Cd.com ?

[jarmo]

^I dont see what is that business of yours....
and this thread is about the forum, not the servers.

She offered an explanation that I considered was misleading. That's all.

I don't care what they do with their money. But to say it went to a tracker alone when it appears to have gone to hosting multiple other sites as well, is misleading in my opinion.



By the way, the ads, servers and money wasn't something I brought up in the first place....




/jarmo

[Christos AG]

and because you don't know me or my husband... be aware that I have done and offer many things to support the band, the forum and the gnr.us site... oh... also the greek forum that Christos is running when I made and paid for the lighters and for advertising his site at the biggest greek online community... and again for advertising the GNR concert in Athens ...

Watching these board fights was fun for me until my name was mentioned for no particular reason.

No matter how much money I have spent on this band, I've never asked for anything in return. I spent it cause I feel that I owe my life to this band.

I'm not asking for any help, probably too proud or stupid to do it.

However, if someone wants to help, he/she is welcome to do it and I'm thankfull for it.

But don't use that help to get a tax return or justify anything else like some stupid forum fight.

Let's stop talking about that.

[blueheart]

The money from the gnr.us and cd.com goes towards the bill of hosting plus a serious amount that goes out of our pockets each month...

By hosting you mean the dedicated server you use for your hosting company that also hosts GNR.us sites, such as the tracker, as well as paying customers' sites?


I can understand that many hosts don't want to allow such thing on a shared server, but your posts are a bit misleading when you claim the server was purchased for the tracker alone. Just my opinion. 



/jarmo

I don't feel like I have to go to further explanations but I will answer your question.

The blueheartweb at first was made so Sean would have something to work on in Greece as for some months when he first moved here he couldn't find a job. It was really hard because he wasn't speaking Greek. By the time he finished implementing the blueheartweb site he started working for a company over here and never started promoting it. He tried though to host the tracker at the original account he had but unfortunately the tracker wasn't working right. When he decided to do all the upgrades to the tracker he had a chat with his host and decided to order that dedicated server only for the tracker. At this dedicated server currently is hosted the gnr.us network, the new cd.com and 2 gnr fan sites that each of them are paying 6 dollars per month. Sean has worked on many other websites in Greece for the company I work, for the company he works, for some other companies in Greece but only for the design. All these sites are hosted at local servers here in Greece.

so, Sean's dedicated server currently servers only his websites and 2 other gnr fansites. He also hosted for a while gnrontour when john needed help with his hosting...

[jarmo]

I appreciate the answer. 

Now it's a lot clearer and there's no misunderstanding or misleading info. 



/jarmo

[blueheart]

and because you don't know me or my husband... be aware that I have done and offer many things to support the band, the forum and the gnr.us site... oh... also the greek forum that Christos is running when I made and paid for the lighters and for advertising his site at the biggest greek online community... and again for advertising the GNR concert in Athens ...

Watching these board fights was fun for me until my name was mentioned for no particular reason.

No matter how much money I have spent on this band, I've never asked for anything in return. I spent it cause I feel that I owe my life to this band.

I'm not asking for any help, probably too proud or stupid to do it.

However, if someone wants to help, he/she is welcome to do it and I'm thankfull for it.

But don't use that help to get a tax return or justify anything else like some stupid forum fight.

Let's stop talking about that.

I've never mentioned online what I do or what anyone does with his own money until I read sladdi's message and I also never asked anything in return. I didn't say you asked help, sorry if I didn't make clear that I offered help as I wanted to support your site and the band. I didn't have this intention when I mentioned your name. I mentioned helping you as an example because you are one of the people that we personally know and you personally know us. 

I am really sad and tired with this story and I feel like I gave enough explanations.

[leatherebel]

Also, let me remind you some things from our last chat? Sean and I are almost never online the weekends. The thread you were talking about when you resigned from cd.com was moved back from another admin and not from Sean. Sean immediate deleted everything as soon as he was aware about what was happening. You don?t know him. You have never talked to him except from the times you were asking about more moderating rights? or should I say administrative rights as you had exactly the same rights with all the mods. There is also a proof that another admin asked you not to remove that thread ? yet ? that day? you had receive a pm that day? Sladdi also promised that was going to talk to you about that entire situation? I don?t know if he ever did.

