Representative Foley turns out to be a secret card-carrying member of NAMBLA.

[The Dog]

Do you think they should be out too?

They are saying Hastert will be out by this time next week............

Who is they?  "they" said Rummy should have been out years ago 

I think this is going to go pretty deep.  A full investigation is going to reveal A LOT.

[SLCPUNK]

Do you think they should be out too?

They are saying Hastert will be out by this time next week............

Who is they?  "they" said Rummy should have been out years ago 

I think this is going to go pretty deep.  A full investigation is going to reveal A LOT.

Joe Scarborough for one.

Yea, it's a full blown storm now. I also think boys will come forward and admit to having sex with Foley too (just my guess.)

[Guns N RockMusic]

Do you think they should be out too?

They are saying Hastert will be out by this time next week............

Who is they?? "they" said Rummy should have been out years ago?

I think this is going to go pretty deep.? A full investigation is going to reveal A LOT.

Joe Scarborough for one.

Yea, it's a full blown storm now. I also think boys will come forward and admit to having sex with Foley too (just my guess.)

Guess or hope?

[Guns N RockMusic]

So in essence SLC, you want to hold the whole GOP accountable for the actions of a few men?  You quickly discount all the Dems who endorsed/authorized the Iraq War.  Is it fair to hold someone accountable for the actions of another simply because they share the same political ideology?  I'll admit that I fall victim to this as well, but I try to prevent myself from doing so.  You'll never hear me saying that all Dems drive a girl over a bridge in their car and leave her to die, just because one Democrat did so.  With all respect, your politcial prediction are what 0-2 at this point?  Regardless of the view of congress or parties nationwide, it's a fact that people "remove" their own congressman from this view.  The Republicans/Democrats are morons, but MY congressman isn't bad.

[Drew]

It is all wrong. But you didn't ask for my opinion. You asked for the right wing crown.

Now do you agree with me? Or is your silence self telling?

Makes two of what?

What is your statement/question?

That both parties are a national disgrace. Both smear and lie and are full of of corruption.

[sandman]

It is all wrong. But you didn't ask for my opinion. You asked for the right wing crown.

Now do you agree with me? Or is your silence self telling?

Makes two of what?

What is your statement/question?

That both parties are a national disgrace. Both smear and lie and are full of of corruption.

one of the few intelligent, true statements in this thread.

the republican party better get off their ass and figure out who knew what. take Hastert into a room and say "listen you fat bastard, what did you know and when did you know it?" they cannot just sit and say "well we got rid of foley." they need to know exactly who else knew and get them out as well.

pilosi says it well....

"The children, their parents, the public, and our colleagues deserve answers and those who covered up Mark Foley's behavior must be held accountable," Pelosi said.

[sandman]

So much for the idea this was an "October Surprise". Republicans now calling each other liars. Turns out it wasn't a surprise at all. All of them were warned years ago by Foley's own Chief of Staff about this child molester.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061005/ap_on_go_co/congress_pages

However, I think it unfair for Democrats to label him as a pedophile for political reasons when it doesn't appear (at this time) that he engaged in homosexual activity with minors.

This guy sent emails asking 15 and 16 year old boys to engage in sex with him, because Bud Fox read the emails where he was doing exactly that and ABC News has proof they were written by him. It's called "attempted sexual assault of a minor" dumb ass.

actually, before you go calling people "DUMB ASS" you should make sure you have your facts right.

you're incorrect. that alone is not a crime. although it should be. but the dems vote against it all the time. so we have a huge ray area (see article below), which is unfortunate. 

ever see Dateline when they trap sexual predators - those shows are the best!!


Views diverge on whether Foley will face charges

By Susan Spencer-Wendel
Palm Beach Post Staff Writer
Thursday, October 05, 2006

Is former U.S. Rep. Mark Foley's explicit e-mail talk with teenage boys a crime?

It's a question many are asking, with many possible answers.
 
Tawdry text alone may be offensive but not illegal, attorneys and federal investigators have said. But what it led to or might lead to ? including search warrants and further probing ? is a tale still untold.

Foley's attorney, David Roth, said Tuesday that Foley accepts responsibility for the "totally inappropriate" e-mails and instant messages, but denies any actual contact with the teens.

