September 23rd 2017. Rock In Rio, Rio De Janeiro, Brazil

[GypsySoul]

Jeez, some of you guys are a bit defensive of Axl... No singer is going to sound as good almost 2 years into a tour, as they did at the beginning. It's okay.

Guess you missed the post by the fan who was actually there.  I copy n' pasted it here so you don't have to search the entire page to find it 6 posts above yours:

What does being there in person have to do with anything? That's a red herring. If anything, you can more clearly make out each instrument/vocals on a good recording as opposed to live. If you're going to say his voice didn't split on the high notes in Better, frankly, you're in denial. He needs a break before he damages his voice. But he's never stopped before and that's precisely the reason he has trouble with his voice.

There's being a fan, and then there's being a sycophant.

"Don't hail me and don't idolize the ink, or I've failed in my intentions..."

Being there in person has everything to do with it!!!  Axl himself has said over and over that he does it for the audience in front of him.

If you believe that watching this (or any show) on your laptop is the same as experiencing it in person then you're the one in denial.

A good example of this is that if you watch the feed, you could barely hear the 100,000+ crowd but heard the band clearly (albeit sometimes a little too clearly).  If you listen to the twitter stories feeds that Fernando posted, you could barely hear the band but could clearly hear the crowd.  And with the admitted technical difficulties going on, who knows what the band was hearing or not hearing.

I love watching the periscopes/facebook live feeds/etc. because it does give you (me) a glimpse into what the live audience is experiencing, warts and all.  But to believe that comes anywhere close to what the actual audience is experiencing is a fallacy.  99.999% of the time, the opinion of the experience by the person attending the show is by far the better gauge... unless of course, it's my opinion and then that's the one that's 100% correct.

As far as what you consider Axl having trouble with his voice, outside of that time he had the allergic reaction to the little people onstage in London and couldn't finish the show, isn't it the general consensus that his voice actually gets stronger as the tour goes on?  Needing to take a break??  They just had 2 weeks off!!!  Break time over!!!  Back to work!!!

And I believe it's been a long standing hope/wish/dream of the fans that before/during/after the tour, the band goes into the studio so we get a new album!  Since you believe Axl needs to take a break and rest his voice, do you also believe he should put any possible recording sessions off until he recovers from these alleged troubles?  (I'll answer for you)... FUCK NO!!!  Why?  Because just like watching/listening on a laptop is very different from the live experience, the studio sessions are also a very different experience than a live performance.   

And as for the hail n' idolizing thing, experiencing GNR live n' in person ... hot dang that boy is mesmerizing!!!

 

[Ali]

Jeez, some of you guys are a bit defensive of Axl... No singer is going to sound as good almost 2 years into a tour, as they did at the beginning. It's okay.

Guess you missed the post by the fan who was actually there.  I copy n' pasted it here so you don't have to search the entire page to find it 6 posts above yours:

What does being there in person have to do with anything? That's a red herring. If anything, you can more clearly make out each instrument/vocals on a good recording as opposed to live. If you're going to say his voice didn't split on the high notes in Better, frankly, you're in denial. He needs a break before he damages his voice. But he's never stopped before and that's precisely the reason he has trouble with his voice.

There's being a fan, and then there's being a sycophant.

"Don't hail me and don't idolize the ink, or I've failed in my intentions..."

I thought he was pushing himself a little too much during the breakdown in "Better", but he settled in afterwards. He doesn't need a break. Your ad hominem attack doesn't facilitate a productive conversation.

Ali

[ITARocker]

2011 was a 0 performance, everything is better than that, even me singing under the shower. 2001 was different but "better" in a sense, if we think it was a new band and their 2nd live performance. This performance is weak if we think about 2016 and firsts gigs of 2017... He definitely should take a break, i think its pretty normal...2 years of heavy touring kill everyone. Clean voice is weak, drive voice cracks a lot, screams are shorter & shorter... I dont know why rock in rio performances always have to suck balls since the 90s anyway 

Guess you missed the post by the fan who was actually there.  I copy n' pasted it here so you don't have to search the entire page to find it 6 posts above yours:

Wow what a ride! By far the longest GNR concert I ever been...and the best!!!
Axl voice sounded good from an audience standpoint, however there's been a lot of critics and bashing in the social media from the people that watched from the TV as usual....no fucks given as Duff says! For the 100k people that were actually there the vibe was amazing. Axl was in a great mood, the reported technical issues were not noticeable...i noticed some screw ups during DTJ beggining but the band were laughing at it! For fucks sake, this is rock n roll!

