Here Today... Gone To Hell!

February 2nd, 1988 - GN'R plays at The Ritz in New York, NY. MTV is there filming, and an edited version of the show is later broadcast on the channel.

Just happened to pop out my DVD of The Ritz '88 show that was aired on MTV, looked at the box and noticed that the show was performed on February 2, 1988.  This performance changed my life.  I had been a fan of the band for quite a few months by the time this aired (can anyone tell me the date it first aired?), but watching them live for the first time engrossed me into their music and identity for life.  I have a passion for few things like I do GN'R.  Aside from my love of my family and friends, I love my Mets (hell yeah on the Johan Santana acquisition!), I love my Giants (still can't believe they're in the f'in Superbowl!), and I love G'n'F'n'R!  The pure rawness of the band was unmatched by anyone at the time, and in my opinion, since.

I didn't even realize that, hard to believe that was 20 years ago. You just inspired me to goto Youtube and watch it.


It is really striking how big a party that show seemed like. During Paradise City you had Axl diving out into the crowd trying to crowd surf with Slash literally passed out playing the outro on his back all while still sounding totally killer.

The other thing I never fully appreciated is how fuckin awesome a rythm section Adler, Duff and Izzy were. In the shadow of Axl/Slash I don't think they have ever been truly appreciated for just how much they brought to the GNR sound. Watch this show and Popcorn was a beast on the drums, as he has a groove to his playing that never really came back after he left. He was kind of like the Slash of drummers, hardly a virtuoso in terms of talent, but his style of play seemed to fit so perfectly with the sound of the band. Duff's baselines sound awesome, and Izzy may be the coolest looking guitarists to pick up the axe.

It is also not surprising how GNR became the biggest band on the planet when you see how much charisma Axl and Slash had. Axl's voice was a fucking monster back then. Watch every song on that show and he had album quality grit and aggression in his voice through out every song. I am not sure if being on TV pumped him up, but he sounded amazing from start to finish. Same thing with Slash, I don't remember him playing as well at some of those shows in the early years, but his guitar tone and sound is bad ass.

The final observation is how different they sounded in that period compared to later years and especially now. There were no keyboards, effects 3rd guitarists, orchestras or whatever else came into play once the Illusions started. With just drums, bass and 2 guitars you heard all of their instruments so clearly. It had a raw kick ass rock vibe to it. They showed up looking like a bad ass rock band, played the shit out of their instruments and it turned them into the biggest rock band on the planet. When you look at how amazing their chemistry was it is amazing to think things would be the way they are now, but I guess that is a testament to how special it was that even 20 years later they were still on the cover Rollingstone and have a general public still fascinated in a story they have heard a thousand times.

It might not have been the best show they ever played (I like Paris in 92) but it certainly captured the essence of the band for that time period as well as one could. If you could only show people one video of a GNR concert to give them an idea of what the band was like this would be it. When they weren't busy bickering/fighting or being petty they were a pretty good fuckin rock band.  :beer:

 Thats a pretty fucking elegant observation. Naupis.

Every Christmas day I pull up a chair, fire on the Ritz 88 dvd, crank it up in surround sound and pop open a bottle of whisky. Sheer bliss!!

Its mabye not technically their best performance ever captured on film, although much of it is hard to beat. But the raw power, sheer energy and bullet proof attitude is spine tingling. Every time I watch it I get goose bumps. I watched it with a friend who had never seen any footage of GN'R live and he was blown away, mostly by Axl. He said - "If you could plug that guy in there is enough energy coming off him to power the whole show!"

I remember waking up on a Sunday morning in 1988, I was 8 years old, and my dad said " We taped something off the TV last night for you and your brother..."
Stuck in the video and low and behold it was this concert, Channel 4 in the UK had aired it. Me and my brother were GN'R daft at that time. The thing I remember most is when Paradise City came on, my dad had his head in his hands saying "Oh God! I think we know this one."

My brother had a cassette with Paradise City copied on it, not once or twice but for a whole 60 minute tape, Paradise City on repeat.
He had this wee mini ghetto blaster which he took everywhere with this bloody tape going night and day. Man I hated that song for years after that :crying:

I love this show too!   I know that KOHD was never aired on MTV until years later, but did they play don't cry at this show too?  For some reason I think I remember hearing or reading that somewhere!