You are mixing things up and confusing even yourself.
Yes, I asked BP for more moderating rights some time in Feb or March after I had asked him twice to remove me as a mod which he didn't want to do. As a mod on cd.com at the time I didn't have many right. I could not delete posts (yes, every time someone posted a stupid rumor or a link to a leak or asked for one I had to manually edit their posts - done it thousands of times), I could not delete threads (I could just move them to the admin section, from where they often were restored to the main section without even letting me know why), I could not give meaningful warnings to users let alone ban them, and I had absolutely no mod rights in other sections of the forum such as the Garden/Jungle/etc where users would eventually find their way to post links to leaks. So, I had to do alot of manual work to keep the main section of the forum clean from links to leaks, requests for such, baseless rumors, and bashing among users and of other forums. And every time I would work my way through cleaning up your house and politely asking users to stop posting or asking for leaks, there would be dozens of them telling me to fuck off, insulting me, and basically making fun of me. Well, in a situation like this, don't you think it's normal I either ask to resign or ask for more power so I can control your pesty users. BTW, nice forum culture you are nurturing over there.
In the end I got neither more mod power nor being removed as a mod. And of course, with my name on the page I couldn't just ignore what was going on in terms of rumors, leaks, and bashing. So, I kept cleaning up for at least 2 more months...until I'd had it.
The day that I quit, when the MSL leaks happened, I watched your board all night, doing the manual cleaning, and naively asking users to behave. And when they didn't, I did the only thing I could've done after I cleaned up the threads - I locked them. Yet Mr GoodMan BP could not let his precious board members be treated so harshly, so he unlocked all threads without even sending me a message, at least one thread with leaks that I had removed to the admin section was restored temporarily and of course at least one of the Jarmo-bashing threads was restored too...for whatever reason. You and BP were online that day/weekend/whatever. I have no way of knowing who restored the removed threads but it was him who unlocked all the locked ones. The incident that you refer to happened months before that when Madagascar leaked, if I remember correctly. I removed a thread with the leak seconds after it popped up and was asked by an admin very politely to leave it there for a couple of hours so enough people can grab it (notice that there was at least polite comminication here). A request that I honored only for about 30 minutes since I couldn't any longer. That was the only case I have ever cooperated in terms of being slow in removing leaks, rumors, or bashing. I was not proud of it.
I am not defending Sladdi here, though he did have tons more personality and humbleness than BP and communication with him was much easier. Just calrifying what you refered to.? As to your comment that I was after administrative power, it is just preposterous and you know it. I'm just a fan who has a completely unrelated job and a career, which I can't afford to neglect since I happen to live in one of the most expensive corners in the world. I was never after power and money in the GN'R community, unlike your husband. And neither you nor anyone else has any proof of the opposite. If I was, I would've started with a "fan" site, spreading leaks and "news" and then when attracting significant number of users, would've put ads and used fancy misleading language like BP's to convince users I'm their connection to the band in the gn'r community and they should do business through me. Or, at least I would've tried to move to help on another gn'r site.
I did realize it was a mistake to get involved with helping on any gn'r sites. It is an ungrateful job (as you have probably found out by now yourself) and if you have a pretty busy life, then it's really tough. So, yes, I do regret ever being a mod and I have never wanted to be one since then. Although, I have been approached by another gn'r board admin (not Jarmo if that's what you are thinking) to whom I respectfully declined.

[blueheart]

You are mixing things up and confusing even yourself. Yes, I asked BP for more moderating rights some time in Feb or March after I had asked him twice to remove me as a mod which he didn't want to do. As a mod on cd.com at the time I didn't have many right. I could not delete posts (yes, every time someone posted a stupid rumor or a link to a leak or asked for one I had to manually edit their posts - done it thousands of times), I could not delete threads (I could just move them to the admin section, from where they often were restored to the main section without even letting me know why), I could not give meaningful warnings to users let alone ban them, and I had absolutely no mod rights in other sections of the forum such as the Garden/Jungle/etc where users would eventually find their way to post links to leaks. So, I had to do alot of manual work to keep the main section of the forum clean from links to leaks, requests for such, baseless rumors, and bashing among users and of other forums. And every time I would work my way through cleaning up your house and politely asking users to stop posting or asking for leaks, there would be dozens of them telling me to fuck off, insulting me, and basically making fun of me. Well, in a situation like this, don't you think it's normal I either ask to resign or ask for more power so I can control your pesty users. BTW, nice forum culture you are nurturing over there.

