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tim_m
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« Reply #620 on: September 18, 2020, 04:19:18 PM »

Wow, watching Trump speeches are pure fucking comedy. He just repeats the same bullshit and lies over and over again.

God if I have to watch another one.  I can't even laugh.  Feel like Alice Through the Looking Glass.
I'm trying to watch to be fair to both candidates but my god he's a train wreck.
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pilferk
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« Reply #621 on: September 18, 2020, 04:19:29 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

So you dont think its worthwhile to address the other 45%...a sizeable minority? A minority heavily populated by the type of blue collar worker in and around the Scranton area? One that Trump appealed to in 2016, and Biden is courting in 2020? Thats strange thinking, imho.

As for sharing their profits, I am talking more in line with their workers.

If they wont pay their employees a living wage....and then expect the government to cover the difference in social programs....then they need to bear an increased tax burden to offset their dereliction in wages. You cant have it both ways: unfettered corporate greed combined with an irresponsible tax code. Right now, its corporate wellfare. They get to hoard everything, while we pay for their workers to get government assistance .

They are robber barons.

I am all for capitalism. But capitalism was built on exactly the principal that the free market supported itself. Not that the government had to step in to support corporate profiteerng via secondary wage (and food, and health care) support.

Thats what I mean by them refusing to share thair profits. Record corporate profits and stagnant wage growth...and growing poverty. Its unsustainable.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2020, 04:27:05 PM by pilferk » Logged

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« Reply #622 on: September 18, 2020, 04:20:12 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.
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cineater
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« Reply #623 on: September 18, 2020, 04:24:44 PM »

Speculation going towards he would be a puppet president for the real people running the Democratic party.

Who exactly do you think are the "real people running the Democratic party"?

I guess baseless speculation is the new political commentary...  Roll Eyes

“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.” 

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

"As of 2013, the top 10% own 81% of stock wealth"

https://www.npr.org/2017/03/01/517975766/while-trump-touts-stock-market-many-americans-left-out-of-the-conversation

I was commenting on what people are saying to me.  I wondered that too.  When I ask who are the real people behind all this, no names just those rich people with money.  People who are giving "dark money".  I ask what they want and the answer is more money.  Occasionally, I get the Russians and Chinese.  They either want our economy or to get us out of the way of their control of the world.

This where I usually start tuning politics out.  I'm naive in their eyes and I think they are fucking crazy.  Have to say if it hadn't been for Trump, I would have tuned out politics over the last 4 years like I normally do.  As it is I've been paying more attention all this time.  I hope the rest of the voters are doing the same and show up to show they are interested in what our politicians are doing.
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« Reply #624 on: September 18, 2020, 04:34:08 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

I freak out over that.  Every time a politician opens their mouth they are talking cutting taxes.  My state hasn't raised taxes since the 70's and they want to cut more.  The lacking funds all over state departments show.  All this stimulus money.  It's not like we have a saving account.  How are the tax payers paying for that?
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« Reply #625 on: September 18, 2020, 04:45:12 PM »

My big ticket item is kind of missing from all the politics this time around.  It's the single parent headed households and the number of children living in or close to poverty.  Think when the census data comes in that number is going to show a big increase.  Feel a lot of societies problems get started at that point.
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« Reply #626 on: September 18, 2020, 05:03:38 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

Wait, I thought most of those blue collar employers switch their pension plans to one of those 401 programs.  They pay into that for you.  I know my 401 employer program and a couple of other people's programs are put into the stock market along with some safe investments.  If they have a pension plan, they're in the market whether they know it or not.

These long threads are so confusing.  Makes it hard to talk to each other. 
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« Reply #627 on: September 18, 2020, 05:04:28 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

I freak out over that.  Every time a politician opens their mouth they are talking cutting taxes.  My state hasn't raised taxes since the 70's and they want to cut more.  The lacking funds all over state departments show.  All this stimulus money.  It's not like we have a saving account.  How are the tax payers paying for that?

I'm glad my mom's boyfriends company didn't decide to do this, so that he wouldn't get socked with a huge tax bill that we wouldn't be able to afford.
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tim_m
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« Reply #628 on: September 18, 2020, 05:09:29 PM »

My big ticket item is kind of missing from all the politics this time around.  It's the single parent headed households and the number of children living in or close to poverty.  Think when the census data comes in that number is going to show a big increase.  Feel a lot of societies problems get started at that point.

That's another thing Trump is trying to sabotage by ending it early.  I agree and its predominantly in minority communities too.
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pilferk
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« Reply #629 on: September 18, 2020, 05:19:01 PM »

My big ticket item is kind of missing from all the politics this time around.  It's the single parent headed households and the number of children living in or close to poverty.  Think when the census data comes in that number is going to show a big increase.  Feel a lot of societies problems get started at that point.