No it was at the Ritz 87 show, and it was a brilliant performance : ok:

Slash most diffinity is a virtuoso! Just because he doesn't play a thousand notes a second doesn't mean he's not.

Even though I was only just three yrs old when this show happened, and Ive been a true GNR fan for seven years( I knew the band after T2 in 1994), this is the gig I feel best shows the band in the right way. True, It might not have been the best show from a sound point of view and set up but I couldnt care less.

This show took place when I was 11 years old. My dad let me stay up to watch the show. I had just started to become a fan of the band
as a result of Welcome to the Jungle. I watched the show and it sealed the deal.:)  The band was really tight. I have to buy it on DVD.
Btw, LETS GO NY GIANTS!!!!  Next Super Bowl Champs!!!!:) Sorry, I  had to say it.

I remember the night it came on MTV and the build up all day for it. I was nine or ten at the time. It was a killer show. That was the first time I saw the band outsde an interview or video. When Axl introduced Slash to the crowd and he told them to shut up when they chanted his name, I thought that was the coolest thing I had ever seen.

nice post and great show~!



edit:  SPEAKING OF ANNIVERSARIES, i missed my 5 years anniversary a couple months back of registering!!11 

thats crap dude.

Naupis you hit the nail on the head man with that post : ok:

i agree 100% with everything you say about the rhythm section, slash and axl.

back then they were the best fuckin rock and roll band in the world. its a fucking shame they exploited only a very small percentage of their potential :no:

I fucking love that show... Rocket Queen from that one is such a classic.   :hihi: And hell, it was exactly one year before my birthday!

A lot of us old school fans keep waiting (hopelessly) for a recurrence of the magic of that night. And really, if you look at the bootlegs from that era, most of their shows were thrilling in some way and went along similar lines. The difference about the Ritz show was that 1) they had just established a mainstream presence, 2) they were ON MESSAGE the whole fucking night --- from Browstone to Paradise City, and 3) it was all captured and broadcast on national television. This show gave the band a mythical aura ... they were a perfect rock n' roll band, they had three perfect singles, amazingly the album was better its component parts (just like the band itself), they had elements that attracted different types of fans for completely different reasons, and they could bring it live to the extent that it took people's breath away. Really their high point for purists like me.

this 02/02/1988 ritz mtv show performance-wise was an average 80s gnr show....axl's got voice trouble and the band performance was "so so" only. people of 80s knowledge should know there have been much better ones, for example if they would have captured/televised

August 02nd 1988 - Market Square Arena, Indianapolis, IN

now THAT would have been killer on tv broadcast worldwide. the audio master source of this was released on dime last year or so, go and check please.

still.....we just had this 02/02/1988 ritz - 02/02/2008 20th anniversary....where is the official MTV dvd release??

Just missing out on seeing GNR as I did when they toured the UK in '88 and having to wait what seemed like an agonising eternity for them to start touring again, before seeing my first show in Germany in May '91, I'm not sure if I come under the banner of 'old school fan' or just merely 'old'.   :D

Nevertheless, the shows I attended in 2006 were something incredibly special and, dare I say it, even magical too.  I feel that the current era of GNR is every bit as dynamic and indispensable as any of the previous incarnations, and if you or anyone else hasn't seen this latest line-up perform live yet and are still feeling dewy-eyed about the good ol' days, I urge you to go and see them as soon as possible - I think you may well find that the magic returns.

As for the pivotal moment in GNR history, although AFD and the shows of that era were undoubtedly a powerful concoction that swept away all the competition, and acted as the centre from which GNR launched their claim to rock dominance, I feel the unleashing of CD upon the listening masses (and the supporting tour) will prove to be a focal point of equal magnitude for the GNR of today.  And naturally, at the heart of both occasions, will be the one person who, for me, is the true lynchpin of GNR, Axl Rose.

A pillar in Guns N' Roses' History...

