Here Today... Gone To Hell!

I was at Best Buy today and saw that they had quite a few copies of CD ( they even had some on the same shelf as the new releases).  For $1.99!

They had a few LP's for that price also.

good, im going to pick up like 5 copies and give them to friends who refused to give a chance so they can see what morons they are.

I'd do the same.  Have to pop in and see if that's the case by me.

Maybe it's time to clear the shelves because release number 2 is on the horizon?

Ahhh, we can dream can't we?

WOW! I'll go tomorrow and buy another copy or two. Its not it was a bad album, but when ONE store gets the exclusive, they have every copy whereas other albums are spread around thousands of places.

It's on the website too.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Chinese+Democracy+-+CD/9111016.p?id=1925065&skuId=9111016&st=chinese%20democracy&lp=1&cp=1

Not trying to speculate or start a rumor.......... maybe they are clearing shelf space for the re-issue?

Well there is no excuse now for people to buy this album by the bucketload and share with their friends : ok:

awesome, i need another copy since my disc is scratched now haha

There`s nothing wrong with that, the album`s almost 2 1/2 years old we have albums that go on sale only a few months after being released here in th uk, hopefully people might buy it just to see what all the hype was about and hopefully enjoy it like we have and continue to do  : ok:

It's probably just some promotional price. I'm going to grab some extra copies today when I get the chance. But when CD was listed for 7.99 everyone was like "what's going on", then a few weeks later a Lady Gaga album and some other new cds were listed for the same price.

Chinese Democracy for $1.99 might be the best deal ever !!!

I think the cd is worth 1.99  don't you think? i mean i would buy it! Its a great deal!

Even the casual fans who don't have it, will buy it now. But its kind of sad though. I think this is the ultimate result of when a project just doesn't work out.

Bad management, bad timing etc


In Portugal CD costs 9.99 and its included in a promotion where u can buy 3 cds with that same 9.99 sticker and u get the 4th for free.

Thats the best its gonna get in Portugal though. Iv never seen a cd at $1.99 here  :'( I would buy a bunch of them if there was such thing here

wow, didn't know they went that low.
May have to swing by and grab the LP.

time to get me an extra copy.

I bought 6 copies today for $12. I plan to give a few out to my friends who are casual fans

I ordered 2 more tonight...pickin' 'em up tomorrow! 
 8)

$14.99 in canada  :no:
http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/guns-n-roses-chinese-democracy/m2159251.aspx?path=2b38b6f639dcef789ae1cec0bbec2dd8en02

Time to cross that border and come down south.

Day off from work.
Just got back from shopping with the fam.
Picked up 2 more CDs.
The interesting part of the adventure was talking to the chick at the register at Best Buy.
"Oh, you're buying Guns N' Roses?  Chinese Democracy?  2 copies?" 
"Yes, yes I am.  It's an amazing album."
"Huh, I haven't heard anything good about it from anyone."
I just looked at her and smiled.  "You probably shouldn't believe everything you hear.  For $1.99, give it a shot and see what you think."


 

Why would u wanna have more than one copy of the same cd?  :confused:

Wow. Just wow.

I know some people have one copy at home and one in their car. For example!




/jarmo

I'd rather just send the band $20 and save myself a trip to that wretched store.

You so have a point there! I use to like Bestbuy but its nothing but a joke anymore. I so wish we could go back too the day when you coulld actually buy music in  a real record store. I can remember way back too when I was probably 5 and going with my parents so they could get the latest great record. And as I became a music buyer it all went too hell. If the bands set up something on there webstores I would buy from them long before I would walk into one of those stores. even if it cost me a little more.

(http://i51.tinypic.com/4uvple.jpg)

Went to 2 different Best Buy's and bought the last 5 vinyl copies I could find. I'm hoping at least one of them doesn't have the inner groove distortion

I went to Best Buy today and all the copies were listed at $9.99, so I asked someone who worked there just to make sure.  I told him I saw it on the website for $1.99, and he looked at me like I was insane.  But when he checked it out and saw it for himself, he made a snide remark, "well it wasn't one of their finest albums."  I didn't feel like getting into a big thing with him, so I just laughed it off.  I had checked their inventory, from what I could see on the shelves, and there were less than I thought there would be.  I counted 31 total.  So I told the guy they had less than I thought, but he misheard me and thought I commented about the abundance they had and made a remark that all the stores have a lot.  Again, no need to argue with the guy.  So I told him I'd take 5 off his hands and he told me that there was no limit and I could take 10 if I wanted.  Then he got semi serious and said that it might not be a bad idea to buy a bunch and turn around and sell them for $4 a pop, doubling your profit.

It was an amusing trip to say the least.  I've got 2 friends in line awaiting their copies, 3 to go.

Honestly, $1.99 for ANY CD is a bargain, but this?  For me, and many others, you just can't beat it.

Especially with that exchange rate :hihi:

it's actually unbelievable, in Europe this would be 1.40?, over here the price is still around 14? to 18? so around 18usd to 25 usd

just sent my wife out to get 4 cd's and a vinyl. in total that would make 10 cd's and 2 vinyl's i've purchased!

Went too mine today and they only had 2 copies but they were also marked $9.99. I just walked back out. that place is a joke and I didn't even want too bother with asking. I don't need to go into a store and ask for something to have them make a smart ass comment. If a customer is asking for the item they sure the hell don't want to here the sales person make fun of it.

Yea the hell with that. I pre ordered CD the first day it came out, and I got some smart ass remark too, like we only have a million copies ......

F Best Buy

Oh come on, you gotta admit that's pretty funny!

was priced 13.99 at the best buy my wife went to but rang up 1.99. no wise ass comment though.

Yeah, Best Buy isn't really doing themselves any favors by NOT "promoting" the ridiculous low price.  A simple hand made sign would do.  People LOVE getting deals, and many would buy it just because it LOOKS like such a good deal.  And it is.  Once again though, more mishandling of anything and everything related to this album.  They can't even GIVE them away without messing it up.  I'd assume their goal is to unload a whole bunch by lowering the price to $1.99.  Well, it doesn't help if people don't know its $1.99.  Comical.

Why can they just grab the damn cd and take it to the car or home?   ;D

I have two cds, but one is SHM-CD, now that i can understand! But two copies of the same thing, same quality same everything?  :-\

Cos they don't want to wear out their eject button, I've forgotten where mine is  :rofl:

I for one have a copy in the house, car and keep a burned copy at work. But burned copies don't last for shit so its nice too have a back up of a cd that gets a lot of play.
I was hoping to get a couple of the $1.99 copies so I could get rid of the burn and have a copy to give a couple of friends that normally don't buy cds.

I'll never forget the good times we all had when CD was released, it was such a surreal week.  :)

I pre-ordered the Vinyl and also got the bonus Chinese Democracy/ Shackler's Revenge Vinyl single. And I brought the cd version the morning it was released, and I stayed up the whole night and set off when it was still dark outside.  :hihi:

I really should give my Vinyl a few spins on a record player, I remember MotherGoose telling us all, that it was the best way to listen to CD.  ;)

If anyone knows the best way to listen to CD, it's got to be The Synth Warrior himself, Mr Pitman.  ;D

I ordered 2 CD's and 2 LP's each on-line at the $1.99 price and picked them up at the closest to me.  I actually got $5 BB rewards as well so it only cost me $.74 each.  The store still had the CD at $9.99 and the LP at $11.99.

I figured why not? 

I couldn't resist...ordered a couple more vinyls. 
 8)

I regret to inform everyone that all 5 vinyl copies I picked up have the same inner groove distortion as my originals from 2008. I'm gonna try a few more though. For the price, I'm ok with the gamble.

Although it's great for fans to be able to pick up a physical copy for this price (at the moment), I'm afraid all this does is  validate the belief that it isn't worthwhile releasing CDs any more and with it the death of the album as an artform. People buy less music in general these days (unwilling or unable to pay attention to what's unfamiliar to them), and it'll only be a matter of time that music stores (not just indies, but chains) will cease to exist. Over here in the UK Tower Records went, then Virgin/Zaavi, and now HMV is on it's last legs. Even Amazon is holding less stock and outsourcing it's CD sales to the last few record stores. And once they're gone, Apple will have a monoply which I find very worrying.

For a band like G'n'R that don't just produce clone singles like bands of today, and use an album to be daring and experimental, this is very bad news.

Your odds would probably greatly improve if you ordered a European pressing.

One copy - burn it to iPod - take iPod wherever you go! No need for 2 copies, unless you are a collector and need one still in its wrapping.

Problem is Ipods suck! And yes I have a good one.

But suits most people fine, its a bit like buying a hifi, the super-store jobbies are bought by the masses but are deemed by the owners as good, truth is that they are in the main crap compared to the specialist store models... :-\

And in regards to the original point, you don't even need to burn a CD, you can get the bit torrent that is killing music sales.  Any physical copies need good marketing to sale well, with extra's. I'd love to see the next album come with a scratch card with a chance to win discounts on tour ticket sales or discount on merchandise, something that the downloader wouldn't get, or maybe they could get a unique code and win in that way.

All this "why don't you just...." is well enough, but not everybody thinks/works like you.

Not everybody has an iPod in their car! Not everybody wants to make copies of their cds, they buy another copy because it's more convenient for them etc etc.





/jarmo

The LP is now the the top selling LP.

The CD is in the top 20. 

Picked up 3 LP's myself (the max I could order).

Exactly, and the thing is, we are all fans and supporters of the band aren't we?. So if you have to go to the trouble of burning CD's for the car, etc. Why not go that extra mile, and just buy an extra copy, because you support the band, and want to reflect this in your actions.  :)

That's the way I see it.  I was tempted to buy extra copies to give to friends who don't buy CD's anymore when it originally came out, and then when it was on sale for $7.99.  But I held off.  For $1.99 though, you can't go wrong there.  I don't think $10 is going to set me back too far.

I've been itching to buy another GN'R album for a while  ;D so I'm pretty stoked with the $3.98 I just spent on a fresh CD and (my first) vinyl edition.  :yes:

I really hope Axl is thankful for his fanbase.  I cannot think of another band that has fans who get giddy to run out and buy the exact same version of an album they've already owned for two 1/2 years just because the price got marked down.

GN'R's fans are definitely True Gunners.

People are saying they will try it for $2, great way to get skeptics in on it  :peace:


http://www.fatwallet.com/best-deals/guns-n-roses-chinese-democracy-cd/

Couldn't resist, snagged another 3 LPs.  I wonder if these sales would count toward soundscan numbers?

The sales count, but I'd temper expectations.  I wouldn't expect the album to rise back into the charts just because of this.  Like I mentioned before, most Best Buy stores aren't even promoting the sale.  So most people would be unaware of the deal unless they frequent these boards or happen to stumble upon it on Best Buy's website.