Check out Bidens Child tax/dependent tax increase proposal. HUGE increase that will help bridge that gap.
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Together again,
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pilferk
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« Reply #630 on: September 18, 2020, 05:28:51 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

Wait, I thought most of those blue collar employers switch their pension plans to one of those 401 programs.  They pay into that for you.  I know my 401 employer program and a couple of other people's programs are put into the stock market along with some safe investments.  If they have a pension plan, they're in the market whether they know it or not.

These long threads are so confusing.  Makes it hard to talk to each other.  

Blue collar stock ownership is under 25%. That includes those with 401ks.

Stock ownership is one of the things that has never recovered since the recession. 65% before everything blew up. 55% in 2019. Has steadily dropped pretty much every year.

People might HAVE access to 401ks. But when you are living paycheck to paycheck, having access to one doesnt mean you contribute to one.

And most companys that switched pensions (fully employer funded) to 401ks also switched to a matching contribution system. Before, employees were "saving" through money they never saw. Now, if they dont contribute, they get nothing.

I get you mean "since their pensions switched they should now have stock". But the numbers show blue collar workers just dont. Not via 401ks or via retirement accounts. Maybe they use it lile a christmas club or rainy day fund and cash in frequently? The discreoancy is one of the (many) impetuses for the wealth gap.

In Trumps world, numbers show stock ownership is close to 95%. And thats why Trump thinks the market is the economy.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2020, 07:26:30 PM by pilferk » Logged

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« Reply #631 on: September 18, 2020, 07:57:54 PM »

The notorius RBG is no more. Sad
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« Reply #632 on: September 18, 2020, 08:03:03 PM »

The notorius RBG is no more. Sad
Goodbye America, it was fun while it lasted.
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cineater
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« Reply #633 on: September 18, 2020, 11:53:57 PM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

Wait, I thought most of those blue collar employers switch their pension plans to one of those 401 programs.  They pay into that for you.  I know my 401 employer program and a couple of other people's programs are put into the stock market along with some safe investments.  If they have a pension plan, they're in the market whether they know it or not.

These long threads are so confusing.  Makes it hard to talk to each other.  

Blue collar stock ownership is under 25%. That includes those with 401ks.

Stock ownership is one of the things that has never recovered since the recession. 65% before everything blew up. 55% in 2019. Has steadily dropped pretty much every year.

People might HAVE access to 401ks. But when you are living paycheck to paycheck, having access to one doesnt mean you contribute to one.

And most companys that switched pensions (fully employer funded) to 401ks also switched to a matching contribution system. Before, employees were "saving" through money they never saw. Now, if they dont contribute, they get nothing.

I get you mean "since their pensions switched they should now have stock". But the numbers show blue collar workers just dont. Not via 401ks or via retirement accounts. Maybe they use it lile a christmas club or rainy day fund and cash in frequently? The discreoancy is one of the (many) impetuses for the wealth gap.

In Trumps world, numbers show stock ownership is close to 95%. And thats why Trump thinks the market is the economy.

I don't think that matching only is what most companies switched to.  You got a link for that?  Unions would have never went for that.  Screwed people over big time though on the lost of health insurance.  You don't have a pension plan with health insurance, you're working to 65, medicare age.
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« Reply #634 on: September 18, 2020, 11:55:21 PM »

The notorius RBG is no more. Sad

Sad, liked her a lot.
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« Reply #635 on: September 19, 2020, 12:16:09 AM »

My big ticket item is kind of missing from all the politics this time around.  It's the single parent headed households and the number of children living in or close to poverty.  Think when the census data comes in that number is going to show a big increase.  Feel a lot of societies problems get started at that point.

Check out Bidens Child tax/dependent tax increase proposal. HUGE increase that will help bridge that gap.

Does that put food on the table today?  Tax credits help get bills caught up.  Does nothing to improve the resources they have to work with everyday to improve/stabilize their situation.  You know what's missing on almost every application for public assistance from single parent households?  Child support.   Why do the tax payers have to pick up that tab?
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« Reply #636 on: September 19, 2020, 01:22:56 AM »

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Corporations exist at the benevolence of the American people. They are an entity created by our government and are 100% beholden to us. Sure, it's "their money", and so is a drug dealer's ill-gotten gains "their money", but we as a society decided that the way they obtained that money was exploitative and harms us as a society. What do you make of the billions stashed in offshore tax havens like Bermuda? Their profits are scraped off the backs of the people who do the actual work of running the companies they simply own.