Axl wearing a local culture hat by the end of the concert was graet, people loved it!

I thought that The Who would join them on stage but unfortunetly that didnt happen. It was almost 4AM local time when they played The Seeker so my guess is that the old guys were already sleeping 

I've been in Imola and the show was still great... I mean not "perfect" (mainly because of frank) but great. And it was just 3 months ago, I just sense this is a fast falldown.. Even if i noticed that Axl was startin' to struggle a little and his voice cracking the pa system smacked in my face his voice and that's ok, it's cool cause it's what u wanna hear. And when you see videos on yt the voice is a bit different yes, but not that much, just less power.  But if he keeps on touring this way we'll have a full mickey mouse in 6 months and i don't know how long will it take this time to rest his voice. Wonder if he would tour with ac dc next year what is going to happen, ac dc fanbase is not that sympathetic (while he can rest on his laurel with gnr fans). At this point he can't replicate those 2016 beast performances (god bless him for those shows ) i mean everybody needs a rest just hope they wont add new shows and after this tour he will stop a little and then go to record something with slash & co. not starting another tour..

[allwaystired]

This show seems to be getting an absolute panning from many other places. Everything I've read has pretty much been a criticism- reviews in Brazil seem to all mention how poor Axl was. Having seen all this, I'm a little reluctant to seek it out.

Is the negative reaction it's getting justified in others opinion? Has the heavy touring schedule been too much maybe?

[allwaystired]

......just watched Coma. Wish I hadn't.

I'm chalking this up to an 'off night' because what I just watched was sloppy as fuck.

[zombux]

from what I've checked so far, they butchered the thing heavily (again). a bunch of tired aging guys, mostly looking bored or not really giving a shit. frequently out of sync (but this can be due tech issues, I admit). lead guitarist seems especially bored, frontman's vocals are extremely weak. the whole thing looks like a powered-off cover version, a bizarre caricature of itself during their heydays. especially the more complex songs sound embarassing. this is bad. compared to the first 2016 shows or the first shows from US tour 2016, this is much much weaker, not even talking about older shows, which now seem like from other galaxy. maybe if they just stripped down the setlist and do something like "AFD era setlists nostalgy revival with 1,5 hours duration", it would work better, but it seems obvious that they're increasingly less able to play the complex UYI and ChiDem era stuff. but I guess that wouldn't be such a huge profit... 

[suicide]

I wonder if they planned on playing New Rose since it's title appears at the start of This I Love.

Not their best performance but it's always great to see a pro-shot!

[(t)]

This show seems to be getting an absolute panning from many other places. Everything I've read has pretty much been a criticism- reviews in Brazil seem to all mention how poor Axl was. Having seen all this, I'm a little reluctant to seek it out.

Is the negative reaction it's getting justified in others opinion? Has the heavy touring schedule been too much maybe?

IMO songs like Civil War, Don't Cry, Estranged and ChiDem are worth checking out. Good performances. I think Axl's voice was bothering him this night. Low rasp was really good, but the higher rasp was giving out on him and he was trying to adjust on the fly. Kinda think this was messing up his pacing as well. As mentioned, there were also technical issues and some general out-of-sync-ness with the band.

Some of the last shows before the break just a few weeks ago (Vancouver for example) were really strong performances so it's hard to say whether it's touring schedule, or just an off night.

[D-GenerationX]

You people have to realize that we are used to Axl's weaker voice.  General public, not so much.

Think of it like this.  Just this past weekend, I called up the Paris PPV show on my iPod.  Compared to that, Axl in 2017 is a pretty pale imitation of what people think of.

It's all about context and expectation.

[russkwtx]

......just watched Coma. Wish I hadn't.

I'm chalking this up to an 'off night' because what I just watched was sloppy as fuck.

I must say that Coma was the weakest song in what was otherwise a GREAT concert in Denver August 2017. Everything was out of sync and the lyrics were unintelligible.