"He reiterates unequivocally that he has never had sexual contact with a minor," Roth said.

If Foley never had sex with the boys, his case is in uncertain legal territory, said Ken Lanning, a retired FBI agent who served as one of the agency's leading experts on child exploitation.

"There are going to be some issues here in the gray area," Lanning said. "You may find this behavior repulsive, offensive or immoral. Whether it's a violation of law will be based on a precise reading of the law."

One accomplished Miami defense attorney, though, pointed to a federal law commonly known as the "enticement statute." The law punishes a person who knowingly "persuades, induces, entices or coerces" anyone under 18 to engage in criminal sexual activity or even attempts to do so.

Foley voted in 2003 to enhance the penalties for the crime. The sentence now is a minimum of five years and a maximum of 30 years in prison.

Attorney Douglas Williams read the law and read Foley's messages, which referred to masturbation among other things.

"I would say that a reasonable, conservative government lawyer would not be out of bounds or risk-taking if he or she indicted based upon what I read," Williams said.

It would be a battle of titans, though.

"We are at a place where politics and law enforcement are about to have a collision as violent as a bull rhino and rogue elephant," Williams said.

Attorney Mark Johnson of Stuart, a former 15-year federal prosecutor, also thought of that federal enticement law as he read the Foley messages revealed to date. "In those e-mails, he certainly tiptoes dangerously close to the line," Johnson said.

Both the Florida Department of Law Enforcement and the FBI have acknowledged conducting "preliminary investigations" of Foley's conduct, although FDLE Commissioner Gerald Bailey said the FBI has begun the process of seizing computers from Foley's homes and offices, the St. Petersburg Times reported Wednesday. Several news outlets also reported that the Justice Department ordered House officials to preserve records of Foley's electronic correspondence with teenagers.

FDLE spokesman Tom Berlinger would not confirm or comment on warrants or seizures of Foley's computers. Berlinger said it was a "truly preliminary inquiry" to see if any Florida laws had been broken.

Berlinger cited a chapter of child-abuse law that deals with sexual performance of children, some crimes of which are punishable by up to 30 years in prison.

"The question is, what is a prosecutor willing to prosecute?" Berlinger said. "You know that one man's lurid is another man's church-going stuff."

The Internet transcripts released by ABC News look like the conversations police often use in Internet sex stings. In those cases, however, the sex talk leads to an arrest when adults arrive for real sexual encounters.

Locally, a priest, a rabbi, a prosecutor and a number of married men have been arrested after showing up to meet people they thought were teens.

Graphic talk alone is rarely enough, said Joseph Dooley, a former agent who helped set up New England's first FBI unit targeting Internet predators. Many adults engage in explicit chats with undercover agents but never show up for the scheduled meetings, he said.

"We never charged anyone unless they actually traveled to have sex," Dooley said.

Locally, defense attorney Jack Fleischman has defended a number of people caught in Internet sex stings. In all of his cases, there was an active solicitation of a sexual act. "Just straight language would be a tough road to charge it," he said.

ABC News, which first reported the messages, detailed an intriguing new Internet exchange that could lead investigators elsewhere. In April 2003, ABC reported, Foley allegedly wrote to an underage page:

Maf54: I miss you lots since san diego.

[The Dog]

I think if he talked about meeting up/scheduling a time/place to meet then he could be convicted.  But so far all it seems it was is talk. 

Like I've said before, Foley's mess up is bad, but Hastert and Shimkus are the real scum bags here.  I think Foley was just a tormented person - if the alcoholism and sexual molestation is true (and theres no reason to think its not) then he was a victim himself and the cycle was just continuing (doesn't excuse his behavior, but explains it??)  But Hastert and Shimkus were only worried about the GOP and the # of Rep. congressman.  Ironically, had they told Foley to resign 3 years ago when they were alledgeldy told about all of this, even if they told him to resign in 2005, they could have found someone else to replace him, have the new guys name on the ballot and EASILY hold the seat.  Foleys district is very republican.  instead, they turned their backs on their colleauge (and the kids you could say) and only cared about politics, not their "friend" or the well being of some young kids.  Pretty disgraceful.