Correct me if I am wrong but I think that sladdi was the one that set you up as moderator and not BP. As far as I remember you didn't ask him to remove you from moderator you asked him to make your name invisible (not highlighted) from the mods. You asked from the beginning to moderate the on tour section and they gave you rights to moderate the main gnr section as you were the only mod set from US and it would be good to have somebody moderating the forum on time that noone of us could be online due to the time difference between Europe and US. You didn't ask to moderate the jungle section and the garden has always been an uncensored section of cd.com. Despite that fact posts with illegal staff get removed. The bashing against moderators is very usual phenomenon, I got annoyed many times as well, until the things got out of control and Sean and Sladdi banned plenty of people for bashing the mods and for posting links to leaks.  A sticky topic was made in February at the gnr section... http://chinesedemocracy.com/forum/index.php/topic,24431.0.html and it has been moved lately at the support section. People will be always bashing against admins and mods, not only at cd.com, here too and to other forums as well. It's part of it. I' m sorry you felt like that, I felt it too, Sean and Sladdi the same, even Jarmo had several attacks at his forum. After a while I guess you are getting used not to be so sensitive.

In the end I got neither more mod power nor being removed as a mod. And of course, with my name on the page I couldn't just ignore what was going on in terms of rumors, leaks, and bashing. So, I kept cleaning up for at least 2 more months...until I'd had it.
The day that I quit, when the MSL leaks happened, I watched your board all night, doing the manual cleaning, and naively asking users to behave. And when they didn't, I did the only thing I could've done after I cleaned up the threads - I locked them. Yet Mr GoodMan BP could not let his precious board members be treated so harshly, so he unlocked all threads without even sending me a message, at least one thread with leaks that I had removed to the admin section was restored temporarily and of course at least one of the Jarmo-bashing threads was restored too...for whatever reason. You and BP were online that day/weekend/whatever. I have no way of knowing who restored the removed threads but it was him who unlocked all the locked ones. The incident that you refer to happened months before that when Madagascar leaked, if I remember correctly.

BP unlocked a thread that you had cleaned from every request and every link, put up a note that was saying Discussion only, no requests, no links, no pms, so people have the time to chat about the songs. Apologies for not letting you know that he was going to do that. Many people got banned cause of bashing at this thread and cause they were asking for pms, messages that were instantly removed. CD.com was never a site that liked censorship. Our members are allowed to say their opinions. Bashing and insults are not allowed though - except from the Garden section were the Jarmo thread was located - not restored. Thread with leaks was not restored. Except if you mean thread that was cleaned and moved back for discussion. No matter what, you were always attacking to Sean, without having any proof of who did what. And when I said that you wanted administrative rights I meant the banning module. The only people that could ban members (and move threads back from the admin section) were BP and Sladdi. Noone of the mods have the power to do that... also note that we changed from phpbb to smf back then and that reset all settings. We did have some issues with rights. I've read pm that Sean was telling you to be patient. Also sladdi was supposed to talk to you more about the rights but he never did.

I removed a thread with the leak seconds after it popped up and was asked by an admin very politely to leave it there for a couple of hours so enough people can grab it (notice that there was at least polite comminication here). A request that I honored only for about 30 minutes since I couldn't any longer. That was the only case I have ever cooperated in terms of being slow in removing leaks, rumors, or bashing. I was not proud of it.
I am not defending Sladdi here, though he did have tons more personality and humbleness than BP and communication with him was much easier. Just calrifying what you refered to.  As to your comment that I was after administrative power, it is just preposterous and you know it. I'm just a fan who has a completely unrelated job and a career, which I can't afford to neglect since I happen to live in one of the most expensive corners in the world. I was never after power and money in the GN'R community, unlike your husband. And neither you nor anyone else has any proof of the opposite. If I was, I would've started with a "fan" site, spreading leaks and "news" and then when attracting significant number of users, would've put ads and used fancy misleading language like BP's to convince users I'm their connection to the band in the gn'r community and they should do business through me. Or, at least I would've tried to move to help on another gn'r site.
I did realize it was a mistake to get involved with helping on any gn'r sites. It is an ungrateful job (as you have probably found out by now yourself) and if you have a pretty busy life, then it's really tough. So, yes, I do regret ever being a mod and I have never wanted to be one since then. Although, I have been approached by another gn'r board admin (not Jarmo if that's what you are thinking) to whom I respectfully declined.

Considering who asked you politely to keep a thread with leak you contradict yourself on many of the things you have posted against BP and the threads with the leaks. I am not going to defend BP's or sladdi's personality and communications skills but I do respect both of them. Maybe it was a bad time... Now regarding the money, you better my posts above to understand how wrong you are, as BP invests lots of money from his pocket in order to run his gnr sites. But I guess is so difficult for you to understand it... Concerning your job and where you live, believe me, WE HAVE to work and WE DO work plenty of hours every day, and we live in a Country that doesn't offer so many choices and opportunities. The gnr fan sites is something that we do because we love the band and its music and has nothing to do with personal benefit.