Maybe they should drop that from the setlist and put in TWAT or something else from CD. I really liked Shacklers live when they played it in 2014.

[slash&axl]

Last night was an off night for sure.
We were here in 2011 after that fiasco but that was a struggling band as it stands in 2017 Guns N' Roses are the most successful rock band i the world. I've been to 8 reunion shows over since the reunion and the band have been great and it's even been reported in the media that Guns n' Roses have been getting nothing but good reviews all tour.
What's so sour about this show is that it's unfortunately the only concert we all got to join in and watch live together and was possibly one of the worst shows of the tour. Since the band started to increase the length of show the performance it seems fatigue has set in.
On top of this the band seemed to have had  trouble hearing themselves (typical of festivals in general) which led to unusual mistakes by Fortus and Duff.
The whole band seemed to have an off night

But I have witnessed some amazing concerts on this tour and I would be as critical as any of you if it was bad AxL on 'Yesterdays' seem like he's going through the motions this tour

Maybe the band just need to release an official dvd from one of the 2016 shows, that will satisfy some doubters. But I think at the end of the day we have to take into account that a voice is fragile and sometimes there is nothing you can do about it, but at least admit Axl has had many amazing moments vocally on this tour.
 
It could be the climate in Brazil, a bad IEM or just age, either way Axl knows this more than anyone he can critique himself. Maybe shorter tours is the answer or shorter shows? Maybe Axl needs to stop running around so much? We can't bash this whole reunion based on one show.

Hopefully they take this band into the studio in 2018 because that's where it really matters at the end of the day its all about composing great songs. Live is secondary to studio but i understand now it's all we have.

[Ali]

I am reading tremendous overreaction and hyperbole. He sounded just fine two weeks ago in San Antonio. Some things never change on the GN'R message boards.

Ali

[Ali]

2011 was a 0 performance, everything is better than that, even me singing under the shower. 2001 was different but "better" in a sense, if we think it was a new band and their 2nd live performance. This performance is weak if we think about 2016 and firsts gigs of 2017... He definitely should take a break, i think its pretty normal...2 years of heavy touring kill everyone. Clean voice is weak, drive voice cracks a lot, screams are shorter & shorter... I dont know why rock in rio performances always have to suck balls since the 90s anyway 

Guess you missed the post by the fan who was actually there.  I copy n' pasted it here so you don't have to search the entire page to find it 6 posts above yours:

Wow what a ride! By far the longest GNR concert I ever been...and the best!!!
Axl voice sounded good from an audience standpoint, however there's been a lot of critics and bashing in the social media from the people that watched from the TV as usual....no fucks given as Duff says! For the 100k people that were actually there the vibe was amazing. Axl was in a great mood, the reported technical issues were not noticeable...i noticed some screw ups during DTJ beggining but the band were laughing at it! For fucks sake, this is rock n roll!

Axl wearing a local culture hat by the end of the concert was graet, people loved it!

I thought that The Who would join them on stage but unfortunetly that didnt happen. It was almost 4AM local time when they played The Seeker so my guess is that the old guys were already sleeping 

I've been in Imola and the show was still great... I mean not "perfect" (mainly because of frank) but great. And it was just 3 months ago, I just sense this is a fast falldown.. Even if i noticed that Axl was startin' to struggle a little and his voice cracking the pa system smacked in my face his voice and that's ok, it's cool cause it's what u wanna hear. And when you see videos on yt the voice is a bit different yes, but not that much, just less power.  But if he keeps on touring this way we'll have a full mickey mouse in 6 months and i don't know how long will it take this time to rest his voice. Wonder if he would tour with ac dc next year what is going to happen, ac dc fanbase is not that sympathetic (while he can rest on his laurel with gnr fans). At this point he can't replicate those 2016 beast performances (god bless him for those shows ) i mean everybody needs a rest just hope they wont add new shows and after this tour he will stop a little and then go to record something with slash & co. not starting another tour..

He should fire Ron Anderson and hire you!   

Ali

[PermissionToLand]

Being there in person has everything to do with it!!!  Axl himself has said over and over that he does it for the audience in front of him.