Edit - I just did a quick check on www.bestbuy.com and "Chinese Democracy" is the top selling CD selling for $3.99 or less.  And overall it's #20.  I wonder where it was last week before this sale.

I picked  up another 2 copies today:)

I'd imagine that the industry bods who compile the charts do so with rules into how a record can be promoted for chart positions. I'd guess there would be, as there is in the uk a minimum price they can sell for and what freebee's they can include. I got a feeling some band had their sales made void because they were giving away a teeshirt with the CD, turns out the shirt was worth more than the record.... can't remember the artist though, Pidgeon of shit metal would be a good bet  :rofl: :rofl:

Anyway came across this whilst trying to find out http://www.themusicvoid.com/2011/01/low-sales-week-ushers-in-universal-music-cuts/

Just went to the website to order a couple of copies for pick up and the site says its now unavailable online in cd. We must have bought few. lol

Ahhh, what a great day! 
Just finished up a half-marathon charity run this morning (in the freezing frickin cold) and got to drive straight over to Best Buy for my just rewards!  :)
Chinese Democracy was waiting for me. (on-line pickup)  The last 2 vinyls at that location.   8)

After that, it was time to bring my 5 year old to a pink-a-licious birthday party. 
Getting out of the car after the party my wife just shook her head as my daughter had her goodie bags...Daddy had his prizes too...Chinese Democracy!!! 
 8) :yes: :beer:

btw, props and thanks to the starter of this thread, Deke DeSilva.   :beer:

Does this mean that CD will be available in regular retail stores?

Did we ever get any solid info on what the best buy exclusive deal was all about, in detail, in the first place? Like how many records was printed? For how long will this be an exclusive at BB etc? What did it cost BB to get the exclusive?

As far as I know I never heard  anything about the details of the exclusive as far as how long they get the exclusive rights to it.  I heard rumors of how much it cost,. somewhere in the 10-15 million range, I heard it covered the costs of the record.  Now that was a few years ago so Im not sure if i read that somewhere legit, or if it was speculation from the board that eventually got absorbed in my brain as truth.   :hihi:  Anyone else know anything?

The exclusivity period has actually ended.  CD CAN be sold at any and ever other music retailer, at their discretion.  That doesn't mean they HAVE to sell it though.  And in this day and age when CD sales are through the FLOOR, I don't think there's the rush to bring a bunch of copies in.  I haven't seen it on sale anywhere other than Newbury Comics outside of Best Buy.

My passenger seat after a trip to Best Buy on Saturday.  I now have back ups for life!
(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a140/carm0560/gnr.jpg)  [/img]

OH MY GOD!

Should I say, obsessmuch!

That's amazing Bodhi, I'm very jealous of your new collection.  ;)

Especially seeing all of those, I remember a guy doing something similar around the release date. I just remember piles and piles of CD, all over his couch and with also a few Vinyls to boot.  ;D

:beer: love it it`s like release date all over again  ;D

Nice one ;)

Btw. Is there anyone who could buy for me some vinyls and send them to Poland (in Europe)? :>

Nice!  ;D




/jarmo

Congratulations.. Good Pic, Good Price & Good Sales !! ChinDem, Sale Very Good !! Excelent News !!

 :beer: :smoking: :beer:

The CD is currently the 4th highest selling CD on the website, vinyl still #1.   I guess if the music industry wants to know how to increase CD sales, this is a nice blue print.  The artist and/or record company might make not make any money, but sales would be higher.  : ok:

Seems to me like alot of people who were curious about this album, due to the name alone. Have finally decided to give it a chance, since the price is so good. Yes, you are right juicySwoos, this is a very good example for fatcat record companys.  :yes:  ;)

Or then again, the high sales could be down to hardcore GN'R fans like Bodhi, buying up to 8+ copies and scooping up all of the damn stock.  :hihi:

But on a serious note, I'm glad that thousands of more fans have been exposed to Chinese Democracy due to Best Buys cheap price idea.  ;)

This is about the time I hate not having a Best Buy in my city

Nice!  Now if only Best Buy would actually put some signs up in the stores or put the $1.99 SALE sticker on the copies in the stores maybe they'd clear out even more.  Why alert people to the best deal in town though, right?

I have a few CD?s and on the birthdays of my best friends I gave them "CHINES DEMOCRACY"as a present...

Well spent $20.  : ok:

crazy ;-) this would cost a fortune in Belgium...

Call me a pessimist, but this fire sale from Best Buy essentially will prevent the current lineup of Guns N' Roses from ever recording another album.

There are two sides to every story....most of us here are satisfied with the record, and accept the current lineup in the band. However, judging by the sales of the album, especially here in the U.S., and it has become clear that either people don't want a GN'R without certain former members, and/or they hold a grudge against Axl for believing he destroyed the old band. Another factor is that Chinese Democracy didn't yield a strong single, and there was very little airplay after the title track was released to radio. In addition, nothing on the record bears much resemblance to the "classic GN'R" sound a lot of people came to love the band for.

While the band still can tour and get decent draws outside the U.S., it would appear to me that there will not be another significant tour in America...hard to justify a tour promoting an album that's being cleared out for $1.99.

I don't see how this would prevent them from recording another album.  I think Axl is in a position to record as many albums as he want's for the rest of his life.  It is hard to imagine that there would be no major labels ever interested in Guns N Roses.  CD sold over 600,000 copies, thats more than most rock albums that come out today.  They also would have no problem selling out a lot of shows at venues that most rock bands play.  The band  just got asked to headline Rock in Rio!  I'm pretty sure they'll have enough juice to put out another album if they feel like it.

#1: Album sales aren't a measurement of a band's popularity the way it used to be. Why do you think some artists are giving away their new albums these days?
#2: The album didn't sell because people were told it sucks because it's not the old band. I don't know how often I have heard stories of people say it sucks and they didn't even listen to it.
#3: There's still interest in GN'R. Look at how many news stories are written about Axl and the band.







/jarmo

Man...

You're crazy
Don't Cry

GN'R Is Better !!

 :smoking:

lol. hbk, your post are awesome  :hihi:

lol bought more today...totals since release:
12 cd's and 2 vinyl.
i shove this cd down everyones throat.

Nice! :D





/jarmo

Things are gonna change - I can feel it.

So i went to Best Buy today and the sticker was still $9.99. I thought maybe they weren't $1.99 at that store so I didn't bother asking anybody. Went online and ordered one to pick up at the same store, for $1.99. What's the deal -- they're $1.99 at the store, but not advertised? If so, I'll probably pick up another one when I go to pick up the one I ordered online.

Wow our Best Buy doesn't even sell CDs/LPs anymore.  Maybe just clearing their shelves?  I think a large chunk of retailers are eventually planning to phase out CDs alltogether.

yeah the cd section at my best buy is half of what it used to be.

Somewhere........Axl is smiling.

People still buy cd'`s? :hihi:

Really don't think this will be the case! Chinese Democracy secured an IFPI European Platinum Award, having sold more than one million copies in Europe, and had sold 2.6 million units worldwide as of February 2009, according to Universal Music. That is over 2 years ago now....Touring must of bumped sales up a lot sinse then!

Again, I'm largely talking about the U.S....it doesn't make business sense for any major record label to give Axl/ GN'R Inc a recording contract when the production costs to make Chinese Democracy and the very lukewarm reception upon it's release are now resulting in this fire sale by Best Buy. Axl can't fund a new record by himself, and certainly Geffen records will think twice before determining his future with them.

These exclusive retailer deals have worked for some bands, with the most successful to date being AC/DC's last record, "Black Ice", selling very well through Walmart. On the flip side, you have KISS' "Sonic Boom", which fared poorly despite Walmart's aggressive campaign, as well as Prince's last effort which was sold exclusively through Target. GN'R management will definitely have to look into these larger chains if they were to go the exclusive route with any future recordings. However, I don't see it happening. It's too big of a gamble with the industry taking such a massive hit on sales due to illegal downloads. You can say that the official record suffered from the unfinished tracks being leaked online before it's release, but I think the people who were planning on buying it still did.

The irony is, dare I say it, is that if some pieces of the old Guns came back into the fold, you wouldn't have just interest from all the big labels, but maybe even an outright bidding war. Believe me, all the marketing execs in the industry know that a Guns reunion record would bring in megabucks to them.

I don't think it'll be too long before we hear songs from Chinese Democracy at Major League Baseball games ;) (http://www.elearningguild.com/assets/images/US_Flag%201.gif)

I went to a Best Buy today and they only had 3 copies of CD (no vinyls).  They still had the $9.99 sticker on them and there wasn't any signs or anything saying they were on sale for the $1.99.  They were in the main racks where all the regular priced cd's are, NOT in the sales bins or discount racks.

Wonder why BestBuy doesn't mark them with the discount price and place them somewhere to catch the eye of the casual fans??  (well this store doesn't have to worry about that any more cause I took those last 3)

The put the copies close to the front of the store at the best buy I go to and have them listed as 1.99. There are far less copies now then there was 3 weeks ago. So someone is buying them which is good !

Good news!

This $1.99 "Fire Sale" has put Guns N' Roses back on BEST BUY's best-selling CDs chart!

Chinese Democracy is currently #4 and climbing!  :beer:

Couldn't resist...all copies still marked $11.99 with no advertising visible...but sure enough, $2.16 with tax!!  Can't pass that one up, even if I just use them for drink coasters.

Picked up 7 copies this weekend. All they had. They were out of vinyl though, which is what I really went there for.

Once again, only reason the album is marked down is because Best Buy had the exclusive.


Most albums have tons of surplus but where each store has a small amount, they never get marked down.

I was in Target recently, and they had the exclusive on Prince's last album "Lotus Flower" and they had it marked down also for 1.99.

So its just via the exclusive they have EVERY single unsold copy. I'm sure most released albums have the  same surplus just spread around way more stores.

has no bearing on the quality,popularity or greatness of the band.

It is a sign of the times, pardon the Prince mention.

Guns could have released an amazing retail album back in 2000/2001, when downloading was limited to ftp, which was relatively unknown at the time. They could have made amazing videos for singles off CD and I am confident that the album would have produced top 10 singles during that era. Unfo, that did not happen.

The main income they will get now is through touring.

One word: Napster.

Was definitely around in 2000-2001.

It peaked in February 2001.


So downloading wasn't limited to FTP and it wasn't something only a few geeks did. Everybody used Napster.



/jarmo

A bit exaggerated imo and people still used CD's.

One big thing with the decisions back then was that they (industri) got greedy and inflated the price on burnable cd's and at the same time made some big releases have those copylimitations or cd's with extra playersoftware. Therefore people used the internet more and more to just get the mp3/file without the limited usage.

Pretty big infringement to personal freedom was it too.