For me, personally, is not the coolest show but it means a lot....

the only song cut from the MTV telecast was "Mama Kin", KOHD was in the broadcast fromm day one, and damn MTV played the shit out of that concert. KOHD was also on a european 12" single of WTTJ, it was live from the Marquee in '87 and slowly began getting radio play after the MTV concert.

Beer and the ritz, a now 4 year old tradition..Me and my bud...Axl Voice was alot better on the ritz show compraed to tokyo 92..In Tokyo 92 he didn?t even have a voice it was just ..Something else

Mama Kin was left out on every aired version just as some talking in between the songs. but on some channels they indeed left out KOHD (just like the UK broadcast) aswell. KOHD/Ritz'88  became some kind of regular video single later (before the 4/20/1992 show was even played) on MTV though.


they never did a show in Germany in May'91, only german show in 1991 was 8/24/1991 in Mannheim. i was there aswell.

all you had to do was catch the band on tour back in 2006-2007

excuse me, but what does this mean?  what is a purist?  i've seen some of you call yourselves this and i have no idea what you are trying to say.

Purist - traditionalist - like something in pure state, as if never touched.  Like a virgin.  They want to rember girl as virgin, not a whore.

I guess im guilty of being a purist

thats the stupidest thing i've ever heard.

You never know, maybe something like the Hall of Fame induction will be enough to get the 5 of them to play nice for a night. They obviously have a fractured relationship, but when Guns N' Roses is officially immortalized in Rock N' Roll history that night and it is Axl/Slash/Izzy/Duff and Steven's name on that plaque you would hate to think any of them would miss the occassion because of things that happened almost 20 years ago (at that point). Whether they like it or not the 5 of them are in that one together, so hopefully they take advantage and make the most of it. Outside of that probably best to keep watching the Ritz video. Who knows, maybe the band members themselves might have to watch some old videos to remind themselves just how fuckin good and magical they were, and why the Hall will eventually want them in the first place.

Thanks for the correction ? memory never has been good with dates.  I travelled there because I couldn?t wait the extra few days ?till they got to Wembley.  ;D

First time I heard Estranged too ? sent shivers down my spine.  Hope I get to hear it played live again one day.

pur?ism      /ˈpyʊərɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[pyoor-iz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
?noun 1. strict observance of or insistence on purity in language, style, etc. 
2. an instance of this. 
3. (often initial capital letter) Fine Arts. a style of art developed in France in the early 20th century, characterized by the use of simple geometric forms and images evocative of objects produced by machine. 


pur?ist       (pyŏŏr'ĭst)  Pronunciation Key 
n.   One who practices or urges strict correctness, especially in the use of words.

 fundamentalism is a sort of purism. :yes:

Things have kept happening all through the years. It didn't just happen almost 20 years ago...

Imagine if you were married, divorced and you managed to get your own life while your ex-wife has talked shit about you ever since the divorce. Would you be happy to celebrate the 20th anniversary with her?




I remember watching the Ritz show on TV and the beeps were annoying!




/jarmo

well, friendship and marrige are two very different  things.. look how many other bands, who split because they hated eachother, and put it all behind and got together again.

In the 'Fire in Malibu...' thread ppbebe provided this link to someone asking about Axl's interest in supporting organisations working to help abused children and, interestingly, it also provides an answer to your question.  So, just in case you haven't seen it, here's the relevant question and answer, and the link below.

RS: There are purists who prefer the raw vibe that bands like the Sex Pistols had and that Guns n' Roses had in the early days.

Axl: Yeah, well, there are people who like a girl that had the same haircut she had ten years ago, too. I understand that. I understand that a lot. But it's like, we're evolving, and it's us. I read a quote where David Bowie was saying that Pink Floyd was Syd Barrett to him. I'm like "Yeah, but to deny anything that Pink Floyd's done after that?" Certain elements of our music and our performance and our attitude are still there, but we're not the same people we were then. Maybe it would've been best for the purists if we'd died or broken up. Then they'd get to keep it the way they liked it.

http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/articles/showarticle.php?articleid=56

It's a great interview and one that I hadn't read in a long, long time.  So, thanks ppbebe, for reminding me.   : ok:

In the interest of not starting another thread, HMV have a Gn'R double dvd entitled Appetite for Destruction on film, 20 year anniversary.  Unofficial I think( it must be!), but has interview with Dizzy, live clip of DotF at Farm Aid. Has Mama kin too. All plus the usual SCOM, PC etc.