IMO, all companies that cannot provide a compelling reason not to, should be made cooperatives. There is no reason that simply because someone at one point made an investment to start an operation, that they should be able to derive as much profit from the labor of others as they please for as long as that entity exists. Would you accept as a condition of a car loan that the bank be allowed to continue charging you interest after you've paid off the loan? Such a system, inherently by its design, creates separate classes of owners and workers. When simply by the virtue of already having money, you can reap profit exponentially, that is a system that entrenches inequality by design.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

Wait, I thought most of those blue collar employers switch their pension plans to one of those 401 programs.  They pay into that for you.  I know my 401 employer program and a couple of other people's programs are put into the stock market along with some safe investments.  If they have a pension plan, they're in the market whether they know it or not.

These long threads are so confusing.  Makes it hard to talk to each other. 

I believe he's referring to the fact that the payroll tax is what funds SS.

I don't think that matching only is what most companies switched to.  You got a link for that?  Unions would have never went for that.  Screwed people over big time though on the lost of health insurance.  You don't have a pension plan with health insurance, you're working to 65, medicare age.

Most companies aren't unionized.

Does that put food on the table today?  Tax credits help get bills caught up.  Does nothing to improve the resources they have to work with everyday to improve/stabilize their situation.  You know what's missing on almost every application for public assistance from single parent households?  Child support.   Why do the tax payers have to pick up that tab?

From Biden's official platform:

  • double funding for the Community Development Financial Institutions (CDFI) Fund, which supports local, mission-driven financial institutions in low-income areas around the U.S.
  • double funding for the Economic Development Administration, an agency within the U.S. Department of Commerce devoted to economic development, and task it with creating a new division devoted to helping underserved communities apply for federal aid.
  • a new White House “StrikeForce” to assist rural communities in persistent poverty
  • Fully Implement Congressman Clyburn’s 10-20-30 Plan To tackle persistent poverty in all communities, in both urban and rural America. The formula would allocate at least 10% of funding for all federal programs to counties “where 20% or more of the population has been living below the poverty line for the last 30 years.”
  • invest $640 billion over 10 years so every American has access to housing that is affordable
  • Providing financial assistance to help hard-working Americans buy or rent safe, quality housing, including down payment assistance through a refundable and advanceable tax credit and fully funding federal rental assistance.
  • Protect homeowners and renters from abusive lenders and landlords through a new Homeowner and Renter Bill of Rights.
  • Provide Section 8 housing vouchers to every eligible family so that no one has to pay more than 30% of their income for rental housing.
  • Develop a national strategy for making housing a right for all.
  • nearly tripling Title I funding, which goes to schools serving a high number of children from low-income families
  • Provide high-quality, universal pre-kindergarten for all three- and four -year-olds.
  • voluntary home visiting programs, under which health and child development specialists make consistent, scheduled visits to help parents through the critical early stage of parenting.
  • The New Markets Tax Credit draws in $8 of private investment for every $1 of federal investment in low-income communities by providing tax credits to investors in community development organizations that support everything from supermarkets to real estate projects to manufacturing plants. Biden will expand the program to provide $5 billion in support every year, and will make the program permanent
  • End the criminalization of poverty. Cash bail is the modern-day debtors’ prison. Biden will lead a national effort to end cash bail
  • Biden will invest $1 billion per year in juvenile justice reform. He will expand funding for after-school programs, community centers, and summer jobs to keep young people active, busy, learning, and having fun. Biden will double the number of mental health professionals in our schools
  • support the Pregnant Workers Fairness Act, ensuring that employers offer women employees with reasonable workplace accommodations when their abilities are limited by pregnancy
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jarmo
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« Reply #637 on: September 19, 2020, 07:27:31 AM »

Mitch McConnell....

The poster boy for the new improved Republican party.




/jarmo
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pilferk
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« Reply #638 on: September 19, 2020, 08:47:48 AM »


“How many of you all own stock in Scranton?” Biden asked Thursday. “Not a whole lot of people own stock.”  

Is this how he sees us?  Poverty or extremely rich?  Where does he think the middle class has their 401s.  Even if they aren't putting money there, their employers are for them.  I sure as hell hope some of that social security money they took out of my check is in the stock market.  I don't personally wheel and deal in the stock market.  Let the pros manage my money there.  How well the stock market is doing is not a joke for me.  It's a major concern.

45% of the country doesn't own stock.

The stock market isn't the economy, and it's not a good indicator of the economy.  It's an indicator of corporate profits.

And those corporations are not sharing those profits. They are hoarding them.