I really think working closer together with the artist, that again are connected to their own audience would create a more stable economy for the buisness in it's full scope. My 2 centz :peace:

Yes, people still bought cds.

But the point I was trying to make was that illegal downloading exploded around 2000-2001 when Napster started becoming popular.

Why do you think they wanted it shut down? Because nobody used it?

Albums leaked and were available for the masses and for free back then too.


The big difference probably is that the teenagers today have grown up with using the Internet to get stuff.




/jarmo

I have to say that even know i didnt have internet in 2000/2001, Napster did explode around 1999 till 2001/2002.

And after Napster went out of business, other websites started with the same philosophy as Napster. Limewire, Kazaa, album torrenting, Bearshare, ares etc etc etc...

And that pretty much ruined the music business, but i think its their fault as well. They could have just make a new format for releases. I mean we're in 2011, we already had HD dvds which failed at least Europe and now the Blu Ray industry!

How come cds haven't been transformed in a better quality market? Cds are on the market since like 1980 or something. Its been more than 20 years that they started using that technology.

It should have been updtated already to a more sophisticated way of listening music, and when im saying this, im not saying to transform all the albums in paid downloads, because i prefer to buy a cd for 12 euros than buy a cd on itunes for 10.

What i mean is... for example, why don't they do like a smaller disc, like a smaller version of a cd. I think its the record companies fault as well. This internet boost was easy to predict and they did nothing about it!

I got my first review from one of my free CD handouts last night.  While it's not glowing, I do think it can be viewed as positive.

So my buddy who I gave the CD to was driving a couple of co-workers around and one of them noticed the CD.  He said to my friend, "tell me you didn't buy this?"  My buddy explained how I bought it for $2 and gave it to him, so the guy seemed alright with that and said they might as well give it a shot.  So they threw it in and listened for the remainder of their drive, about 30 minutes worth.  And the consensus was that it was "not that bad".

So again, not a glowing review.  But the guy went from seeing the CD as an embarrassment, to "not that bad".  I'll take it.  Baby steps, right?  Now instead of telling people that new GNR sucks without actually hearing them, he can now say, "they're not that bad".  Hey, I've heard much worse, so I view it as a positive.

I'm guessing that once all copies have sold, the record will be out of print. So, in a backwards kind of way, it will become a collector's item.

Agreed, 100%.

As I said in a prior post, there may never be another Guns N' Roses album. Too high of a risk based on how Chinese Democracy sold. Bottom line is, the record label wants profits from their artists, and they didn't get much from this.

With the Best Buy clearance, I guess someone can say they sold a few million copies, but what percentage of that was at the $1.99 price?

So true. I forgot about Napster. They appeared then disappeared so quickly, but  in the big scheme of things, but they changed everything. FTP was more 90's.

I still think downloading is more prevalent now though, and I believe that, as you have already stated, it is because young adults today have grown up with downloading.

I know what your saying jarmo, but even with the existence of Napster in the early part of the decade, I don't think it's even close to the downloading culture which was present in 2008. I think the album would have done better sales wise, if it was indeed released in 2001. Simply because downloading wasn't as big of a force as it is now, and now we have a generation who believe downloading music is the norm, which wasn't the case in 2001, people still brought albums.  ;)

And that's probably my biggest regret about how CD turned out, not the music but the missed opportunity to release it earlier in the decade (before 2005) when the music industry took it's last gasp, before evolving into a culture where people could easily access software to download music both legally and illegally.  :-\

I really don't think you can argue the fact that in terms of music sales, and the culture towards buying/downloading albums. It would have been a better business choice to release the album in 2001-2-3-4-5, but unfortunately it wasn't to be, and it was released when the music industry was already in a strong decline.  :P

It's pretty simple, you can't release something before it's done.

All this "it's bad business to sell cds for that cheap" is confusing.

What's bad is people getting the music for free.... People deciding it's up to them to decide when others' music should be heard etc etc.



/jarmo

I completely agree.

CD was released when it was ready to be released, and that is cool. However, discussions on physical sales and prices are fairly irrelevant in 2011. The last UK based high street music retailer HMV is making losses now, and will be gone within the next year or two. It is the way things are now.

In 20/30/40 years time even the old guard in society will be illegal downloading mofos.  :hihi:

What hurts GNR and other rock bands is radio.

Radio simply doesn't play Rock music anymore. They have all switched to this god Awful digitized,auto tunes hip hop shit. If u look at rock charts, they get maybe 700 spins a week whereas the top 100 get over 14000.

people just arent as exposed to rock music like they once were.

People can blame illegal downloading, but radio, the 1.29 single on Itunes and just poor quality of today's music is just as big as illegal downloading as to why the numbers are way down.

Let's say AFD was released today. Jungle,SCOM,PC would each top 3 or 4 million downloads on Itunes but rest of album would be lucky to sell a million cause people can now get the hits for cheap and don't have to shell out 15 bucks for an entire album.  Bands need to stop putting music on Itunes for singles release.

CD selling 600k in the US without a hit single tour, tons of promo or video is pretty fucking spectacular.

I agree. CD selling what it did was amazing.

Radio is probably even more shocking than you realise.  :hihi:

Well anyway, I managed to buy another copy of CD, and I bought the vinyl .... I do not have a vinyl player but maybe I'll frame it or something .......

So hoping GNR does a US Tour !!!!

Chinese Democracy has re-enterered thebillboard charts at #199  : ok:

That's awesome! It has a "*" next to it as well.

* Titles with the greatest airplay and sales gains this week.



It also made its debut on the catalog albums list at #22  :peace:

I went to three different Best Buy stores.  One had the 3 cds (that I mentioned before).  One had 2 vinyls (one of which the plastic wrapper was all facocked) and the third store didn't have any.

So it has...I didn't think I'd see this.

Billboard 200
The week's top-selling albums across all genres, ranked by sales data as compiled by Nielsen SoundScan.

http://www.billboard.com/#/charts/billboard-200?begin=181&order=position

Catalog Albums
The week's top-selling albums across all genres that are at least 18-months old and have fallen below No, 100

http://www.billboard.com/charts/catalog-albums#/charts/catalog-albums?begin=21&order=position

GUNS N' ROSES's 'Chinese Democracy' Re-Enters BILLBOARD Chart - Apr. 7, 2011

"Chinese Democracy", the 2008 album released by the current edition of GUNS N' ROSES after a 15-year wait, sold around 3,200 copies in the United States in the week ending Sunday, April 3 ? nearly three times the units (1,200) it shifted the previous week. As a result, the CD has re-entered The Billboard 200 chart at position No. 198.

Blabbermouth.net

Gonna go buy a couple copies tomorrow.

The idea of "Chinese Democracy is $1.99 at Best Buy" sounds tough when you read it for the first time but if you think it well  is positive to Guns N' Roses.

That price means more people buying it and I'm sure most of the people who always were reticent to buy it because "this is not Guns N' Roses", now maybe gives the album a chance and I'm sure some of them will like it.

If Azoff, Best Buy or whatever is trying to sabotage "Chinese Democracy", I think they are doing the opposite. The best way to sabotage an album is selling it at a high price so people won't buy it.


I think this is very positive.

Read this re: downloading the other day and thought it was interesting:

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/technologylive/post/2011/03/us-internet-piracy-is-on-the-decline/1

I don't think they're trying to sabotage the album, just trying to clear some copies at a reduced rate.  However, as I've stated before, they could be doing a lot more to sell a lot more copies.  Unless you read these boards, various music sites, or visit Best Buy's website and search for music you wouldn't know it's $1.99.  It's listed at $9.99 in store and many store associates aren't aware of the sale.  So it's not exactly fully taking advantage of the opportunity to clear the shelves.  If they REALLY wanted to rid themselves of all the excess copies, they could do a lot more to help the process along.

I would kill for a vinyl and you guys are paying ONLY $1.99.

Extremely envious  :hihi: .

If I pay the vinyl and the shipping, could some of you help me?

Wont best buy ship to you?


But anyway next time I'm near a best buy I was thinking of getting a few copies, so i'll see if you're still interested by that time

I wish they would sell it for that price in the Netherlands :-)

Unfortunately BestBuy ships only within the States. I wish they were like Amazon.

I mean, I really don't think you can argue that downloading music legally or illegally. Defers people from actually walking into a store and buying physical copies of an album, which was less all round in the early 2000s, compared to later in the decade.

And I would also like to address jarmo, and would like to state that I realise the album wasn't ready in the time period in which I'm talking about. But we also know from over the years, that loads and loads of songs were floating around in that time period. And alot of them was done mid-decade in regards to the vocals and bodywork of the song. I also am aware that changes and overdubs were then made in relation to improving various songs.  :D

So, I feel that GN'R could have put out an album in 2004-5-6, if they needed to. I'm sure there was sufficient material ready to go, maybe not as polished as the additions that were made later, but never the less, a product could have been released. And I just wish that GN'R capitalised on that specific time period when they made the successful comeback in 2002, and MTV was reporting on them positively after their VMA performance.  : ok:

So..... all I am saying is that, as a fan I would have liked to have seen Chinese Democracy released in 2001-2-3-4-5. Because I'm positive it would have sold more, and would have been all round more successful due to the downloading culture of music, not fully setting in yet.  :P

Went to Best Buy today here in Chattanooga,TN  They had 126 copies on CD and about 6 vinyls.

I bought 2 copies on CD.

The vinyl is also two dollars.

I've the same question  ;) Please :)

 i thought of taking up a Paypal fund so we can sell out my Best Buy.

U send 3 dollars, I'll purchase and mail it to u anywhere in the world.

That's cool. I'm in!  :peace:

I'm in as well!

Id probably only do cds as vinyls could be tough to ship. cds i just throw in a padded envelope and its easy.

That's a cool idea, Best Buy won't know what's hit them.  :)

They'd have no clue that they where now taking international orders, via a middleman called "D".  :hihi:

HAHAHA thats right!

Anyone interested just PM me. Now of course if you live overseas and want 10 copies, may have to get a little help on Shipping costs but I don't mind using some of my own money to help out with shipping and handling. just don't want a 30 dollar shipping charge! LOL  I'm not that rich! :hihi:

 : ok:

Where's the "like" button on this forum Jarmo?  ;)

So tell me how this works please ???.  CD was exclusively sold at Best Buy am I correct?  Obviously there was a contract between BB and GNR, my next question is... does such a contract have a experation date and can another store purchase CD and then sell it in their own store during this contractual time frame.  Once the contract has expired if it does, can any store then stock the cd to sell?  Whole reason I am asking this is I saw it today at Fred Meyer store, and granted it was one copy and it was $14.95.  I was a little bit shocked to see it there and so I was wondering more about how this process all works :P.

(http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm70/AXLDEMOCRACY/democracycomescheap.jpg?t=1302660324)

Somehow, that just seems too hard to believe

Sample place the YouTube function is!!