[leatherebel]

Blueheart, please, don't discuss other people's PMs in public.....please....
Do you realize how uncool that is?
I mean, you just demonstrated in the last couple of days that you wouldn't think twice about looking into other people's old PMs and make them public in order to defend yourself or to make a point. How would that make your forum users feel about trusting you? How about those that actually do business with you?

I am not saying Sladdi did not do things that I considered wrong and was disappointed about. The last one of those was that he never talked to me when I started showing discontent with what was going on on cd.com. I think I did send a message to him as well when I did to BP about the above mentioned. Sladdi never got back to me. BP did and he left me with the impression that everything is discussed between them, so I didn't bother copying Sladdi from then on. But my limited communication with BP turned out fruitless. I tried to understand about the template and stuff, but not fixing this for months made me lose my patience at some point. Plus other more specific things which I have discussed with you in the past.
I agree that it was not cool how I ended things by going in public. I was very affected at the time. I am not proud of that. And if you haven't noticed I never discussed the incident in public since then...until now that you provoked me.

You accuse me of always having an agenda against BP. While, I admit that I  never liked his "I'm the greatest attitude", you can't really accuse me making things up because I am not the only one who has had problems with BP. In fact I should be the least of his problems - I am nobody in the community. I mean, just take the other gn'r site admins: BP has had a history of problems with Eric, RainX, Jarmo, Sladdi, you name it.... Compared to me, all these people are celebrities in the gn'r community. And sadly, they'll probably all share my opinion. And, no, there is no conspiracy here - some of these guys I haven't even spoken to. And sadly again, you can't really say none of them knows BP as you always say this about me.

So, it is a pretty common belief in the community that BP has an ego and an integrity problem. My humble suggestion is that he works on it and try to make things better in the long run.

I don't understand why you don't let him do the talking. Why are you doing it? You've never been accused of anything as far as I remember. Not by me at least. In fact, I compliment you on your looks every chance I get. Not only do you never return the favor, but you also don't even say "thank you". How nice.

I appologize for my comment regarding "the place where I live". I now realize it was in poor taste - I agree, making a living can be tough anywhere in the world. My point was more that you are not forced by anyone to spend money and time on your fan sites. It is admirable that you are doing it, but just because you are, doesn't entitle you to any benefits and respect in the community regardless of how much money it costs you. BP has always acted as if he is indeed entitled to that.

[blueheart]

Blueheart, please, don't discuss other people's PMs in public.....please....
Do you realize how uncool that is?
I mean, you just demonstrated in the last couple of days that you wouldn't think twice about looking into other people's old PMs and make them public in order to defend yourself or to make a point. How would that make your forum users feel about trusting you? How about those that actually do business with you?

I never said that I went through other people's PMs. That's impossible anyway as each password is highly encrypted. Even if you lose it you are the only one that can reset it. Don't make it sound like something else of what I said. I said I read BP's pm because it happens to share the same computer at home and because we had lots of discussion about this matter as I always supported your effort and work at the forum back then. I also mentioned a message that was sent to you because I was told so...

I am not saying Sladdi did not do things that I considered wrong and was disappointed about. The last one of those was that he never talked to me when I started showing discontent with what was going on on cd.com. I think I did send a message to him as well when I did to BP about the above mentioned. Sladdi never got back to me. BP did and he left me with the impression that everything is discussed between them, so I didn't bother copying Sladdi from then on. But my limited communication with BP turned out fruitless. I tried to understand about the template and stuff, but not fixing this for months made me lose my patience at some point. Plus other more specific things which I have discussed with you in the past.
I agree that it was not cool how I ended things by going in public. I was very affected at the time. I am not proud of that. And if you haven't noticed I never discussed the incident in public since then...until now that you provoked me.

I guess due to the latest facts you can understand that BP couldn't work on the template as he didn't have access to the server that the forum was hosted. So he was telling you that things were in progress, and that was the truth.

You accuse me of always having an agenda against BP. While, I admit that I  never liked his "I'm the greatest attitude", you can't really accuse me making things up because I am not the only one who has had problems with BP. In fact I should be the least of his problems - I am nobody in the community. I mean, just take the other gn'r site admins: BP has had a history of problems with Eric, RainX, Jarmo, Sladdi, you name it.... Compared to me, all these people are celebrities in the gn'r community. And sadly, they'll probably all share my opinion. And, no, there is no conspiracy here - some of these guys I haven't even spoken to. And sadly again, you can't really say none of them knows BP as you always say this about me.