Wow, thanks ppbebe! It's been a long time since I read that...

This thing fits nicely to nowadays:

One thing I want to say is, these aren't excuses. I'm not trying to get out of something. The bottom line is, each person is responsible for what they say and what they do. And I'm responsible for everything I've said and everything I've done, whether I want to be or not. So these aren't excuses. They're just facts, and they're things I'm dealing with. And if you've got a real problem with it, don't come to the show. If you gotta be home at fucking midnight, don't bother. Do yourself a favor. I'm not telling you to come -- I don't think that I'd want to. If you've got a problem with me trying to deal with my shit and doing the show the best I can, then just don't come, man. It's not a problem. Just stay the fuck away. Because you're getting something out of it, but I'm also there for myself. I've got a lot of work to do. A lot of work to do. I've done about seven years' worth of therapy in a year, but it takes a lot of energy. And Guns n' Roses takes a lot of energy. It's a weird pressure to try to deal with both at the same time. And I'm gonna do it the best I can when I can and how I can. And I'm the judge of that--not anybody in the crowd.

How do you think all of this will affect your songwriting?

I really think that the next official Guns n' Roses record, or the next thing I do, at least, will take some dramatic turns that people didn't expect and show the growth. I don't want to be the twenty-three-year-old misfit that I was. I don't want to be that person.

Who do you want to be?

I guess I like who I am now. I'd like to have a little more internal peace. I'm sure everybody would.
   
 

so a purist in GnR terms is someone who is anal about spelling?

Step off, assface. I've seen the new band three different times, including their first show (with Buckethead and Paul Huge).

I think you need to cool it on the name calling.   All I did was state a point and ask a question, which you didn't answer.

Also, for those of you who talk about "the past is the past," like it's something Axl disavowed, why have they played the majority of Appetite on the last three tours? That's been the bulk of their setlist. And you want to believe there's no reason to discuss or even think about the past in relation to the present? As Stuart Smalley once said, denial ain't just a river in Egypt.  :P

why do you call yourself a purist johnnyblood?

IMO, this Floyd analogy by 1992 Axl is contradicting his ?purist vs evolving? theory.



Even after Syd was out of the band, his "sound" was still the "Floyd sound" and a lot of their songs were written either about him or about his influence on how they looked at the world around themselves.  IMO, the basis for ?anything that Pink Floyd?s done after that? was Syd?s struggle to find ?more internal peace.?

So, 1992 Axl shouldn't have compared the evolution of GNR to the 'Floyd after Syd' because what GNR evolved into in 1992 was something completely different than 1987 GNR.

Just like 2008 GNR evolved into something totally different than 1992 GNR.  The current band's influences come from a wide variety of places which does include the band?s history but only inasmuch as the common denominator  to both past and present is Axl.


Rest in Peace, Syd.  May God bless your soul with His Peace.  :)

Why the fascination with this word "purist"? You seem to be probing for some type of conspiracy here. Do you not understand the term as it's used in the modern English language. Hell, in regular old conversational English? Or do you feel there's some type of hidden communist message in the word? I think I answered the question of why I'm a purist with my original post, which for unknown reasons you saw fit to pick apart and analyze as though the literal words I used have some sort of double-meaning. Well they don't Jim Bob. What I said is what I meant. To me, that era of the band was the best. No more no less. If you can't connect the dots with all that help then you never will. Good lord. And while we're here, am I still allowed to like the new band, even though I don't think it's as good as the old one? Can I still root for Axl? Or is there a secret blood contract that you have to sign to the new band saying you'll never, ever, for the love of AXL, think fondly of the version of the band that's actually released an album?

And went on to become huge again. Aerosmith is the perfect example.