:hihi:

Kidding aside, I went into my local Best Buy today and there were 5 copies left. I asked "Hey do you guys have anymore?" and the guy said "Nope, our warehouse is empty too." Take it with a grain of salt, but the guy said they won't be getting any for a little while - whether that means they have to order in from other warehouses or they have to order more pressings - who knows. Anyways, I bought the 5 copies and walked out.

The Best Buy exclusivity has ended.  It's been awhile now actually.  So the CD can be sold at any store who wants to sell it.

And I believe even during the exclusivity timeframe, any independent record stores were free to purchase and sell CD at their stores.

Thank You so much Faldor :)

In Chile ChinDem.

Normal Price > US 12 :: And Now > US 7

But, Only In One Store On.Line

 :smoking:

It's great that CD is back in the billboard 200! I read in every GN'R article that 'Chinese Democracy' was a commercial dissapointment.. But was it really?? What is a rough worldwide sales figure?? Anyone?

I thought it worked like this: the Best Buy deal applied only to US distribution. But.....any store could buy it as an import through a foreign distributor and sell it that way.  You probably didn't see many copies other places because 1.) imports are more expensive and 2.) CD wasn't exactly selling like hot cakes in the US anyways.

Would love to know a recent worldwide figure.

Well.. i just got bought the Chinese Democracy LP here in Norway.. 31$

But anyway.. the LP looks amazing!

My copy is gonna arrive soon, thanks to a certain forum member.  :)

First copy I bought was a German one, so I guess I'll have a American copy soon too.

There was so much attached to CD that anything less than the greatest selling album of the decade would be considered a failure.

How many artists would love their album to sell as many copies as CD?

Anyway, did they ever fix the distortion issues with the LP? I bought it day it came out and Prostitute sounds like shit.

just because it sold more than most artists though doesn't mean it wasn't a commercial failure.

it didn't even debut at number 1 on the billboard.  not even number 2.  it made a fast exit and the only way it could make it back on was by going to a 1.99 clearance event.

the album shipped over a million in the states but every best buy i had ever been in had at least 30 sitting on the shelf, i have a friend who works at a best buy in allentown pa, i asked him how CD was selling and he told me they had hundreds in the back.

just because it was a commercial failure though doesn't mean the album was a failure, it's a very good album and I think Axl achieved what he wanted to from a creative standpoint.  I'm playing the LP right in fact.

The whole "commercial failure" aspect is amusing.

There was no way the album could ever be considered a success in any way by some people, who like to think of themselves as "objective".


The album sold a bunch of copies in the USA basically because people had read about it somewhere or heard about it.

I walked into a Best Buy in L.A. and saw that they had a Will Smith DVD prominently on display by the entrance while the Chinese Democracy display was further back. Didn't exactly look like Best Buy was pushing their exclusive a lot at that store. This was during the release week...

They didn't push it to the masses the same way some other exclusives have been.


The biggest problem is the fact that people don't want to give the album a shot. They have decided they don't like it based on all the shit they read and heard.



/jarmo

I think it's real simple. The band is tied to the expectations raised by a whole separate band, with which the Chinese Democracy era lineup shares a name with. Guns N' Roses is one of the most popular bands of all time, but in the eyes of many, that band ceased to exist a long time ago. Thankfully Axl is still making music for us to enjoy, but he alone isn't what made Guns N' Roses popular, no matter how many people want to believe he is.

It's not lack of promotion. Chinese Democracy has been talked about since the late nineties. The name Guns N' Roses promotes itself. There was plenty of anticipation, probably more so than for any other album. People know it's out there, they just don't care for it. I don't know anyone that doesn't know Chinese Democracy is out. I've played it for plenty of my friends, some of which have been fans since '86. Aside from my myself and brother I also don't know anyone personally who liked what they heard.

There is no denying it's a different direction from the earlier material. That's a great thing in the eyes of many. Chinese Democracy was a huge success to some people, it's their favorite album. Some people probably had their minds made up before they heard it, and plenty of people were underwhelmed by what they heard. Any band that has the turnover in personnel, and change in sound that Guns has had is going to endure it's share of criticism. I think you can be a fan of the band and still be realistic enough to understand why not everyone else is in the world is. It's not a conspiracy.

People decided they don't like it before hearing a single note.


Most great bands and artists have changed direction at some point in their career. It's nothing new.



By the way, promotion isn't just telling people something is available, it's also making them go to the store and try to get them to buy it.

I'm sure everybody knows Coca Cola exists. Why is it being advertised then?

If Coke needs to be advertised, and it's that well known, how come Chinese Democracy with almost no promotion had enough promotion according to you?

I don't get that logic...



/jarmo

i don't think that's true at all, the album was the most streamed album of all time on myspace right?  http://www.nme.com/news/guns-n-roses/41217  Obviously people had an interest right off the bat and wanted to hear it. 

I think the problem was that Gn'R just isn't relevant in America like they once were, Axl doesn't tour here, most of the CD tour dates have been overseas.  There was little to no promotion, a single that was seldom heard, no videos, no interviews, Gn'R didn't do a single thing to get people excited for the album, it just kind of came out and that was that.  13 years or however long in the making and it had an extremely quiet release.  With a proper release it would have sold fine IMO, especially if it was released to more stores than just Best Buy.  A special edition would have helped as well. 

CD came out in 2008 and the last tour date in America was in 2006, I guarantee you if Gn'R was touring America while CD came out the sales would have been higher.

The album would have been considered a success if it sold well, but it didn't.  It sold below expectations therefor it was a commercial failure, maybe the expectations were too high, and I agree with you on that Jarmo, but that doesn't change the fact that it sold poorly.

But again, I hardly think that makes the album a failure, most Gn'R fans like it, most like it a lot.  That's what Axl set out to do, create an album that the fans love, and for the most part I think he succeed with that greatly, which IMO was a bigger achievement than any amount of sales could prove.

Axl put replaced beloved members of one of the most popular bands of all time and still was able to make an album accepted by the fans.  That's saying a lot IMO.  Yeah CD was a commercial failure, but the album succeed in ways that most people thought it couldn't, I think that says a lot in it's on right.

I'll have to agree with that! I do have to say though, that the album is also weaker than any other GNR album, which was something that you would also expect to be a possibility due to the fact that it was a completely new line up. We already knew it was going to be different, but it was also weaker. Not to bash Axl or anyone...its just my personal opinion on it, and i believe that also had something to do with it.

I honestly believe though, that the next album will be amazing and that it will be much better than Chinese Democracy.

@Halo69 Weaker? wtf ... CD is a great album, great production, great songs, great musicianship and great people, reasons enough to me to support it all the way ... period IMHO

I don't disagree with you that some people had their minds up already. Guns is no different from any other band that has had personnel changes. Every band has it's share of purist fans that aren't going to accept changes, but I think that is being overemphasized. I think they are in the minority.
I'm also not saying that the band should have no promotion. I'm saying that the "lack of" promotion is not the reason it wasn't better received, in my opinion. I've read a lot of posts here about people not knowing Chinese Democracy was out. That hasn't been my experience. The album was a legend before it ever came out. How many albums do you know by name 7+ years before it's released? It was easily the most hyped up album I've been alive to witness. It was anything but a secret where I live. I saw an ad on TV. I heard the tracks on the radio. The radio station WAAF here in Boston has been a huge supporter of GNR as long as I can remember. The tracks were played frequently, and failed to generate much interest beyond a couple of days.

I'm actually surprised people expected more promotion, or greater album sales. Considering what it is, an album made by the lead singer of Guns N' Roses with an entirely new cast of musicians, I think it sold pretty damn well, especially for music today. If anyone dropped the ball in terms of promotion, it was Axl. He is the only one the public would care to see, or hear from in interviews. That's not his bag, and I respect that. If he's not concerned about promoting it, why are we? In the end it comes down to the music. To think that you can dismantle one of the greatest rock bands of all time, disappear for 10 years, replace key contributors and then expect to recreate that magic and chemistry of the classic era, and turn out chart topping records like nothing ever happened is beyond delusional. No amount of promotion was going to change that.

My whole point was that you thought it had enough promotion, yet something well known such as Coca Cola is constantly promoted/advertised even though we all know it's available in almost every store.

It's not enough to inform people they have a choice of buying something, you need to make them want to buy it too.

Especially when for years people have been told they won't like it.


That was the point I was trying to make.



/jarmo

Jarmo is 100% correct.  Regardless of how the album sounds, a serious marketing push would have unquestionably helped album sales.  Releasing it at Wal-Mart instead of Best Buy, which would have  given the album way more exposure, could easily have doubled the sales. 

I hear ya. I would think that once the person knows it's out there, it's up to the music to make people want to buy it. Then again, not everyone is buying music these days.
Unfortunately rock isn't exactly burning up the radio stations either these days, so it's not going to get the airplay it would have back in the 90's.
All things considered, CD did/is doing pretty well.

It's not always that simple. Sure, sometimes people buy an album because they liked one song that they heard on the radio.

Sometimes they might buy an album based on a review they read. It all depends.

Imagine how difficult it is when the thought in the back of the buyer's mind is "this album sucks" and he/she hasn't heard a single note. How do you convince those people?


It did well in the day and age we currently live in.




/jarmo

True. It's hard for me to imagine people dismissing a talent like Axl at any time, but especially based on hearsay, and during a time that, in my opinion, great songwriters/musicians are few and far between. Their loss.

I think that is the product of the whole waiting process and consequently people didn't take this band seriously because of that, therefore the dismissal! And also that bad media that has came with it over the years.

Sure, and I can understand that. It's being realistic.
As bad as I wanted it too, I can't say I honestly expected the record to sound like Izzy, Slash, Duff were playing on it.
I basically threw the name out, and was just curious to hear what one of the greatest frontmen of all time had up his sleeves, and see what he had to offer when working with other musicians.
I think you almost have to kind of dismiss the name in these cases. People get real attached to the name, which I understand, but not enough to write it off completely.

I don't think anyone is going to argue with the fact that this is not the Guns N' Roses we grew up with, but it's still worth checking out. I'd rather hear for myself, than read someone's "expert" opinion.

It also plays into the unrealistic expectations, and the perception that the album somehow came up short.
People were disappointed that it doesn't sound like the band they grew up with, but knowing the circumstances, how could it?
There are obviously benefits of carrying on with the name, but the one major drawback I guess would be that fans are going to hold you to the impossible expectations of staying true, and continuing the sound that you alone weren't responsible for creating in the first place. Even though it's an entirely new band, they will always be compared to the original, and more often than not, unfavorably.

GN'R has always kept evolving and experimenting.

Nothing new.


But that has very little to do with the topic.....

Hopefully the sale has encouraged more people to check out the music and judge for themselves instead of listening to the "experts".