[SLCPUNK]

That both parties are a national disgrace. Both smear and lie and are full of of corruption.

I have never seen Dems smear and lie like these bunch of fuckers do. So the answer is no. Smear jobs on the kids by the right wing media is about as low as you can get (after trying to smear a grieving war mother of course.)

Are there bad guys on both sides of the aisle? You bet. But this administration has been one of the worst I have ever seen in my life. The common defense "They are all corrupt" is totally lame. It lacks accountability on so many levels; a quick way to get rid of the mess in front of you.

[SLCPUNK]

So in essence SLC, you want to hold the whole GOP accountable for the actions of a few men?  You quickly discount all the Dems who endorsed/authorized the Iraq War.  Is it fair to hold someone accountable for the actions of another simply because they share the same political ideology? 

It has nothing to do with their "political ideology." You are still making excuses for these scumbags aren't you?

I am holding the GOP run Congress accountable (and rightfully so) because they knew about it and turned their backs on what was going on. It was in their own self interest that they ignored Foley's "naughty emails" for their political gain. Therefore the right wing should be slammed for this, as it was their dirty little secret.

Wanna make some more excuses for those who protect child molesters? This is right along the line of "blindly hating Bush" argument you guys use. Of course, nobody could disapprove of Bush because of his actions, they must just "blindly" hate him. This is the same "logic" you are using here.

Guess or hope?

Both. Get these lying sack of shit murderers and child molesters out of our Congress and White house.

[GeorgeSteele]

Drudge Blames Kids for Foley?s Actions

Drudge transcript from FireDogLake:

Clip #1:? And if anything, these kids are less innocent ? these 16 and 17 year-old beasts?and I've seen what they're doing on YouTube and I've seen what they're doing all over the internet ? oh yeah ? you just have to tune into any part of their pop culture.? You're not going to tell me these are innocent babies.? Have you read the transcripts that ABC posted going into the weekend of these instant messages, back and forth?? The kids are egging the Congressman on!? The kids are trying to get this out of him.? We haven't got the whole story on this.


Clip #2: You could say ?well Drudge, it?s abuse of power, a congressman abusing these impressionable, young 17 year-old beasts, talking about their sex lives with a grown man, on the internet.? Because you have to remember, those of us who have seen some of the transcripts of these nasty instant messages. This was two ways, ladies and gentlemen. These kids were playing Foley for everything he was worth. Oh yeah. Oh, I haven?t...they were talking about how many times they?d masturbated, how many times they?d done it with their girlfriends this weekend...all these things and these ?innocent children.? And this ?poor? congressman sitting there typing, ?oh am I going to get any,? you know?

Fox's dirty tricks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mn7qCzV5sNM

It gets better, now Drudge says the entire scandal was a prank... 

XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX THU OCT 5 2006 2:53:48 ET XXXXX

CLAIM: FILTHY FOLEY ONLINE MESSAGES WERE PAGE PRANK GONE AWRY
**World Exclusive**
**Must Credit the DRUDGE REPORT**

According to two people close to former congressional page Jordan Edmund, the now famous lurid AOL Instant Message exchanges that led to the resignation of Mark Foley were part of an online prank that by mistake got into the hands of enemy political operatives, the DRUDGE REPORT can reveal.

According to one Oklahoma source who knows the former page very well, Edmund, a conservative Republican, goaded Foley to type embarrassing comments that were then shared with a small group of young Hill politicos. The prank went awry when the saved IM sessions got into the hands of political operatives favorable to Democrats. This source, an ally of Edmund, also adamantly proclaims that the former page is not a homosexual. The prank scenario was confirmed by a second associate of Edmund.

The news come on the heels that former FBI Chief Louis Freeh has been named to investigate the mess.

[The Dog]

It gets better, now Drudge says the entire scandal was a prank... 

XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX THU OCT 5 2006 2:53:48 ET XXXXX

CLAIM: FILTHY FOLEY ONLINE MESSAGES WERE PAGE PRANK GONE AWRY
**World Exclusive**
**Must Credit the DRUDGE REPORT**

According to two people close to former congressional page Jordan Edmund, the now famous lurid AOL Instant Message exchanges that led to the resignation of Mark Foley were part of an online prank that by mistake got into the hands of enemy political operatives, the DRUDGE REPORT can reveal.