To Continue that: than you re-marry, promising things are going to be totally different, but spend the next 15 years revisiting past memories with the new wife and never really do anything different

because it sounds stupid.   and i can see this means you are simply one of those people i refer to in my sig.   :hihi:

Ran out of ideas eh? Or should we say, never had one in the first place? Good night Jim Bob. Happy living! : ok:

I sat down tonight and started watching GN'R Live at the Ritz and realized it has been 20 years since that show.  Now for me this show was my first real introduction to Guns other than Welcome To The Jungle and Sweet Child O' Mine.  This show was February 2nd 1988 and I got to watch it on Much Music a few months later...and the anticipation building up to get to watch this show was nuts.  I was 14 and that day was the longest ever...waiting for it to air on Much Music that night.  We didn't have a VCR then, so I recorded it with my little stereo sitting in front of the TV...that is how I listened to it for a long time after before I got a copy of the concert on video.  I can still remember the tape ending and having to flip it over during Knocking on Heaven's door.  Anyway, this is the purest rock concert ever filmed and for Guns it is the purest Pro shot ever filmed before that got insanely big.  Man 20 years...what the fuck!!!!  Why isn't there a 20th year Anniversary release of this on DVD!!!!  :peace:

My personal take on the Ritz show:

The band was drunk/on drugs it seems and they were more interested in looking cool than actually sounding cool. Guitars/bass out of tune, missing many notes/chords/entire parts of songs, Axl is not in his best form, and they have that drummer who just isn't good on drums, high or clean doesn't matter.

Seriously, this was a "look we are r&r and we know how to pose like that" show and many seem to like that. Was the show energetic? Yes, but musically this was very poor. Take their Paris 1992 show (broadcast live all over the world) ... that one rips this Ritz thing to pieces on all levels.

Ritz show, overrated as Mcdonalds junkfood  :peace:

yeah, slash said the same in his book, wich got me thinking how much better could they be... cuz this show is awesome!

I think this show is cool, Slash looks particularly fucked up during the pc outro. I always thought that GNR were their best and coolest on that first leg of the UYI tour very, very unpredictable.

Only remeber beatifuls.

Thakz

 :)

HBK *

That's what a rock show is though...if you want a bunch of sober guys playing there instruments in key and pitch perfect than go see an orchestra.
The band definetly moved on and became more professional and put on some wicked shows...but the Ritz is just an example of a really raw gritty rock show! And defenitely no what you refer to it as "McDonald's junkfood"

Still the best show i have ever heard! Its so easy,jungle,all great!

Rock n' roll is more than playing with technical precision.  This was a band in February of 88 that was about to explode all over the world.  I love watching them play on the small stage like this and since it was professionally shot it stands as a unique piece of GN'R history.  I disagree about your view that they were trying to look cool and pose because they didn't have to try at all...they were the coolest motherfuckers ever.  Look at rock n' roll today and note the differences.  Everything today is manufactured bullshit. 

The Ritz was one of the best shows EVER! You could tell that this was a band on  the edge of rock. Although they were drunk and high, the
passion, determination, and balls  to make it was  displayed during this show. It really defines the quintessential spirit of Guns N' Roses!

Guns N Roses at Ritz DEFINES what Rock N Roll is about , the dirty , the raw , the real. Nothing ever gets more real than that performance , everything is so in your face. It embodies to me what GN'R stands for " Fuck you , we play rock n roll , we play it loud , and if you don't like it FUCK OFF"  : ok: :beer: :drool:

You said it.





/jarmo

aahah, nicely put :)

That's exactly what some former members were about.

Ok, I am making a few notes after your comments about my post:

- ultimate R&R is about being off key, missing parts of songs and pretend it's cool because you are high, wearing a tight leather pants and jumping into the crowd.

- R&R is not about making music sound as good as possible.... no, it is about the other trivial quasi-macho stuff, that's what makes a gig "amazing", not what you hear.

- people who want to hear music played as good as possible must listen to classical music.

That's what I got from you, correct?

 : ok:

I never could understand why this wasn't released on video, it was so cool, I recorded it off the BBC programme Heavy Metal Heaven and then proceeded to watch it about 5000 times along with Faith No More's 'You Fat Bastards' video every saturday afternoon.