So, it is a pretty common belief in the community that BP has an ego and an integrity problem. My humble suggestion is that he works on it and try to make things better in the long run.

At our last communication, if you remember the emails we exchanged, I explained to you many things. Each person has each own personality. BP might makes you thing he as big ego. That's your opinion and it's fine. You also say he had problems with some other people... BP never had anything against you and he was really disappointed when you accused him that night for things he didn't do. These things were things you thought he did. I spent much time back then talking with you. If he had anything against you except that, believe me I wouldn't been bothered. Excuse me for not knowing who RainX is. BP also has no problem with Jarmo. We all met previous summer. He does appreciate his work on the forum. He did make a sticky post for being against Jarmo's bashing. He did ban people when things got out of control. We also wouldn't mind to meet with him again in the future and why not... may have a beer too (lol). At the end please do not mention sladdi, because sladdi for Sean and me means a lot, he is not just a person on the gnr community.   I believe that there was lots of pressure and things got out of control. It wasn't exactly a good reaction to shut down the forum without Sean's approval. They both owned it. They both run it. 

I don't understand why you don't let him do the talking. Why are you doing it? You've never been accused of anything as far as I remember. Not by me at least. In fact, I compliment you on your looks every chance I get. Not only do you never return the favor, but you also don't even say "thank you". How nice.

He will say what he has to say as soon as he finds the time. I don't think he can right now as he stayed awake for more 3 days and was working (at his real work lol) 14 hours yesterday and 14 today...  As for the comment, I really thank you. Sorry for not returning the favor before but I am really under lots of pressure the last days.

I appologize for my comment regarding "the place where I live". I now realize it was in poor taste - I agree, making a living can be tough anywhere in the world. My point was more that you are not forced by anyone to spend money and time on your fan sites. It is admirable that you are doing it, but just because you are, doesn't entitle you to any benefits and respect in the community regardless of how much money it costs you. BP has always acted as if he is indeed entitled to that.

there is no need to apologize for the comment "the place where I live". But it would be nice to try to understand that BP is not exactly "all about the money" as you stated before. He does spend money and time because he wants to and never acted like he is entitled to. However, people, including you, can see it however they want.

[AdZ]

Wow, you guys are fucking freaks.

[Lucky]

^wise words from a wise man

[mrbucketfoot]

Just a personal opinion here, but the whole forum split thing is completely ludicrous.

As a GNR Community we had the established MyGNR, HTGTH, and the CD.com forum. Three "main" sites, each with different advantages and fanbases.

The whole split isn't good for the Community and quite discouraging really. Sure we all need to make a honest buck, but at the cost of what? Both forums have the exact same content on them at the moment. Which doesn't make sense from any standpoint. It's child-like stubbornness at it's best.

The quote from Rock In Rio 3 "unlike Oasis...." would be fitting if you had a huge rock band that was in the process of being reinvented with amazingly talented players, but you aren't. You are some guys and gals who know a bit of HTML code and know your general way around Photoshop. You have a website. A delicate trust, a young marriage. The forum wasn't even that mature. You had a lot you could add to offer your members, but no, you had to cut your resources in two.You aren't Axl Rose, in short. Sladdi will always be a better webmaster, graphic designer, and all of the above than BP and Blueheart. Except for they have the server/hosting skills that Sladdi probably is a little weak on, so it makes sense.

And it would be one thing if either BP/Blueheart/Sladdi were huge posters like Jarmo on this board. I've been on your boards and you don't do shit. Sure you do some behind the scenes stuff, but as far as posting? Forget about it. It's nothing really of substance. We don't listen to you or think your posts are highly credible or add something awesome to the community. The old CD.com forum was made by your members generating discussion about the band that they loved. And sure, some chose to heed Axl's advice to "see you again later", but splitting up a forum that was already on the decline? Smart fucking move. Makes so much sense. Now individuals like me, friends, and everyone who ever used those forums are either going to post in Sladdi's or BP/Blueheart's. Good job cutting your visits in half. Again, smart move, less ad money for you.

And gunsnroses.us isn't a good website. It tries way too hard to be hot shit and fails. There's no continuity of design in either of the sites anymore. NewGNR is still going to be doing well, it's well made and maintained. Some great content on there. But the online community was never really that special. So, in the end you need each other.

If you decide to be stubborn dicks, be my guest, I'm fine here on this forum. And if you don't like it here, theres MyGNR. As GNR fans, we'll be fine without you.

Just some thoughts.

[spaghetti_incident]

Is the fight over because now I get just one site again.

[cotis]

no, the layouts just the same. or at least thats how it appears to me.