/jarmo

I almost kind of wonder if Axl just went with the name Axl Rose instead of Guns n' Roses if it would have sold more.  I think a lot of people are turned off by Axl using the Gn'R name without Slash, Duff, and Izzy and would have accepted it more if it was just an Axl solo album.  All you ever hear about CD is "it's not guns n' roses without Slash".  Well if you didn't call it Gn'R you wouldn't have to deal with those comments, I think the general population would be a little more accepting of the album.

It's a 2 sided sword.

Oh, the name discussion again.

Somebody chose to walk away and quit. Axl didn't let that end GN'R. Thank God!





/jarmo

I always have to smile when people say that it should be called just Axl, or it should be another name entirely. I need to ask why?, because Axl was the only member to keep fighting for GN'R, and to work day in day out in GN'R's best interest. So because other members chose to abandon GN'R, Axl should change the name in which he created?. Get real, Axl is GN'R because he is the only member who's been there from the start and has gave his soul for Guns N' Roses.

 :love:

Regarding the issue of sales, I still stand by my point of it's got alot to do with the state of the music industry in general. Nothing to do with the quality of CD, because quite frankly, it is the best GN'R album by far. I think Best Buy could have done alot more to market the CD, and with that, the record company could have done much more as well.  ::)

But, I also think that alot of people forget just how good it did do. It debuted at number 1 in many countries, and for a record that never got the promotion it deserved, it did brilliantly. And in this age of the internet, I was proud to see how much attention the album got from newspapers, tv and radio.  : ok:

So, unlike many "so called" fans on here. I'm not going to worry about why CD didn't do this or that, while trying to pinpoint if it was all down to Axl still calling the greatest band on earth "Guns N' Roses".  :P

I'm happy and content that Chinese Democracy finally came for me, and all of the other millions and millions of GN'R fans around the world.

And all that matters is, to all of us true GN'R fans, Chinese Democracy came and made all of our wishes come true.  ;)

I agree with this, and that's my point about the Azoff thread comments written yesterday, that Axl, should he win, will be a game changer and IMO he should do an interview where he gets this point across. What Axl could be doing, should he win his case will change the industry practices and this is the time to bury a few myths and be allowed to march forward with the band making great music.

whether the band was called Guns n' Roses or not the album would have sounded the same, so I don't see how it's "thank god".  The product wouldn't have been any different, neither would the show.

all I said was I wonder if it would affect the sales of the album because it'd give potential buyers a different perspective.  Axl could have called his band meat and potatoes and it wouldn't make a difference.  Guns n' Roses is just a name at this point.  Axl has proven that by replacing the replacements replacements.

I don't think you realise just how much Guns N' Roses means to people all over the world. That's why I thank Axl for saving GN'R and carrying on when everyone else abanded GN'R. For some people Guns N' Roses are their life, and it's more than just a name.  : ok:

Think about the millions of people who have GN'R tattoos, travel all around the world to see GN'R and who have loved Guns N' Roses from the start to this present day.

Guns N' Roses is a way of life, and even Axl said in his online chats, that he felt like he had a responsibility to the fans to keep GN'R alive.

And I also thank Axl, because GN'R are my life.  :)

Thank God?

Why?

Would the music have been so bad if it were released under a different name?

I think keeping the name has really hurt Axl as an artist.

I think it's safe to say that we'd have a few more albums of Axl Rose music by now had he not chosen to keep the name.

Just my 2 cents.

Lots of bands go threw lots of changes. Axl said himself something about trying to get the band where he wanted it personally and talent wise. It seems the changes that have happened, have happened to get to that point. I believe where the band is now, is where he was trying to get. You don't change the name of the band everytime someone quits or gets fired. lol the fact is that ths band still sounds like GNR. So why not continue with that name? Least thats the way I see it.

Well because it sounds like GN'R. Bands evolve all the time.

Because others tried to kill GN'R all along the way, hoping it would end.

And of course it annoys some that Axl didn't let GN'R die. Many of these people are on the forums posing as GN'R fans.


I see the good in the situation, you see the bad. It's obvious why you do. No need to pretend.





/jarmo

This post is a parody of itself.

Would the music have been so bad if it were released under a different name?

As it wasn't, is it so bad?

I think keeping the name has really hurt Axl as an artist.

The band has always evolved, people go and get replaced, just like any other job, team or band....

I think it's safe to say that we'd have a few more albums of Axl Rose music by now had he not chosen to keep the name.

How? The releases done under Axl's say so (so no to GH) have been done when he's felt them to be fit to release, keeping the name, hasn't prevented any release, only the quality of what has been available. Since many of the doubters see this band as "The Axl and others show" isn't what you are claiming already "Axl Rose music"? 

I think if Axl hadn't kept and used the name ex members would have, what it needed was some huge exposure and it would`ve shifted alot more look at Adele she made an appearance on the Brits and her album took off like a rocket, sometimes you have to appear on things you might not like but sometimes you have to give abit to get something back :)

Yes, I think Velvet Revolver would have been Guns N Roses if Axl did not have the rights to the GNR name.

I don't get why Axl was not be willing to go on SNL or Leno or Fallon to get the word out that there is a new band and there is new music. Even if he was pissed off at the label it's still his music that he wrote.

To that I say:  Jarmo -- You are an Axl Rose fan posing as a GN'R fan.

Wrong! I'm a GN'R fan. I stuck with GN'R through everything.  :)

I assume you didn't? What does that make you? A fan of the past? I fan desperately clinging onto some dream of the glorious past?

My GN'R shirts don't say "Axl Rose" on them. Even the ones I got last year (2010) They say Guns N' Roses.

It's a band! Yes, with Axl in it! But there's also others in the band. Something which some can't seem to comprehend.


I don't have conditions on when they need to do things or who should be in the band etc.

I trust that the one guy who has been in the band since day one knows way better than some anonymous Internet keyboard warriors who are desperately trying to be popular.


If I didn't like the band, I would find something else I liked. Instead of spending time on fan forums, using multiple usernames, spewing my hatred against something I have very little control over.

Seems like some of you have spent more years hating the band then you spent as actual fans. Ironic.

But that's just me! I know we're all different.

 :)



/jarmo

TW:184

LW:181

WOC: 203

Greatest Hits

Guns N' Roses

Ha, don't worry jarmo, 'Street Of The Blues' is a right little keyboard warrior. He's the hero, who sent me a PM recently stating I'm a retard, instead of posting it in the thread where everyone could see.  :rofl:

At the end of the day, Guns N' Roses started in 1985 and are still going strong in 2011, and that's all down to Axl. People like to point out member changes like it happens every month, the band has key members who have been there for 10+years. Just because those members aren't your 'favourite' doesn't mean it's not Guns N' Roses, because it is.  :)

I don't know why people post here if they obviously are not a fan of Guns N' Roses in 2011, why waste your energy debating something you've already made your mind up about.  :P

To a lot of people though Gn'R was Slash, Duff, Izzy and Axl and those same people have Gn'R tattoos and wear the t-shirts and travel to see the band.

You're right, Gn'R is a way of life for a lot of people but a lot of those people don't accept Axl's reincarnation of the band. 

I mean their greatest hits cd spent 138 weeks in the billboard before it dropped off then reentered at 132.  Chinese Democracy spent (I think) 19 weeks on the billboard and had to be lowered to less than 2 dollars to reenter, at 198. 

Personally, I could care less what Axl calls it, I'm just happy he finally released it.

I just wonder if CD would have been more successful if he released it under his own name, then maybe a lot of those people who have the tattoos and wear those t-shirts but have yet to buy into Axl's new version of the band would have picked up a copy.

Hell even Slash's solo cd charted for 14 weeks, just a month shy of what Chinese Democracy charted.

One thing's for sure, if he didn't call it Guns n' Roses it wouldn't have had the expectations that it did going in, and I don't think people would consider it a commercial failure.  Gn'R is a way of life like you said, but a lot of people don't accept big changes in their lives, and a lot of Gn'R fans didn't accept this change resulting in lower than expected sales and clearance sales.

Eclipsed 107, you are talking crap.

"I mean their greatest hits cd spent 138 weeks in the billboard before it dropped off then reentered at 132.  Chinese Democracy spent (I think) 19 weeks on the billboard and had to be lowered to less than 2 dollars to reenter, at 198"

Let's look at Bon Jovi, who I don't like, but were the biggest touring act of last year! Their last Album sold 163,000 copies in its first week in US (same as CD) and has sold 3 million copies worldwide. Are these sales a true indication of the bands popularity? No.

I just wonder if CD would have been more successful if he released it under his own name, then maybe a lot of those people who have the tattoos and wear those t-shirts but have yet to buy into Axl's new version of the band would have picked up a copy.

Not the case. Taking Bon Jovi again you have a band with a constant line-up and still there Album sales are low, in comparison to the past. Their greatest hits album however is doing very well.
Guns N'Roses current line up play to packed areanas all over the globe- That show's an acceptence of this band! GN'R finished the year a respectable 29th of top grossing touring acts (and I think I'm right in saying that does not take into account the Aus & Middle East dates)....This is more of a test of popularity. If you consider the sporadic nature of the tour it's very good going. Now why a US tour is not taking place, nobody knows. But that sure would help a little re-boost of CD sales.

Hell even Slash's solo cd charted for 14 weeks, just a month shy of what Chinese Democracy charted.

I love this album but it sold 61,000 in it's opening week.. A big difference. And internationaly it was not even close to the sales of CD, in the UK for example it only reached number 17- whereas GN'R scorred a number 2 behind the Killers who are one of the UK's favourite bands. If the original line-up and slash is what the masses want why don't they buy this album??

I asked what CHINESE DEMOCRACY has roughly sold worldwide, which I think started this negative shit. Last year was a great one for GN'R...I think, as was stated in an article about GN'R in NME the week before Reading Festival, that CD is a slow burner! But it is selling. According to Universal Music it had sold 2.6 million units worldwide as of February 2009. Well that's 2 years ago and they have toured the globe since then...So where we at now?

All the negative shit about sales comes from Billboard performace! Compare Kayne West's 808s & Heartbreak worlwide success with CD's- It get's it's ass kicked.

Also, especially in Europe the recent great sales of GN'R greatest hits and Appetite etc is due in no small way to the touring efforts of the Current line up! If you love GN'R there is nothing to fucking moan about! In the last year I've seen the current line up 4 times, seen Adlers Appetite 2 times and Slash once with more dates coming this summer. This week I've been rocking out to Loaded's new album. The music is there people....

I have to steal this Jarmo. I second that!

ı think chinese democracy worldwide sales are major success..only in usa is below expactations and ı think it's because of bestbuy.Also Chinese Democracy debuted at
number three on the US Billboard 200 chart, selling 261,000 copies in its first week, more than nearly 100K of Bon Jovi's last album.