I'd quite happily buy it again if it was released as an official DVD, would be cool if they included the songs that were left out of the MTV version though (kinda reminds me of the Song Remains the Same how songs are left out)

More or less...hell if you don't like it, I'm sure there are some really neat N'Sync videos on YouTube that have some nice clean cut, rehearsed and sober performances for your tastes.  Macho is Rock N' Roll - look at Robert Plant, James Hetfield, Elvis...etc.

Advising me Nsync, nice move, shows your intelligence.  Who said something about nice clean cut, I said I want quality and Ritz ain't got it, don't twist things around. That's the thing, if I have a different opinion than some here then I must go listen to Mozart and Nsync, lol.

But I'm glad you confessed that to you R&R is not about the music but about the fake macho posing ;)

They can go and pretend they are macho alpha males from Mars but as long as the music doesn't sound worse because of it....on the Ritz gig the music suffers, clearly.

Plant isn't macho, he's actually very feminine, Hetfield is more like an in the closet cowboy and Elvis is just a pretty white boy for girls.

I said Paris 1992 show is better on all fronts. Ritz is a poseur thing, even Slash said so  :peace:

and its also about it being 'raw' and 'real',  whatever that means.  ::)

Wow so ANYTHING regarding the old band you just dislike? Raw and Real means that it wasn't over produced or over done a la Tokyo 92 , a back up band etc. It was Raw as in it was just them and their instruments , nothing more nothing less, It was real in the sense that you felt  a connection to how they were on stage , they weren't Guns N Roses the famous rockstars , they were 5 guys who you could have a drink with...

I'm blown out of my mind so I'm not sure if that made ANY sense  :hihi:

Do you see the hypocracy in feeling that your words are getting twisted yet your reply to my comments does exactly that to my words?  Playing well is a part of what makes a show good but there is more to a great rock n' roll show.  Rock n' roll is about attitude and the Ritz show is just a glimpse of a band that had plenty of it.  Again, since this was the only pro shot concert of that time period, it reflects what the band was at that time before they moved into the superstar level.  If I want to hear a flawless performance I can listen to the cd.  Now this is not to say that I'd enjoy it if they destroyed the songs, but I won't complain about a few missed notes and other assorted mistakes.  If I had to show a kid just getting into music today what GN'R was all about I'd show them the Ritz show before anything else.  February 1988 was not far removed from them living on the streets and all of the things that inspired those songs.  All of that make this a great show to watch and look back and remember how it all began.  Paris was amazing and yes, definitely a better performance, but to no fault of their own they were a whole different monster by that point.  Thats just the nature of how they evolved and I wouldn't want it any other way because anything else would have been phoney. 

It makes me smile to see so many here defending the rock n' roll attitude.

Let's remember that the next time GN'R tours!  : ok:




/jarmo

"They're gonna think we're the sloppiest band in the world. But I really don't give a fuck!"  : ok:

Going slightly off topic here but  for me a big change in the current 2006/2007 line up performances is how raw and dirty and badass they sound compared to the more polished and sometimes perfect musicanship of the buckethead era.
Now they seem to get lost in the moment and and are actually having a great fucking time, who gives a fuck about a few bum notes here and there, its a live show for the audience in the room, not to be analyzed by nerds sitting at home.

\

The Ritz was a show without the pizzaz and flash...it was bare bones, down to the core rock n' roll...if you can't accept that than move on.  Paris is a great show but the band had move to a whole new level by then, they had money and a ton of behind the scenes personnel working on lights and sound...it's still great rock n roll but it doesnt have the raw attitude of the Ritz. 

And who cares if it doesn't start at 9PM and end before 11PM.. It's rock n' roll!  : ok:




/jarmo

Hell if it ends at 11 that ain't rock n roll now is it lol  : ok:

As Tommy Stinson once said, "Get on board or FUCK OFF!"

this has to be one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen you say.

I know it's kindof whiny to say, but I wish that Axl would address the crowd more during shows. Maybe he's saving his voice or something, but I love the crowd interaction.

