, 05:56:09 PM »


And the obvious counterargument here is:

He did say it. You didn't provide an opinion. Just a quote.  A quote isn't "fake news", even if it was clarified later. If anything, it's simply incomplete context.

And his clarification didn't exclude Trump, either.  It was just not SPECIFIC to Trump (though it was, in a wink wink nudge nudge way...because what else was the topic of conversation). That was his clarification: Yes, if a president commits a crime in office, he can be indicted after leaving office.  And....as Mueller clearly says during the hearing, some of the interactions and acts of obstruction would rise to the level of criminality.  I mean, you have to put 2 and 2 together, here...he's not shouting 4 to stay inside DOJ guidelines.

His point was that he couldn't indict a sitting president, his report didn't exonerate him, and there were precisely two ways to pursue justice in cases like this (independent of Trump...in all cases) according to DOJ guidelines:

1) Impeach
2) Indict once they are out of office.

The implication here is pretty clear.  His clarification was a CYA, since DOJ told him to stay in bounds of the report, and, as he said, they couldn't even consider indictment (which, of course, means they would have without the standing opinion).

As we both know, the Fake News is the news shouted by Trump, and parroted by conservatives, since Barr was allowed to give a dishonest summary of the report:  NO COLLUSION!!!!! NO OBSTRUCTION!!!!!




you WISH you could ignore me. and I certainly wish you could too, because you make this thread really boring.

Proving me right, yet again.

God, you're so sad. You couldn't even edit it to make it look like he was replying to you instead of me. How many times have you broken into his house to sniff his underwear this week?

He's just not into you. Time to let it go and move on, honey...

But hey, thanks for proving me right, yet again, about your being ignored by people as a result of your trolling behavior. And because you just can't stand that, you continue to attempt to troll them even when they are not relying to you.

I know, personal responsibility for your behavior is tough. Buck up, kiddo.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2019, 05:58:16 PM by PermissionToLand » Logged
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« Reply #3182 on: July 27, 2019, 10:21:54 PM »

Some good news for border security -

https://apnews.com/5d893d388c254c7fa83a1570112ae90e

High court allows use of Pentagon funds for border wall

United States Border Patrol officers return a group of migrants back to the Mexico side of the border as Mexican immigration officials check the list, in Nuevo Laredo, Mexico, Thursday, July 25, 2019. Mexico has received some 20,000 asylum seekers returned to await U.S. immigration court dates under the program colloquially known as "remain in Mexico." (AP Photo/Salvador Gonzalez)

WASHINGTON (AP) — The Supreme Court has cleared the way for the Trump administration to tap Pentagon funds to build sections of a border wall with Mexico.

The Supreme Court said Friday that it would lift a freeze on the money put in place by a lower court. The Supreme Court’s action means the Trump administration can tap the funds and begin work on four contracts it has awarded. Four liberal justices wouldn’t have allowed construction to start.

A trial court initially froze the funds in May and an appeals court kept that freeze in place earlier this month. The freeze had prevented the government from tapping approximately $2.5 billion in Defense Department money to replace existing sections of barrier in Arizona, California and New Mexico with more robust fencing.

Be happy, now.

This is going to come back to bite the conservatives in the ass when a dem president takes office and decides to reappropriate money for pet projects (like Single payor) on a whim. 

It's a precedent that circumvents Article 1s specification that only congress can appropriate money.

Partisanship has now completely undermined the constitution.  Checks and balances are now completely dead and congress is basically irrelevant.  The SC just neutered one of their singular powers of control on the Executive branch.
Yep, the slow moving coup is now almost complete. If Trump gets 4 not years, goodbye America, goodbye democracy. This is exactly why the Constitution setup 3 co-equal branches of government. So that no one branch could become more powerful. The scotus just destroyed checks and balances.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2019, 10:27:08 PM by tim_m » Logged
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« Reply #3183 on: August 01, 2019, 08:33:59 PM »

I came across this article the other day.  Yes, it's slate, so decidedly liberal.  But, that being said, it's an interesting take on the "Trump Economy", what some of the changes to the numbers from previous quarters mean (revised last week) and it's reliance on government spending for "growth". 

https://slate.com/business/2019/07/trump-gdp-report-economy.html?fbclid=IwAR3wh7jq8Mfr7_PaaBOCe6yCxjK_gYEjp0nDYVD-nfesFIlDQxk3eG9r284
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« Reply #3184 on: August 03, 2019, 02:31:54 AM »