The album also reached triple platinum certification in Canada, as well as platinum certifications in many other countries, including Finland, Czech Republic, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Norway, Poland, Romania, Switzerland, the United Kingdom, Argentina,Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa. It was certified gold in Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Greece, Hungary, the Netherlands, Sweden, Indonesia, Japan, Malaysia, Singapore, Taiwan, Thailand, Brazil, and Colombia.

Chinese Democracy secured an IFPI European Platinum Award, having sold more than one million copies in Europe.And ıt was before the world tour.As 2011 It has sold at least 1.400.000 copies all throuhg the europe ı guess...So when you do the math


USA-BESTBUY  :     1.6  Million   - 630K(the copies that has sold in USA) + 970 K (BESTBUY bought 1.6 million copies)
EUROPE          :     1.4  Million
Canada           :     240 K          - Triple platinium in Canada
japan              :     200K
Australia         :     100K

When you add the south America,Asia and the rest of the world sales. It has sold between 4-5 million copies worldwide.When you look at the other artist's last album's sales,You'll see that Chinese democracy has sold very well.

Guns N Roses     Chinese Democracy        4-5M
Velvet revolver - libertad                           800K
Iron Maiden     -  Final Frontier                  1M
U2                       No line on the horizon    4M
Bon Jovi              Circle                               3M
Ac/Dc                   Black Ice                         7M
Metallica              Death Magnetic              4,5M
Killers                  Day and Age                   3M

Quality first post... : ok:  At last some perspective  :love:

Excellent!

Where did u find those numbers at? I am always trying to find album sales like this and haven't had any luck.

What are you talking about reayj2003, I don't understand how referencing Bon Jovi's the circle or Kayne West's 808 Heartbreak is relevant to my question, would Axl have sold more copies of CD if he used the name Axl Rose instead of Guns n' Roses... especially when you referenced two albums that outsold Chinese Democracy in America. 

I think Oktayaxl makes a wonderful point, worldwide Chinese Democracy has been mostly successful.. so have the band's tours. 

Altho in America the results have been different.  My question is would CD and the band have been more sucuessful if it had been released as an Axl Rose solo album rather than a Gn'R album.

Telling me that Kayne and Bon Jovi have outsold CD in America but not around the world isn't relevant whatsoever to that question.

I just think if it were called Axl Rose more people would be willing to give it a listen and it would have sold more.  There are other factors which I mentioned in one of my previous posts such as Best Buy, the lack of a special edition and the lack of an American tour to support the album.  Axl has done virtually nothing to promote CD in America and that's a big reason why in America it's considered a commercial failure, that and a lot of people aren't willing to buy into Guns n' Roses without Slash, Duff and Izzy.

Not sure what Kanye or Bon Jovi has to do with that but ok!

Assumptions.


If it was released under Axl's name, which would be weird since it's a band effort, how can you assume that all the ones you claim would "give it a chance" would even care since it's not a GN'R album?

Or they would've probably said "this should've been released under the GN'R name! It's that great!". Right?


You're talking about the same kind of people who spent years saying "all we want is an album", even while the band was on tour.

Then once the album was released, it took about a week and these same ones were saying "all we want is an tour".

Well, the tour starts and it was quickly changed to "all we want is an US tour".

When that didn't materialize, they would "discuss" the setlist... When they got bored of that, it's about how "everything was better in (insert random year that first their agenda)".



Nothing changes with some of these people. Don't fool yourselves.



/jarmo

In my opinion If chinese democracy released under Axl Rose name..ıt didn't sell ..not even 1M....It has sold strong worlwide because of the GNR name.

Who fucking cares? It is what it is. Whilst you lot bicker about something that none of you can change, I'm going to listen to Chinese Democracy, an amazing album regardless of who recorded it, what they called themselves, how it was promoted or how many copies it sold.

Enjoy the fuckin music!

: ok: completely agree  :yes:

I'm answering your question with facts... Would Axl have sold more copies if it were billed as a solo album? I think NO. Why? because as a worldwide brand Guns N'Roses is still a big league player. This is evident by the millions of facebook followers and the people who buy tickets to there shows. I mean why would festivals like Reading, Leeds & 'Rock in Rio 2011' be booking them if the general attitude was 'this is not GN'R'..

The reason I'm comparing sales of GN'R's latest album to that of Bon Jovi's album is to show that this album, in today's Rock album market sold pretty well. You can't judge it on 'Use Your Illusion' sales as it is a completely different market now- but you can judge it on current trends.
In my opinion Axl using the 'Guns N'Roses' name is critical to the coomercial success of his band.

If your question is would it have made a difference in the US? I don't know I'm from the UK. But it does not matter where the album sells as long as it does sell.

Again SLASH has a great solo album but it only sold 61,000 in it's first week. And internationaly it was not even close to the sales of CD, in the UK for example it only reached number 17. GUNS N'ROSES (The Brand) sells tickets & albums....

AND I BELIEVE THIS IS GUNS N'ROSES AND I LOVE THEM, AS DOES THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WHO POST HERE SO TAKE YOUR SMALL MINDED ATTITUDE TO THE WORLD AND LOOK AT AN ATLAS (shrugged) AS IT'S A BIG ASS PLACE!

I for one have never cared about the politics of the band, sure they can be interesting and they at times have been more than controversial, it is a part of the excitement, the unknown the never know what your gonna get mysterious Axl we all know and love, so what ever avenues he has  taken to keep this band alive,  I am eternally grateful in so many ways.  If you are indeed a true fan, nothing else matters except the music he brings to our ears, CD is such a great display of his talents, and it has truely touched myself and many others in so many ways.  Thank You Axl Rose ;)

It's playing make believe, and doesn't matter, but...
Do I think the album would have been generally more accepted if billed as another name? Yes, absolutely I do.
Putting it out under another name would have eliminated most, if not all of the negative press that has been written about it.
Do I think it would have sold as well? That I'm not so sure of. You can slap the name Guns N' Roses on a box of cereal and it's going to sell.
Not having that established name means they have to start from the ground up. Having Axl Rose as your frontman is not a bad start, but the GNR moniker affords the luxury's they otherwise wouldn't have.

If the GNR name had been retired, fans would obviously be disappointed that the band they loved was over, but probably view Axl's new project as the next best thing, and something they could get behind as opposed to a new band billed as GNR. A lot of people view that as disingenuous, wether you agree or not. That alone makes it easy for some fans of the classic lineup to dismiss the current.

You can call that negative, closed minded, stubborn or anything you'd like, but in the end it's reality.

The petty and ridiculous Slash vs Axl fan war, and divide of the fan base most likely wouldn't exist, at least not to such a high degree.

You can look at Velvet Revolver as a reference point. They sold well, and a lot of that had to do with interest built from their time spent in GNR, and a lot had to do with people liking what they were hearing. Even though they were 3/5 of GNR, no one could knock them for not sounding like it. For better or worse, they were Velvet Revolver.

I can see where both sides of the argument are coming from. It's certainly a tired argument, and one that will never be resolved.
To me, it may not be the most interesting, but it's a discussion, and nothing more.
Obviously the majority of fans on this site view it as a negative, are defensive about the decisions Axl has made, and that's fine.
Neither side is ever going to convince the other. They are both opinions and should be accepted as such.

I'd love to hear some new material.
I'd probably sacrifice a limb or two to hear Axl sing more Use Your Illusion era material live. Even so, I've never felt anything resembling disappointment at a GNR concert.
You probably won't catch me "bitching" about release dates, set lists, tour dates etc, but at least it shows that people still care.
A lot of fans stopped a long time ago.

Another question might be, does Axl give a shit if it's "accepted"?

Please, we all know the name doesn't really matter that much. It's an excuse for all the so called real fans who blame Axl for breaking up the band and who want nothing more than for him to fail.

They don't want him to be successful.

That's what it boils down to.

Of course they would've been happy if Axl had let GN'R die. It's like a victory for them.



All this has very little to do with the album though. It's all fucking Dead Horse material.

Soon you can celebrate the 15 year anniversary of the name discussion!




/jarmo

I think you're taking the conspiracy theory a little far, there. Maybe listening to "out to get me" too regularly. Just kidding, can never listen to that song enough, but I don't see people rooting against Axl, aside from maybe the media, which shouldn't be confused as a voice of the fans.

I think Axl lost those fans interest altogether. They simply don't care anymore. They aren't at home with Axl Rose voodoo dolls. For the most part they lost interest with all of the alumni, not just Axl.
At least that's what I see/hear from people I know. To them Guns N' Roses did die, but no one's wasting any time or effort pointing fingers at who was responsible.

I don't really care much about conspiracy theories, I don't look for hidden meanings in everything.

I've seen and read enough through the years to know that some have a weird definition of "fan" and "support".

Nothing to do with voodoo dolls and such. You can try to ridicule it all you want, but you can't deny that there's a lot of sad negative people out there who spend their own time spewing a lot of negative shit. I guess just to make themselves feel more important and/or better.

I lost count on how many times I've seen some of them claim "I want Axl/GN'R to succeed BUT...." it always comes with their demands.



/jarmo

I honestly prefer GNR the way it is now than for it to die. Even though im mainly a fan of the old band.

I accept the new band. Hey... at least we're getting tours and music!  : ok:

What ??

AXL, 26
DIZZY, 21
TOMMY, 13
PITMAN, 13
MANTIA, 11
FORTUS, 9
BUMBLE, 6
FERRER, 6

NEW IS DJ, 3

GN'R CAMP ?? JAMES, 26 - BETA, 20

Special Guest >> DUFF (Member Of AFD Debut Disc) & IZZY (Co.Founder GN'R)

What New Band ?? It's Solo Obssesion x One Ex.Member, Please... Blah, Blah, Blah...

 :smoking: 8) :smoking:

Jesus! I either need to be drunk or need a decoder ring for that.^

Years in the band I think

Bill Gates Solutions

When legendary bands go through significant lineup changes, it tends to result in a dwindling fanbase. Examples:

Aerosmith--when Joe Perry and Brad Whitford left in the early 80's, Steven Tyler brought in two new guitar players for the "Rock In A Hard Place" album. No one bought it, no one cared. Only when Perry and Whitford returned in 1984, and Tyler cleaned up, did Aerosmith return to prior popularity levels, with the "Permanent Vacation" album.

Van Halen--David Lee Roth leaves for a solo career, and Sammy Hagar becomes lead vocalist. First two albums, "5150" and "OU812" sell very well, but fans of the original lineup miss the guitar-infused earlier work with Dave, and blame Sammy, though the real culprit is Eddie Van Halen, who was far more interested by keyboards after the monster success of "1984", the last record with Dave. By the time "For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge" is released in 1991, most fans of the classic VH have moved on to Metallica and, ironically, Guns N' Roses. Flash forward to 2011, and the new album featuring the return of David Lee Roth on vocals is rumored to be done, though Eddie's son, Wolfie, has replaced Michael Anthony on bass. We'll see how it fares when it's released.