That's one thing that's so cool about the Ritz shows. They are afterall, a bit smaller, but when he yells out into the crowd "hey...guy what did you say....I like that" that stuff is awesome. But then again the downloading motherf'r line was pretty awesome.

Speaking of rock star posers, nothing beats the 91-93 era of Guns N' Roses when it comes to being rock star posers.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=lMALbAlvnM8

That's how they look on stage , that's something people like. They weren't huge and famous , they weren't AXL ROSE and SLASH , they were just axl rose and slash you know. Obviously many people here know what I'm saying and agree that the Ritz is a perfect display of what GN"R was about.

Yeah, great clip.  Reminded me alot of Warrant or Bon Jovi.  :hihi:

I've tried watching the Ritz show and it's not bad...it's just not anywhere near my favorite GNR shows.  Favorite shows usually aren't set in stone, but two I thoroughly enjoy are Chicago, April '92, and Paris June, '92.  In my opinion, Axl gives a better performance in that era compared to the early days.  Just my opinion.  It's similar to my preference for GNR '06-'07 compared to '00-'02.  For some reason I prefer Axl's voice and on-stage energy more in '90-'93 and '06-'07 than '86-'89, '00-'02.

All that said, c'mon it's Axl, it's GNR, every era is awesome and blows all other bands away.   :yes:  :peace: 

Voice is one thing, but energy? His energy was OFF THE CHARTS during that Ritz show.

true man.  I'll give ya that!  I am a sucker for the sustained screams, occasional piano ballads, and band members moving all over the stage.  It's all subjective.  Like I said, it's GNR, it's quality!  :yes: 

Wow, I cannot believe you don't LOVE the Ritz show.  I remember watching the original airing of it and basically it sealed my love of GNR forever.  It wasn't long after that I got to experience my 1st GNR show but the Ritz was the 1st live appearance of theirs I had seen so I always have a special place for it. 

Yeah, I didn't have cable until a couple years after the Ritz, and as such, I hadn't seen the show.  My first exposure to GNR was mainly AFD and Lies on tape and cd along with the videos on MTV and the uyi cds later on.  My first live stuff exposure was Buffalo '92 with Metallica and Faith no More.  After that, I got to see the Tokyo UYI videos and then my fav., the Paris '92 video.
The Paris video got stolen from my house at a party I threw, but whaddaya gonna do?  It was a killer party.  ;D  So, long story short, I think we're all a little influenced by the shows we see first.  The Ritz was a first love type show for lots of folks and that's cool.  Like I said, it's GNR, it's allll good.   8)

 I don't care if they wanna start later just make it clear on the fucking ticket  ::)

Someone is talkin' other people words... Again...   :drool:

Maybe you could suggest it to the promoters?



First we have people here defending the rock n' roll attitude, and now we have one person wishing to have some kind of advance "warning" on the tickets that rock shows don't start at 9PM sharp.   :hihi:


Often concert tickets state when doors open and the show itself starts. The show usually starts with an opening act. So if the ticket says 8PM, it doesn't mean the main act (in this case, GN'R) will be on at 8PM. ;)




/jarmo

just to be fair, scabbie asks for a fair and reasonable disclaimer on the ticket. not all of the people that go to the shows know that they may go on at 1 or 2 am. you and i know that, but most of the other people dont know that. they have kids and work. i think its just fair to let them know about it. as for us, we dont care and we dont need to know, but most people who go to the shows are not on your board.

again the Ritz88 is still only an average show from that band era, as famous as it is, that doesnt mean they made much much better ones. please please try to get the audio from this show -only half a year later- and imagine that being the one to be "proshotted" for tv airing:

August 02nd 1988 - Market Square Arena, Indianapolis, IN

it blows away Ritz88 so easily performance-wise  : ok:

Wasn't the Melbourne 88 show proshot too (even tho the quality sucks)?

Anyways, it's like what people says about RAR. Isn't their best performance, but the quality of the recoding is way too good for people who often don't judge the performance of the song in itself.

I don't care much about Ritz 88. Just the Marquee show (which is soundboard too) blows away this one. And I'm sure their attitude at the time (which seems to be praised by so many) was there too.