According to one Oklahoma source who knows the former page very well, Edmund, a conservative Republican, goaded Foley to type embarrassing comments that were then shared with a small group of young Hill politicos. The prank went awry when the saved IM sessions got into the hands of political operatives favorable to Democrats. This source, an ally of Edmund, also adamantly proclaims that the former page is not a homosexual. The prank scenario was confirmed by a second associate of Edmund.

The news come on the heels that former FBI Chief Louis Freeh has been named to investigate the mess.

Ploys like this MIGHT have worked a few years ago....but the American public has FINALLY wised up to Karl Rove-esque rebuttals and attacks from those on the right.  I honestly love stuff like this b/c it shows they are desperate.  I also like how the Dems are FINALLY on the attack when stuff like this comes up.  Is it political...yeah, it is.  Should it be?  um, YEAH.   This is just more evidence of an administration/party that has no clue how to handle things internally or externally.  its a f'ing mess right now.

[The Dog]

I agree Hanna, regardless of intent, his actions were extremely inappropriate and probably illegal.  He has no business being a congressman and I'm glad he's out.

I don't think the issue is agreeing if his actions were bad....I don't think many will support his actions.

How do you feel about the actions of Hastert and Shimkus though?  To me what they did (burying their heads in the sand) is worse.  Foley was a victim and everyone knows in cases of sexual/physical abuse the abuse can go on and on (not that it justifies it in ANY way).  Foleys "friends" did nothing to help him or the pages or any future pages Foley might have talked to or possibly met up with.

Do you think they should be out too?

FLAGG, are you going to reply to my question??? 

[Guns N RockMusic]

I agree Hanna, regardless of intent, his actions were extremely inappropriate and probably illegal.? He has no business being a congressman and I'm glad he's out.

I don't think the issue is agreeing if his actions were bad....I don't think many will support his actions.

How do you feel about the actions of Hastert and Shimkus though?? To me what they did (burying their heads in the sand) is worse.? Foley was a victim and everyone knows in cases of sexual/physical abuse the abuse can go on and on (not that it justifies it in ANY way).? Foleys "friends" did nothing to help him or the pages or any future pages Foley might have talked to or possibly met up with.

Do you think they should be out too?

FLAGG, are you going to reply to my question?

I refuse to excuse Foley or look at him as a victim.  Foley was perfectly aware that his actions were wrong and possibly illegal.  To what extent Hastert knew is anyone's guess.  The media has a rabid taste for anything anti-republican and will stretch the truth to make headlines.  We all remember the incident with Rather and Bush a couple years ago.  Foley is gone and he should be.  No real effort was made by aides to correct the problem, if they were concerned they would have gone to the media (as they did now).  Anyone who knows anythning about Washington knows that some little page doesn't just walk up to the speaker of the house and file a complaint.  Is Hastert guilty?  I don't know.  If all they knew was that Foley was gay, how do you address or correct that?  Alot of gaps in the information exists, and unfortunately it's being filled with assumptions and hopes.

[HamsterDemocracy]

I wrote a song about Mark Foley, I may post it in my poetry thread later.

[Drew]

I have never seen Dems smear and lie like these bunch of fuckers do. So the answer is no. Smear jobs on the kids by the right wing media is about as low as you can get (after trying to smear a grieving war mother of course.)

Are there bad guys on both sides of the aisle? You bet. But this administration has been one of the worst I have ever seen in my life. The common defense "They are all corrupt" is totally lame. It lacks accountability on so many levels; a quick way to get rid of the mess in front of you.

Howard Dean is a prime example of smearing and lying.

All politicians hide and lack accountability. There are alof of people who need to be gone for good. Both Republicans and Democracts. Democrats need to look in the mirror before they yell pedophile too loudly. There are alot of organizations such as previosuly mentioned by me, the ACLU & NAMBLA that run close ties and links with the Democractic party.

[The Dog]

I have never seen Dems smear and lie like these bunch of fuckers do. So the answer is no. Smear jobs on the kids by the right wing media is about as low as you can get (after trying to smear a grieving war mother of course.)