Motley Crue--after "Dr. Feelgood" hits #1 on the US album chart in 1989, the Crue puts out "Decade Of Decadence 1981-1991", more or less of a greatest hits package, in late '91. In 1992, Vince Neil is fired as lead vocalist, and John Corabi is brought in to replace him. The band releases a self-titled record in 1994 with Corabi on vocals, and it flops. In 1997, Vince Neil returns to the band, and the Crue becomes a popular live act once again, though new album sales don't match the millions sold during the band's 80's/early 90's heyday.

Seems that bands who have faced the death of a fellow band member--AC/DC with Bon Scott, Metallica with Cliff Burton--they have fared better than the bands who have had members quit or fired. Maybe it's because, on a subconscious level, we have to accept those bands with their replacements because we know the others aren't coming back. Led Zeppelin would have likely done very well had they continued, despite John Bonham's untimely passing, and The Who had many successful tours following the death of Keith Moon. It's when all the band members are still alive that make us think, even if it's extremely unlikely, that a reunion is always a possibility. That's why, year after year, GN'R ranks high in those polls that ask which bands you want to see reunite (they're usually behind Pink Floyd and ABBA). The old lineup meant a great deal to a number of people, and yes, those are the people who refuse to accept "Chinese Democracy" as a true Guns album, and refused to buy it, but would pony up hundreds of dollars for a ticket to a reunion show.

In many of those cases record sales have very little to do with line up changes.

Even bands who have stayed together for decades will see decreasing sales/popularity sometimes!





/jarmo

"When legendary bands go through significant lineup changes, it tends to result in a dwindling fanbase. Examples:

Aerosmith--when Joe Perry and Brad Whitford left in the early 80's, Steven Tyler brought in two new guitar players for the "Rock In A Hard Place" album. No one bought it, no one cared. Only when Perry and Whitford returned in 1984, and Tyler cleaned up, did Aerosmith return to prior popularity levels, with the "Permanent Vacation" album."

Actually "DONE WITH MIRRORS" was the Aerosmith "Comeback" album, N' no one bought it.. Aerosmith was featured on MTV a few years later thanks to the popular RUNDMC Walk This Way video..Than came Permanetn Vacation..

Most people just want what they want.  They want a band to put out the same type of album every time, because thats the sound that they liked in the first place.  I'm sure a Guns N Roses album with the original lineup doing nothing but watered down second rate "Appetite" style songs would have sold boatloads more than "Chinese Democracy."  I applaud Axl for going down a different route.  There was nothing more to prove with that style of hard rock, he already accomplished that with Appetite and the Illusions.  Good for him for not just treading water so to speak, by putting out safe albums that sound like the rest of GNR's work just to make some money and keep his career going.  I'm talking to you Ac/Dc with your "Black Ice."

Agreed 100%.  A real artist challenges themselves to grow and pushes their boundaries.  That's one of the things I respect about U2 as well.

Ali

please......its about GOOD songs standing the test of time for the general public, therefor GN'R has a lot....but just many more with the "hard rock" style with the old line-up to (kinda) use your words. lots of people would have enjoyed GOOD hard rock songs by Axl in 2008, but songs like Rhiad, Shacklers, Scraped or OMG (1999) just dont do it.

As of last Monday there were only 2 copies left of CD at the best buy I go to .....

No Man... Is >>

GUNS N' ROSES

 :smoking:

it's a bit o' an insult..But hopefully some on the fence will purchase it n' give it a fair shot..I may buy another 1 or 2 jus' 2 support GN'R!!

Lots of people like to hear the same song over and over again. Some bands find a format and stick with it. Year after year after year.

GN'R isn't one of those bands.  : ok: :)




/jarmo

Lots of people like to hear the same song over and over again. Some bands find a format and stick with it. Year after year after year.

GN'R isn't one of those bands.  : ok: :)




/jarmo
[/quote]
the UYI Set was a big step away from AFD...As CD was a big step from UYI, it's a shame so many people haven't given it a fair shot..I don't understand why people refuse to buy it because it's "not GN'R w/out the other guys"...Axl was/is a main contributor to GN'R..

YEAH! That's right Bodhi ;D ;D ;D

For those who think this sale is some kind of "bad idea" or only would happen to GN'R/CD.

Amazon sold digital copies of Lady Gaga's new album for 99 cents. The week it came out. Not more than two years after its release....





/jarmo

They also gave the Lady Gaga album away at Best Buy (I believe) with the purchase of any smartphone.

When Van Halen brought in Hagar to replace Roth shows you can still have success with lineup changes. Roger Waters left  Pink Floyd and they had success with The Division Bell and Momentary Lapse of reason albums.  You can have success with lineup changes, but it does not happen this way very often.

 But all these examples are from 20+ years ago.

At this point regardless of lineup changes very few artists have success with album sales due to the current state of the record industry.

Jarmo's right, the $1.99 Best Buy sale is good news for GN'R!  : ok:

Not anymore.

I spoke with someone at Best Buy who looked it up for me and he said it's no longer an active SKU online.  They appear to be just selling it in the stores. 

Which he said was really weird -- it's usually the other way around. :-\

Maybe it's not worth it for them to ship an item that's only $2?  The shipping costs would be more than the item itself.  I haven't been to my local Best Buy in awhile, but last time I was there, they had cut their Chinese Democracy inventory just about in half since the price reduction.

CD to be out of print soon/not in stores? Glad I have some copies still sealed   :hihi:





not srs

Maybe, but why are they making Chinese Democracy unavailable online -- why not just charge for shipping or include it in this offer that they make with other CD's.

"Free Shipping
Music and Movie Orders $25 or More

Receive free standard shipping on a purchase of movies and/or music totaling $25 or more"

been a long long long time since I posted....

I saw it yesterday... so I gobbled up 2 copies for 1.99

they had 3 copies of the vinyl record too....

for 1.99!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I wanted once so bad when it came out, but didn't want to pay 20.00

so happy to have it

great album

yeah i picked up 2 more Vinyl copies the other day, i have one for decoration on my desk at work.

Looks like the discounting has had some effect. Check out Nielsen Soundscan's top 10 vinyl sellers for 2011 so far:

1. Abbey Road, The Beatles (20,200)
2. Helplessness Blues, Fleet Foxes (20,200)
3. King of Limbs, Radiohead (15,400)
4. Sigh No More, Mumford & Sons (14,800)
5. Tomboy, Panda Bear (11,500)
6. Bon Iver, Bon Iver (10,900)
7. The King Is Dead, The Decemberists (8,300)
8. Chinese Democracy, Guns 'N Roses (8,200)
9. Angels, The Strokes (7,900)
10. People's Key, Bright Eyes (7,900)

This Saturday My Best Friend Travel To NY City And Visit One Store BEST BUY, Only 4 Disc Of ChineDem. This Discs My Beatiful Girl BUY ALL  :hihi:

HBK Have 4 New Disc Of ChineDem. Version USA/HQ, Pictures.... Comming Soon.

 :smoking: :beer: :smoking:

I see they removed Chinese Democracy from their website. Best Buy in Bismarck,ND is totally sold out. CD and Vinyl. I don't know about Fargo,ND,Grand Forks,ND,or Minot,ND though.

I couldn't find any in Fargo last week, but I would be suprised if it's because they sold them all out.  Wouldn't you? Why wouldn't they have a couple extra in case someone wants to buy one?  I think they got sick of having so many in stock and shipped them out somewhere. 

There's a good amount of CDs around Detroit but almost all the vinyl is gone. The only places I can recall seeing it recently was two Best Buy locations that are pretty remote.

According to an employee on the Best Buy "unboxed" forum, that is exactly what they did.

When I asked if the embarassing $1.99 price tag might have anything to do with making room for the next guns album, the response was, "nope. simple case of supply versus demand. we have way too much supply, but there is no demand".

I think it's going to be painfully hard for guns to get ANY support on getting another album out.

From who, the label?  I don't understand what you're saying here.  Most bands don't even sell 600k copies of their albums anymore and they have no problem getting albums out.

Ali

You need to tone down your act a bit.

After four posts, I can tell what kind of a "fan" you are.

Isn't that embarrassing?

Seen your kind before. Many times.

We get it, it's "fun" to try to stir shit up, even when there's nothing there. Like with your Richard Fortus remarks.



I guess Amazon had no demand for the Lady Gaga album they sold for $0.99 during its first week of release....

Or them selling the U2 album for $4 on the release date....





/jarmo

an avatar suggestion for Stoned_In_L.A.

(http://gametrailers.mtvnimages.com/images/community/userimages/1231900-1263246121-trollface.png)

Act? Easy, bro. I assure you I am neither acting or trying to "stir" anything up for fun.

A member asked about Best Buy being out of stock and I passed along info directly from a BB associate that reinforced his assumption.

Not sure what sparked your little outburst, but if it was my "embarassing" comment, I apologize. You're right. A $1.99 price tag on the "most anticipated album ever" is great news! I'm sure that is exactly what Best Buy was hoping for when they bought all those copies. 

It's not like the album was on sale during its release week. It's 2011 now!


It's not the only album in music history that was on sale.


Some people will try to find something to complain about in everything.

What kind of an embarrassment is it to sell hundreds of thousands of copies without any major promotion?





/jarmo

I'm not alleging that albums don't go on sale, however; I highly doubt that this was the reception that BB had hoped for. They had so many copies that they practically attempted to give it away to clear shelf space. That isn't my assumption, that's the words of a BB associate.

I'm not complaining that they did this. To be honest, it doesn't affect my life in the least. I would have liked to have seen my favorite band's comeback album do better commercially, but when you take into consideration all the balls that were dropped by all parties, it's hardly a surprise that things turned out the way that they did.

If they were so desperate to clear out shelf space, how about actually making sure people knew the album was on sale and not sold for the price on the price tag?

If you read this thread, you'll notice that Best Buy doesn't seem as desperate as you suggest.

They lowered the price and didn't do anything.

The only reason people knew of the new price was because they read it on the Internet.


Great idea to clear shelf space. Let's secretly lower the price and wait for the customers to realize....





/jarmo

That doesn't make sense, they're just selling it in the stores now.  If that was the case they would just sell it online.  This is what Best Buy told me in June:

We did stock this CD when it first came out and some stores still do have it on the shelves.

Best Buy News Center

I'm not sure if I understand what you are attempting to get at?

I saw that the album was being sold for $1.99 in a BB circular advertisement. I didn't learn of the discounted price on the internet.

Based on the BB rep's comments, I do agree that discounting the price did little to move the album.