Yes, Melbourne was pro shot. i think that show was just average. as for the marquee, that show was insane. ritz 87 better than ritz 88 imo, but i enjoyed both....

I'm not talking about half and hour here or there, most people have been to gigs to know to expect this, I've been to quite a few of those. I'm talking about gigs like Hammersmith where the band didn't come on until 11pm or so. The underground stops at 12, therefore, rock n'roll or not, it puts lots of people out of place, especially on 'school nights'.



 

When I was at the 23rd Sydney show, I was front floor GA,
and While we were all waiting In line,
A lady came around with a clipboard asking everyone if they will be catching trains to get home after the concert,
so they could get a rough estimate on how many trains they should run overtime, The Next day
Axl was in the state paper for saying that he disrupted the timetables of all the trains,
and how late hes show ran and how it disrupted everything...

At the same token, If gnr dont want any more bad publicity, they should have some warning on their ticket,
or at least warn the local transport system ahead of time, instead of hiring someone a few hours before the concert starts
to do a quick count of heads,
It just disrupts the whole balance of things temporarily, all because of the NON die hard fans
not knowing that when Gnr says 8-9 oclock, what they really mean is Closer to 12:00 then anything,
I know that If I wasnt a die hard gnr fan, and I was unprepared I would really be f@cked off...

I'm up in the air on this late starting time. I agree people have kid's with sitters and all. Work, I don't know, it's not like no one has ever come in little "under the wheather". Come on, it's once in a blue moon. It's not like GNR are playing your city every week or every 5 years for that matter. I do think it sucks when there are no chairs on the floor and your waiting forever, especially for those who travelled far to get to the gig. Anyhoo I remember in 91 at the first show in Toronto, they came on late as fuck (2nd show was the same, I honestly they weren't gonna show up, this was before the riots and no shows) just before Estranged Axl let everyone know from the stage that the last train/streetcar was leaving in 5 minutes but no one left that mother of a show...I was lucky I drove my piece of shit Chevette to the show and paid an arm and a leg for parking. 

If it were me and I had tickets to see GNR on a weeknight or whatever night for that matter, and lets even say that I have kids, just knowing GNR and their lack of stability for being on time would be my first clue to #1 take next day off of work and #2 take children to grandparent or relative overnight, and last use your own transportation.  :) ;D :beer:

But because your a gnr fan,
you know that the time gnr hit the stage is rarely before midnight,
To the casual fan that goes to the shows due to the nastalgia factor, that couldnt tell you 1
member in the current gnr other then axl, wouldnt have a clue that the starting time is so late,
And when your waiting at the ga floor, after you paid 170$ for the ticket, to wait for nearly 2 hours
just standing, 2 cms from everyone, dehidrated , could all be made alot easier on people
if a little communication on gnr's/promoters half was involved
Like I said, Im not dissing how much of a great fucking show gnr can put on,
But when you hear people complaining ,and are practicially collapsing due to heat exhaustion/dehydration.
then thats when the Line is met....

just my 2 centz

     I don't know exactly, but the gigs are booked with a starting time and a closing anytime after that, the band gets fined by the time they went over the closing time. By god I don't want to bring Slash into this but in his book he says GNR spent a load of cash on  curfews, union fees and overtime. Of course whoever built it, has to take it down. and get the fuck out. It could also be a reason for shitty sound at GNR gigs sometimes because the crew didn't have sufficient time to set up, just saying I don't know and don't work on their crew but it makes sense.

Part of the problem I think is that the fine itself doesn't find its way back to the inconvenienced consumer (for example to help pay for a taxi when the underground has stopped). Certainly in the UK the council like to pocket the money.

In some ways I'd love it if GN'R booked a concert to start late in the evening. Nightclubs have DJs going late, I'm not sure why bands are treated differently. Would give me some more time to have a few more beers before the gig starts.

Back to the original discussion though, does anyone know if GNR ever planned to release this, or was it exclusive to MTV?

GNR will never be able to perform at the Ritz level anymore. Even if a reunion happened.
All we can do is enjoy that video, but it'll never happen again, sadly.

Ever heard of a nightbus?

Well you do have a ligit point in regards to the casual fan. :)