I swear this buffoon we call president just cannot get out of his own way. If he would just shut up and do his job he would likely get a second term easily. His numbers were actually going up. He was up to 45%, then he started in on the 4 progressive congresswomen. Then he started eating his own picking fights with Fox News and now Cummings and Baltimore. Which brought him back down to 40%, essentially just his core base. You now are seeing a ton of Republican reps retiring, 9 overall and 6 in just the last two weeks with even more expected after the August recess. I think they are  are just fed up with trying to defend the indefensible. It seems like they are starting to see the writing on the wall that Trump could be in very big trouble in 2020. There's a very real possibility democrats take the Senate and increase their majority in the house. At this point i don't know if he is actively trying to sabotage himself or if he really is as dumb as i fear.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2019, 02:34:22 AM by tim_m » Logged
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« Reply #3185 on: August 03, 2019, 10:08:03 PM »

And now he mocked the burglary of Cummings rental home and gets chided by Nikki Haley, who gets chided by Kellyanne Conway and who violates the hatch act in the process again. Now before the senator and sandman point out the violation by am Obama official, in aware, but he admitted it, apologized and i believe even said he should've been fired. Conway is like big fucking deal.
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« Reply #3186 on: August 04, 2019, 01:03:49 AM »

The only crime infested shithole in the U.S. is the White House since 2016.
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« Reply #3187 on: August 04, 2019, 05:39:31 AM »

Two mass shootings in under 24 hours 29 dead and dozens injured and the third in a week. Is now the time to talk about gun laws?
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« Reply #3188 on: August 06, 2019, 12:15:43 AM »

The 7th Republican in 2 weeks and the 11th overall has now said they will retire. It's looking more and more likely the Democrats will increase their lead in the house. Coincidentally, the one that is retiring happens to be me rep.
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« Reply #3189 on: August 07, 2019, 07:58:16 AM »

The 7th Republican in 2 weeks and the 11th overall has now said they will retire. It's looking more and more likely the Democrats will increase their lead in the house. Coincidentally, the one that is retiring happens to be me rep.

The rampant racism and divisive rhetoric by Trump have come home to roost.  And his propensity for making it all about him (unless there's some sort of blame for him to share) is starting to tick people off.

His approval ratings are sinking like a stone right now (again).  His own party is starting to call him on his rhetoric (slowly).  There's even some Repubs who are suddenly talking about supporting some make sense gun legislation after the shootings this weekend.

I'm hoping that reason is starting to prevail and the hangover effect is about to kick in for the Repubs. But I'm not all that optimistic.  We'll see....
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« Reply #3190 on: August 07, 2019, 09:01:37 AM »

The 7th Republican in 2 weeks and the 11th overall has now said they will retire. It's looking more and more likely the Democrats will increase their lead in the house. Coincidentally, the one that is retiring happens to be me rep.

The rampant racism and divisive rhetoric by Trump have come home to roost.  And his propensity for making it all about him (unless there's some sort of blame for him to share) is starting to tick people off.

His approval ratings are sinking like a stone right now (again).  His own party is starting to call him on his rhetoric (slowly).  There's even some Repubs who are suddenly talking about supporting some make sense gun legislation after the shootings this weekend.

I'm hoping that reason is starting to prevail and the hangover effect is about to kick in for the Repubs. But I'm not all that optimistic.  We'll see....

He just can't get out of his own way. He was up around 46%. I've never seen a president so adept at shooting himself in the foot. Now it seems to be taking a real toll. Several Republicans are starting to call him out for his rhetoric and they're starting announce retirement in quick succession.
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« Reply #3191 on: August 08, 2019, 08:53:14 AM »

Two mass shootings in under 24 hours 29 dead and dozens injured and the third in a week. Is now the time to talk about gun laws?

Here ya go - Trump Says He Wants Background Checks. Here’s Why That Will Be Hard.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2019/08/05/trump-says-he-wants-background-checks-heres-why-that-will-be-hard/#41dc6d724783

Whether it be gun reform or immigration, making progress on either is close to impossible due to our dysfunctional government.