So, yeah...Biden was talking to them.

And if you're concerned, you'll be happy to know that...based on percentages...the market gained more under Obama/Biden than it has under Trump.  beer

But 55% of the country does.  It's the place where your retirement savings.  You're suppose to save money for your old age.  Social Security isn't the answer and to hear some say it may not be there in the future.  The stock market is an important thing for me.

As far as corporations not sharing profits.  It's their money just like it's the rich people's money.  They are not required to share, up to them what they do with it.  I like when they are charitable, champion causes and improve benefits for their employees.  I like doing business with those companies but it's their money not mine.

Biden was at a Town Hall.  Talking to the people.  I wasn't there and I was insulted just reading that.

Might not be there if Trump wins with what he's doing with the payroll tax crap.

Wait, I thought most of those blue collar employers switch their pension plans to one of those 401 programs.  They pay into that for you.  I know my 401 employer program and a couple of other people's programs are put into the stock market along with some safe investments.  If they have a pension plan, they're in the market whether they know it or not.

These long threads are so confusing.  Makes it hard to talk to each other.  

Blue collar stock ownership is under 25%. That includes those with 401ks.

Stock ownership is one of the things that has never recovered since the recession. 65% before everything blew up. 55% in 2019. Has steadily dropped pretty much every year.

People might HAVE access to 401ks. But when you are living paycheck to paycheck, having access to one doesnt mean you contribute to one.

And most companys that switched pensions (fully employer funded) to 401ks also switched to a matching contribution system. Before, employees were "saving" through money they never saw. Now, if they dont contribute, they get nothing.

I get you mean "since their pensions switched they should now have stock". But the numbers show blue collar workers just dont. Not via 401ks or via retirement accounts. Maybe they use it lile a christmas club or rainy day fund and cash in frequently? The discreoancy is one of the (many) impetuses for the wealth gap.

In Trumps world, numbers show stock ownership is close to 95%. And thats why Trump thinks the market is the economy.

I don't think that matching only is what most companies switched to.  You got a link for that?  Unions would have never went for that.  Screwed people over big time though on the lost of health insurance.  You don't have a pension plan with health insurance, you're working to 65, medicare age.

Its literally one of the legal difference between a pension and a 401k or 403b. A pension is wholly employer funded. A 401k has to be employee funded. Matching is allowed, but without employee contribution, the employer is not allowed to contribute. The max match has been right around 200%, i think. I dont know anyone that matches that high....i am sure they exist. From what i have seen, matches range from about 50% to 100%, typically (aka 50 cents to a dollar from the employer for every dollar from the employee).

You can also have both. I do.

https://www.protective.com/learn/understanding-the-difference-between-a-pension-plan-and-a-401k-plan

Most companies are not union. In addition  companies cried poor to employees, and threarened layoffs if they didnt allow them to convert. Pensions (full vale of owed) are expensive, and companies have to keep them on the books as a liability. That effects profitability and ,potentially, stock value. 401ks are neither. The matches are a payroll expense, and off the books week to week....and it doesnt matter what the full value of those accounts are. The value of those full 401ks are irrelevant to the company's bottom line.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2020, 09:05:24 AM by pilferk » Logged

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« Reply #639 on: September 19, 2020, 11:06:25 AM »


'Talk about losers': The top moments from CNN’s kid-gloves town hall with Biden

On Tuesday, voters got in Trump's face for the first time. On Thursday, they practically gave Biden a hero's welcome in Scranton, Pa.

For the second time this week, a presidential candidate fielded questions from voters in a town hall setting. But if ABC’s event with President Donald Trump was an icy grilling, CNN’s drive-in conversation with Joe Biden Thursday was more like an affable reunion of old acquaintances.

more - https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/18/talk-about-losers-cnn-town-hall-joe-biden-417560
  

Surprise, surprise. More. Goal. Post. Moving.

What you saw wasn't a difference in questions. What you saw was a difference in tone.  Which is understandable given one is a terrible president, and one isn't.  One was prepared, and able to discuss the actual issues and one wasn't and couldn't.

You might want to consider that the tonal difference might be partially because of the different styles of the two candidates AND the feelings toward them by voters, in general. And a reaction to Trumps lies.

Oddly enough, that's what the article you linked pretty much laid out.  Once again, I have to wonder if you actually read it...or just jumped on the headline.

And, as you continue to prove, Biden can do exactly what Trump supporters say he has to do to prove his mental competency to them...and they'll just move the goal posts and ask for something more or something different.




I heard some of the questions for both Trump and Biden town halls. It was more than just tone.

I know what I saw, but thank you for telling me what I saw ( some things never change)

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