Are there bad guys on both sides of the aisle? You bet. But this administration has been one of the worst I have ever seen in my life. The common defense "They are all corrupt" is totally lame. It lacks accountability on so many levels; a quick way to get rid of the mess in front of you.

Howard Dean is a prime example of smearing and lying.

All politicians hide and lack accountability. There are alof of people who need to be gone for good. Both Republicans and Democracts. Democrats need to look in the mirror before they yell pedophile too loudly. There are alot of organizations such as previosuly mentioned by me, the ACLU & NAMBLA that run close ties and links with the Democractic party.

oh please.  This is almost as lame of an answer as the crap Hastert and Drudge and the other douches are spewing these days.  "yeah we are bad...but...but SO ARE YOU!!!!"  Its so childish.  I agree with SLC here.

Please PM me and let me know what the "close ties" are with NAMBLA and the Democratic party.  I am DYING to know. I mean, give me a break dude, thats gotta be one of the DUMBEST things I've ever read on this site. hahahah.   And like I've said in previous posts, we're not talking about the Dems in this thread.  They're not the ones in the midst of an investigation right now...the Reps are.  Stay on topic.  When the Dems have a scandal that threatens their majority in congress then we can talk about them.

[Drew]

oh please.  This is almost as lame of an answer as the crap Hastert and Drudge and the other douches are spewing these days.  "yeah we are bad...but...but SO ARE YOU!!!!"  Its so childish.  I agree with SLC here.

Please PM me and let me know what the "close ties" are with NAMBLA and the Democratic party.  I am DYING to know. I mean, give me a break dude, thats gotta be one of the DUMBEST things I've ever read on this site. hahahah.   And like I've said in previous posts, we're not talking about the Dems in this thread.  They're not the ones in the midst of an investigation right now...the Reps are.  Stay on topic.  When the Dems have a scandal that threatens their majority in congress then we can talk about them.

And the blind eye is turned once again.

The ties are that Democracts are in bed with the ACLUwhich is in bed with NAMBLA. How could a party associate themselves with an organization who supports NAMBA and fights for their rights to exist and exploit and put children in real danger?

So many people believe that it's only the Republicans who are evil and turn a deaf ear and blind eye to what Democrats are doing. Look at history, the Democrats always get a pass for their misbehavior.

[Bill 213]

Here's the newest fuckup from imdb.com


ABC Ignites Another Foley Controversy


ABC failed to block the screen name of one of the Congressional pages who had a sexually explicit online conversation with former Florida Congressman Mark Foley, and, as a result, a blog was able to track down his name and photograph. William Kerr of The Passionate America site, which originally posted the information, said that Foley's correspondent, who was just shy of his 18th birthday at the time of his initial instant messaging with Foley, is now 21 years old and is currently working as deputy campaign manager for Republican Congressman Ernest Istook of Oklahoma. On Wednesday, ABC issued a statement saying, "We go to great lengths to prevent the names of alleged sex crime victims from being revealed. On Friday there was a very brief technical glitch on our site which was overridden immediately. It is possible that during that very brief interval a screen name could have been captured. Reviews of the site since then show no unredacted screen names." Meanwhile House Speaker Dennis Hastert vowed to remain in his position despite calls for his resignation over his handling of the Foley case. He accused Democrats and ABC News of trying to "blow up" the controversy.

Oops!  Just shy???   Anyhow Hastert is fighting his ass off to keep his job.  Good luck douchebag.

[SLCPUNK]

Howard Dean is a prime example of smearing and lying.

All politicians hide and lack accountability. There are alof of people who need to be gone for good. Both Republicans and Democracts. Democrats need to look in the mirror before they yell pedophile too loudly. There are alot of organizations such as previosuly mentioned by me, the ACLU & NAMBLA that run close ties and links with the Democractic party.

Please provide me with an example of a Dean smear and lie

Also provide me with an example of how Nambla is related to the Dem party.

The ties are that Democracts are in bed with the ACLUwhich is in bed with NAMBLA. How could a party associate themselves with an organization who supports NAMBA and fights for their rights to exist and exploit and put children in real danger?

Interesting. I have never heard that the Dem party are tied in with ACLU before this.............

What a cop out.