Did you bother reading this thread?




/jarmo

All 13 pages? No.

GUNS N' ROSES's 'Chinese Democracy' Re-Enters BILLBOARD Chart - Apr. 7, 2011

"Chinese Democracy", the 2008 album released by the current edition of GUNS N' ROSES after a 15-year wait, sold around 3,200 copies in the United States in the week ending Sunday, April 3 ? nearly three times the units (1,200) it shifted the previous week. As a result, the CD has re-entered The Billboard 200 chart at position No. 198.

As previously reported, "Chinese Democracy" can now be purchased at BestBuy.com for $1.99.

It's a good idea to check what's been said earlier...

Before you start making claims.




/jarmo

Fair point. Maybe I shouldn't have said that reducing the cost of the album did little to move it because it did put CD back at #198 in the Billboard 200.

With that said, I would have preferred to have seen this ridiculously low price having made more of an impact. I mean, I'm glad it allowed them to triple previous weeks sales for a week or two, but in the big picture, I would have liked to have seen the product sale based on the quality of material and not price.

Check page two, seems like Best Buy didn't do a good job at informing people it was on sale.

Just an example.






/jarmo

And Well...

ChineDem Is Sold Out In Some Stores

 :hihi:

And it's been on the shelves since November 2008 so let's not go getting too excited about that. But it is good to see some new people exposed to CD even if they fished it out of the bargain bin.

Just to ensure I fully understood the topic of the discussion, I went back and read all 13 pages.

Damn! I was floored at the number of copies some folks purchased; especially the guy who had the back seat of his car filled with copies of the album. I LOL'd.

It made me feel kind of bad knowing that I had only purchased 1 copy and misplaced that within the first six months.

Last I knew, my BB had tons of copies still on the shelf. I'm going to pick up a copy later this week and give the album another listen.

It seems to me that (at least) some Best Buy employees were put off by the whole Chinese Democracy saga, and so if given the chance they'll say anything to disparage the album.  I think it's safe to say that things didn't happen quite as they expected, but as has been stated, they did an absolutely terrible job in pushing the product.  I realize it's not their responsibility solely, but they sure didn't help the cause.

And regardless, I wouldn't trust anything a Best Buy associate has to say concerning why there aren't any copies left on the shelves because there's no demand vs. their abundant supply.  Do you really think they have that kind of knowledge?  Unless that's a decision made at store level, which I HIGHLY doubt with a corporation as large as Best Buy.  That would be a decision that would need to be made at the top of the chain and would trickle down to all the individual stores.  I have a hard time believing that to be the case.  So unless that employee had a close relationship with the high level executives at Best Buy I wouldn't take his word as gospel.

The Important.... Disc Sold Very Good

 :smoking:

Really?

I'm sure most BB associates couldn't care less about Chinese Democracy or how well it sold.

I think its a long shot to suggest that these are just jaded employees who have an axe to grind.

And yes, I think it's HIGHLY possible that the album's price was reduced by 80% because they were trying to get it off the shelves. What other reasonable explanation is there?

Do you think they reduced it because it was selling extremely well?

I figured what kind of a fan you are after reading less than ten of your posts.

Now seeing that you don't even own a copy of the band's latest album, it's even more apparent.



I'm not saying somebody is less of a fan if they don't own all the albums, compilations and so on. But it's kinda telling when certain people are missing that one album in their collection and then act like they are "objective" and "realistic".


It's hard to take these people seriously.....





/jarmo

Really?

So, because I misplaced my copy of Chinese Democracy, I can't be taken seriously?

That's some logic you have there.

I've misplaced and had to re-buy copies of AFD and Lies in the past as well.

Does that do anything to improve my credibility?  :P

To quote you, "I LOL'ed" when I read your posts.

Nothing personal.

Just seen your type so many times before.

"The realist" goes to a fan site to enlighten the blind fans.... We get it.



Have you said one positive thing in your posts without putting some kind of negative angle on it?

You talk about US shows, but start talking about half filed venues.
You talk about the Chinese Democracy album, but not about the art itself, only the sale Best Buy has... Etc. etc..




/jarmo

These Fans perfect fit with his idol

 :smoking:

I covered this earlier in the thread

CD is 1.99 cause Best Buy was the only retailer with their exclusive deal thus they have a lot of copies left HOWEVER every band has hundreds of thousands of excess copies its just they are spread around many many many other stores.

Buddy, where did I say it was reduced because it was selling extremely well?  Re-read my post(s) and show me where I said anything remotely close to that.  I'll save you the trouble, you won't find it.  I NEVER said that.  Obviously they reduced the price to clear the shelves.  Unfortunately though, they forgot to inform store employees, price the CD's accordingly on the shelves, or have any indicators of such a sale price anywhere within the store.  Way to take advantage of dropping that price.

And I can only speak from experience, if you read my post on page 2 of this thread about my encounter with a Best Buy employee where he said the album wasn't one of their finest.  To me it came off as a jaded comment instead of an informed one.  I would be willing to bet a large sum the guy had never ever listened to the album and only formed his negative opinion because it didn't work out quite as expected for Best Buy.

But hey, that's just me.

Repeat Case In Chile"

ChinDem & GN'R = CERO PROMOTION
NO STORES, NO TV, NO RADIO, NO EVENTS TRIBUTE MASSIVE

I & Fans, Promotion Via Facebook, Movil Phone, Friends, etc. November 2008 To September 2010 Price Disc In UNDERGROUND Stores:

$ 25 Dollars (Latin Version)
$ 30 Dollars (USA Version)

After September 2010, Web Store Promotion ChinDem To $ 13 Dolars (Latin Version), USA Version Only Export.

ALL Promotion In Sudamerica After END OF DAYS, 1999... Thanks Real/Fans, Arg, Brazil, Chile, Real/True Info, members, Tours, ex.members, etc.

In Case other Artist in Pop Stores, example > J.LO, SHAKIRA, RED HOT, METALLICA, BLA, BLAH...

FULL PROMOTION, RADIOS, TV, TRIBUTES, NEWSPAPER, INFO TRUE FROM MEDIOS OF COMUNACTION, But... DISC Also In Promo ALL CHILE... 4 Dollars, 5 Dollars, etc.

Velvet Revolver, Libertad... NEW DISC 2007, 10 Dollars, New Disc, Videos, VR In Chile, Interview, etc... DISC Was Fracased...

ChineDem In Chile follows sales, question, by ? WHY PEOPLE NOW KNOW TRUE OF GUNS N' ROSES, MEMBERS, HISTORY... NOW EXIST CULTURE, People normal Buy Disc... they believe ChinDem Is NEW DISC 2011.

 :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:

One thing to cover is that Best Buy is getting rid of many of their exclusive titles by MANY artists. I just picked up a triple live vinyl by The Police the other day at Best Buy for the price of $1.99 as well. I looked into it and found out this was also a BBY exclusive. I asked around at a few stores and was told that Best Buy is seriously reducing the size of their packaged media departments between now and Christmas and a big part of that is clearing out ALL exclusive titles they have a bunch of.

So again, it's a great album for a steal of a price. Why not just be happy with that instead of claiming the sky is falling over it?

That's an interesting point.  It may be that the CD sell-off is related to more of an overall corporate strategic decision.

I'm sure that point will be ignored by the haters, though.  Haters love to hate, bitch and moan, so that's why they look at the situation from a negative perspective.

Ali

Yeah, I hear that.

But having said that, I think that's exactly the plan. Part of my job is to visit several Best Buy locations each day. One of them has a friend I've known for years. He's the one that tipped me off the the media area getting smaller. He looked up a ton of Best Buy Exclusive skus for me and showed me all the price drops. That's how I got in on The Police live LP for so cheap. The Rolling Stones, Elton John and several other artists are effected, not just Guns N' Roses.

If you take the time to re-read what I wrote, you would see that I never stated that you said the price was reduced because it was selling well. I asked if you thought the album was reduced by 80% because it was selling well.

In my Best buy store they've shrunk music dept in half already. very tiny space now.

Certain people are gonna ignore this, as well as other facts, and just keep going with the "only Chinese Democracy's price was lowered" phrase.

It's more convenient than facing facts!





/jarmo

I'm curious, did other cds got on sale for that price, or was it just a Chinese Democracy promotion in the US?

when i say shrunk.. I'm talking so small It took me a while to find it... Blu Ray has taken all the shelf space. Mine had maybe 2 shelves front and back and that was it.

Is your Best Buy still stuck with no running water and electricity thanks to a generator? :hihi:

Haven't visited my Best Buy in months, but last time I was there (January-ish) there was only about 4/5 sections of CDs now...not sure what it is now.

I feel bad for disappointing you (NOT!), but it's not just GN'R: http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?topic=61869.msg1296659#msg1296659




/jarmo

You're not disappointing me, i was just curious. Something strange is happening here in Portugal too. I bought a couple of cds for 3.50 euros

I wish i could buy some new cds for just 2 dollars. I would buy a ton!  :hihi:

Why ask a question we all know the answer to?  Just trying to be smart?

The answer is no.  Next question.

And as other people have stated, there are MANY reasons as to why the price was reduced other than it was selling poorly.  But if you want to harp on that one and only reason, be my guest.

Your comparison is an oxymoron... His Best Buy is being realistic by not carrying CD's... You'd be more likely compared to no running water, while listening to your cd player powered by a generator... Digital is the way it is now

For what it's worth, all of the vinyl copies of Chinese in the Detroit area Best Buys have been sent back to BBY headquarters.

If you see one and you've ever remotely thought about owning the vinyl, grab it while you can!

Interesting.

I went to my local BB today to pick up a 3D tv that I've been wanting.

While briefly looking at the small inventory of albums, I noticed that there were still quite a few vinyls of CD available.

I didn't buy one, but I did pick up the only AFD vinyl that was on the shelf.

Aside from the cd, the only copy of AFD that I own is the vinyl with the banned cover and it's sealed.

The good thing is that they won't sell any more of the vinyls with the sub par sound...

Would love to see a proper edition of it. With no distortion.





/jarmo

You and me both! I'd easily drop another $20-$30 on another vinyl copy if I knew that it was going to sound the way the band wanted me to hear it. Here's hoping.

MY NEW COLLECTION

(http://i56.tinypic.com/bg1g1l.png)

 :beer: :peace: :beer:

what's this?

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/CD/19470459.p?id=2247759&skuId=19470459&st=guns+n%27+roses&lp=1&cp=1

Just run the UPC number through google....


It came up with "Use Your Illusion 2 (Japan) SHM"


In other words, nothing new.

Well played!  :beer:

I'm good on CD copies for now and I finally came across a vinyl where only 4 songs have the distortion so I'm considering myself lucky for the time being. If/when they re-release it with an improved vinyl pressing I will buy it again in a heartbeat.