If you believe that watching this (or any show) on your laptop is the same as experiencing it in person then you're the one in denial.

A good example of this is that if you watch the feed, you could barely hear the 100,000+ crowd but heard the band clearly (albeit sometimes a little too clearly).  If you listen to the twitter stories feeds that Fernando posted, you could barely hear the band but could clearly hear the crowd.  And with the admitted technical difficulties going on, who knows what the band was hearing or not hearing.

I love watching the periscopes/facebook live feeds/etc. because it does give you (me) a glimpse into what the live audience is experiencing, warts and all.  But to believe that comes anywhere close to what the actual audience is experiencing is a fallacy.  99.999% of the time, the opinion of the experience by the person attending the show is by far the better gauge... unless of course, it's my opinion and then that's the one that's 100% correct.

As far as what you consider Axl having trouble with his voice, outside of that time he had the allergic reaction to the little people onstage in London and couldn't finish the show, isn't it the general consensus that his voice actually gets stronger as the tour goes on?  Needing to take a break??  They just had 2 weeks off!!!  Break time over!!!  Back to work!!!

And I believe it's been a long standing hope/wish/dream of the fans that before/during/after the tour, the band goes into the studio so we get a new album!  Since you believe Axl needs to take a break and rest his voice, do you also believe he should put any possible recording sessions off until he recovers from these alleged troubles?  (I'll answer for you)... FUCK NO!!!  Why?  Because just like watching/listening on a laptop is very different from the live experience, the studio sessions are also a very different experience than a live performance.

Oookay then...

Whoever he is "doing it for", doesn't change how he sounds from one person to the next.  If he puts in extra effort for the crowd, it is audible to everyone, not just those in person. You are aware that the people watching at home are not in an alternate universe where he did not put in extra effort, correct? Am I going to have to get into metaphysics to explain how reality works?

I very clearly stated that it is NOT the same listening to a recording as it is live, I said it is CLEARER on record. Maybe read what I say before responding?

The rest of your comment digresses into irrelevance that does not even make sense. What does hearing the crowd have to do with the band's performance?

IDK what the general consensus is around here (and I don't put stock in general consensus anyway), but I'll tell you that any vocal coach or physiologist would laugh their damn ass off at the idea that the voice gets stronger with abuse (which is what singing is, especially Axl's style). And it's pretty clear to me that Axl sounded great in 2010-2011 and then lost it when he kept touring until 2014. The two year break allowed him to recover and sound good in 2016, but now he's losing it again.

The short break may have helped Axl somewhat, but the rest of the band was clearly rusty for it. You can't blame sound issues for Slash forgetting the chords at a few points. You can't blame sound issues for Axl's voice cracking on Better, which it has been doing recently anyway, even at shows with no issues.

If you would like an album recorded with his voice being shot after a long tour, you would be the only buyer, I assure you that. The studio environment can allow more controlled environmental conditions, but that can only have so much effect. Drinking green tea and going line by line can only help so much if your voice is shot. Unless you want them to digitally repair his voice with autotune and other tricks. So if they are going to record an album, FUCK YES I want that official recording (which will be set in stone for those songs for the rest of time) to be the absolute best performance possible. Why in the hell would anybody not?

And my band has played live and recorded in studios, so it's pretty clear to me these are just weak excuses. Frankly, it sounds like you have no idea what you are talking about. I would love to hear some actual specific details on how it's different live, if you can actually provide a single one instead of just repeating it over and over as if it were incontrovertible fact simply because you say it.

I thought he was pushing himself a little too much during the breakdown in "Better", but he settled in afterwards. He doesn't need a break. Your ad hominem attack doesn't facilitate a productive conversation.

That wasn't the only time his voice cracked. And maybe you read it that way, but it was not an insult and I did not call him a sycophant. Essentially, I was saying "check yourself". Which is as much of an ad hominem insult as him saying that the opinion of anyone who was not there is invalid. How does that facilitate productive discussion?

And let me be clear, I am not "bashing" the band. But as I said, I am not a sycophant and will not delude myself into thinking they don't make mistakes. This is simply calling a spade a spade, being a realist.