Apparently it was enough to piss the NRA off. - Trump warned by NRA over background checks

https://www.greenwichtime.com/news/article/Trump-warned-by-NRA-over-background-checks-14288843.php

Sorry, but looking into the background of a potential gun buyer isn't infringing on 2nd amendment rights. Also, no one needs a 100 round magazine unless they want to take out other humans. You dont need more than 20 shots to take out a deer, if you do you suck at hunting and probably should give it up an look into fishing. But trying to take guns away from people who legally bought a gun just because a politician deems it an " assault weapon "  is.  The Democrats need to define  what exactly an " assault weapon" is other than keeping it vague so they can continue using it as a political talking point. They shouldn't be using these tragedies as a political tool. Are they talking about all semi-automatics? Or hunting rifles that are semi automatic and have spooky & scary stock designs?

I'm all for gun reform as long as you are not infringing on the 2nd amendment rights of law abiding citizens who do not have a history of being a criminal or mental illness. 



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« Reply #3192 on: August 08, 2019, 02:37:50 PM »

FYI- if anyone ever threatens you and you manage to record it, dont post it on Twitter because they may lock your account. 
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« Reply #3193 on: August 08, 2019, 08:26:47 PM »

Two mass shootings in under 24 hours 29 dead and dozens injured and the third in a week. Is now the time to talk about gun laws?

Here ya go - Trump Says He Wants Background Checks. Here’s Why That Will Be Hard.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2019/08/05/trump-says-he-wants-background-checks-heres-why-that-will-be-hard/#41dc6d724783

Whether it be gun reform or immigration, making progress on either is close to impossible due to our dysfunctional government.

Then bring it to the floor of the Senate (because it already passed the house as HR8) and make people vote against it.

If Moscow Mitch refuses to do that, he should be voted out of office.  And he's a fucking dickhead

Quote
Apparently it was enough to piss the NRA off. - Trump warned by NRA over background checks

https://www.greenwichtime.com/news/article/Trump-warned-by-NRA-over-background-checks-14288843.php

Good.  I'm glad they're pissed off.  The Republicans need to ween themselves off NRA money, and dependence on NRA approval.  If they don't, they should be voted out of office.  And they're dickheads.

The truth is, if they all flip the NRA the bird, and vote their conscience, what's the NRA going to do? Lobby nobody? Donate to nobody?

OK, well, then that would be the end of the NRA.  And they know it.  It's bluster and brinksmanship, and the NRA wins every time.

Maybe the Repubs should show some backbone...because in reality, the NRA needs the Republican votes at least as much (and maybe more) than the Repubs need the NRAs money.

If they all stand up, the NRA is going to have no choice but to fucking take it.

Quote
Sorry, but looking into the background of a potential gun buyer isn't infringing on 2nd amendment rights. Also, no one needs a 100 round magazine unless they want to take out other humans. You dont need more than 20 shots to take out a deer, if you do you suck at hunting and probably should give it up an look into fishing.

Agreed!

Quote
But trying to take guns away from people who legally bought a gun just because a politician deems it an " assault weapon "  is. 

And it's a good thing nobody is doing that.  NOBODY IS SUGGESTING THAT THE GOVERNMENT TAKE GUNS YOU OWN AWAY FROM  YOU.

They are suggesting that it should be illegal to sell them, going forward.

So, if you have one....you get to keep it (unless you want to trade it in, in a government run gun buyback program, which gets you bank from the government!)

If someone tells you the Dems are coming to take your guns, laugh at them, roll your eyes, and realize you are being lied to.

And, just FYI, the Supreme Court has ruled on this 4 times.  It is NOT unconstitutional to institute limits on what kinds of ordinance are sold.  And I promise you, you actually agree with this.  Because I bet you dollars to donuts you think it should be illegal to buy land mines, rocket launchers, grenades, and other explosive ordinance/guns.  You just disagree where the line should be drawn.....

Quote
The Democrats need to define  what exactly an " assault weapon" is other than keeping it vague so they can continue using it as a political talking point. They shouldn't be using these tragedies as a political tool. Are they talking about all semi-automatics? Or hunting rifles that are semi automatic and have spooky & scary stock designs?

They have.  There's been a legal definition of the assault rifle since the Clinton years, when they banned them (along with other assault weapons like semiauto shot guns).  Look it up.  I provided it here, long ago, in this very thread.  There is a VERY specific definition, with very specific parameters, and even a very specific list of examples/specifically banned weapons.  It exists already.

So, objection addressed!

Quote
I'm all for gun reform as long as you are not infringing on the 2nd amendment rights of law abiding citizens who do not have a history of being a criminal or mental illness. 

I'm a gun owner and a staunch supporter of the 2nd amendment.  But the second amendment is actually pretty clear that there can be restriction placed on WHAT weapons and guns can be owned by the "well regulated militia".

Reinstate the Clinton assault weapons ban.  Ban magazines over 20 rounds. I'd even say 15...if you can't hit a dear...or more likely a bear with an armalite long rifle because you would turn a dear into swiss cheeses...and kill it with 15 rounds from an AR...I agree with you. You suck and should take up bird watching or fishing or  (possibly) something that doesn't require you to see and aim.  I weep for that persons toilet.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2019, 08:34:19 PM by pilferk » Logged

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« Reply #3194 on: August 08, 2019, 08:51:55 PM »

FYI- if anyone ever threatens you and you manage to record it, dont post it on Twitter because they may lock your account. 

For like 3 hours.  To get Moscow Mitch to agree to let them take the video down.  It incites violence (against him, but still).  It's a clear violation of their TOS. He could have tweeted ABOUT it, and not put up the video, and he would have been fine

I've seen tons of that exact kind of activity from twitter on both sides of the aisle.  Videos like that get your account suspended until you agree to take them down (unless you're POTUS).  And once you do, suspension lifted.

« Last Edit: August 09, 2019, 06:20:18 AM by pilferk » Logged

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« Reply #3195 on: August 10, 2019, 10:40:18 AM »

Epstein found dead in his cell of a "supposed' suicide.
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« Reply #3196 on: August 11, 2019, 09:19:24 AM »

Epstein found dead in his cell of a "supposed' suicide.

Calling this fishy is a huge understatement. The victims will now never get to confront him in court. My money is on someone took him out because he knew too much about the behaviors of influential and powerful individuals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7345589/Epsteins-guards-didnt-follow-procedure-check-cell-30-minutes.html


Jeffrey Epstein's guards 'did NOT check his cell according to procedure' the night he hanged himself - as pictures show his body being wheeled into hospital amid outrage he has escaped justice

- Jeffrey Epstein was found hanged in his prison cell at Metropolitan Correctional Center on Saturday morning
-  Source has claimed guards at the jail did not follow procedure and check inmates every 30 minutes overnight
- Epstein, 66, was briefly hospitalized on July 24 after being found semi-conscious on the floor of his jail cell
- He had been removed from suicide watch by the time of his death, which has sparked widespread anger
- AG Will Barr has ordered both the FBI and the Inspector General to open investigations into death
- Suicide comes 24 hours after court documents were unsealed implicating powerful men in sex scandals
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« Reply #3197 on: August 11, 2019, 10:39:41 PM »

Epstein found dead in his cell of a "supposed' suicide.

Calling this fishy is a huge understatement. The victims will now never get to confront him in court. My money is on someone took him out because he knew too much about the behaviors of influential and powerful individuals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7345589/Epsteins-guards-didnt-follow-procedure-check-cell-30-minutes.html


Jeffrey Epstein's guards 'did NOT check his cell according to procedure' the night he hanged himself - as pictures show his body being wheeled into hospital amid outrage he has escaped justice

- Jeffrey Epstein was found hanged in his prison cell at Metropolitan Correctional Center on Saturday morning
-  Source has claimed guards at the jail did not follow procedure and check inmates every 30 minutes overnight
- Epstein, 66, was briefly hospitalized on July 24 after being found semi-conscious on the floor of his jail cell
- He had been removed from suicide watch by the time of his death, which has sparked widespread anger
- AG Will Barr has ordered both the FBI and the Inspector General to open investigations into death
- Suicide comes 24 hours after court documents were unsealed implicating powerful men in sex scandals

Yeah, i hate that his victims now can never have the closure they deserve. It's extremely fishy. The gusta eye apparently working extreme overtime but that's no excuse for not checking on him. He was no longer on suicide watch though from what I've read. I think q better question to ask is how many people got to him? I'm betting on a collaborative effort from powerful people in both sides. Hopefully all still comes out. We still have the victims to name names.
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« Reply #3198 on: August 13, 2019, 11:53:22 PM »

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/457344-cuccinelli-statue-of-liberty-poem-refers-to-people-from-europe?rnd=1565753368

Wow they're not even trying to hide their racism anymore.
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« Reply #3199 on: August 16, 2019, 06:08:36 AM »

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/netanyahu-considers-blocking-omar-tlaib-from-entering-israel-ahead-of-a-planned-weekend-visit/2019/08/15/d69983ce-d15b-4074-8590-c6f69bd4a084_story.html

And it just keeps getting worse... at what point is a line crossed too much for the trumpians to give up the ghost?
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