[ITARocker]

2011 was a 0 performance, everything is better than that, even me singing under the shower. 2001 was different but "better" in a sense, if we think it was a new band and their 2nd live performance. This performance is weak if we think about 2016 and firsts gigs of 2017... He definitely should take a break, i think its pretty normal...2 years of heavy touring kill everyone. Clean voice is weak, drive voice cracks a lot, screams are shorter & shorter... I dont know why rock in rio performances always have to suck balls since the 90s anyway 

Guess you missed the post by the fan who was actually there.  I copy n' pasted it here so you don't have to search the entire page to find it 6 posts above yours:

Wow what a ride! By far the longest GNR concert I ever been...and the best!!!
Axl voice sounded good from an audience standpoint, however there's been a lot of critics and bashing in the social media from the people that watched from the TV as usual....no fucks given as Duff says! For the 100k people that were actually there the vibe was amazing. Axl was in a great mood, the reported technical issues were not noticeable...i noticed some screw ups during DTJ beggining but the band were laughing at it! For fucks sake, this is rock n roll!

Axl wearing a local culture hat by the end of the concert was graet, people loved it!

I thought that The Who would join them on stage but unfortunetly that didnt happen. It was almost 4AM local time when they played The Seeker so my guess is that the old guys were already sleeping 

I've been in Imola and the show was still great... I mean not "perfect" (mainly because of frank) but great. And it was just 3 months ago, I just sense this is a fast falldown.. Even if i noticed that Axl was startin' to struggle a little and his voice cracking the pa system smacked in my face his voice and that's ok, it's cool cause it's what u wanna hear. And when you see videos on yt the voice is a bit different yes, but not that much, just less power.  But if he keeps on touring this way we'll have a full mickey mouse in 6 months and i don't know how long will it take this time to rest his voice. Wonder if he would tour with ac dc next year what is going to happen, ac dc fanbase is not that sympathetic (while he can rest on his laurel with gnr fans). At this point he can't replicate those 2016 beast performances (god bless him for those shows ) i mean everybody needs a rest just hope they wont add new shows and after this tour he will stop a little and then go to record something with slash & co. not starting another tour..

He should fire Ron Anderson and hire you!   

Ali

Well i think he could hire you Mr Browntongue. Yes Axl, very good, yes yes yes my lord, yes yes, yes i wil do it on my knees, yes yes.

Anderson teached him how to sing with the right technique and how to preserve his voice...But even athletes train, have the rigth meal etc and then....crack...their muscles fuck up anyway.. Use your fuckin brain sometimes. It's not a matter of what u do, it's a matter of what it is. And actually his voice is almost shot, wanted or not. And it's funny, cause we've been in the same situation many times trough the years and still you have to learn how to distinguish between ax'ls good singing and axl's shit singing

[rebelhipi]

Last night was an off night for sure.
We were here in 2011 after that fiasco but that was a struggling band

Hell no.

[allwaystired]

I'd say we need to be concerned. The band looked absolutely knackered at RIR. Not just Axl, all of them- they looked to me like a band who desperately need a break from touring.

See how the next show goes, but the idea of them doing another 30 odd shows is to me, a bit worrying.

I'm not really criticizing the band here- it is what it is. 2 years of being on the road is a lot, even for a band half their age.

I'm sure the people there had a great time- and I really hope they did. For those of us not caught up in the atmosphere, watching it a bit more objectively, it doesn't look good. My housemate asked what I was watching and had a look for a few minutes. His reaction was "and you paid money to watch this?" I could argue that he probably hasn't clapped his eyes on a live performance by the band ever, but it still stung a bit. I want people to look at this band and go "wow- they're good live." Not a laugh and a few jokes at the quality of the performance. Take a show from a few months ago and then this one- no contest.

As I said above, hopefully this was a one off. A bad night.  To me though, it does look like a band in sore need of some serious time off, and I just hope the fact they're not getting it until December doesn't do damage to anything more longterm.

[AdZ]

Some of you guys really know how to put a downer on something very cool.

Would hate to go to your birthday parties...

[allwaystired]

Some of you guys really know how to put a downer on something very cool.

Would hate to go to your birthday parties...

Would you say RIR was cool though? I found it really hard to watch.

[AdZ]

Then I don't really know how to help you...