why are scotts song on contaband not self indulgent but Axls on the UYIs and ..

[dave-gnfnr2k]

why are scotts song on contaband? not self indulgent but Axls on the UYIs and the ones we have heard from CD are?
This always puzzled me. Any good legit answers? Both write about their problems yet there seems to be a double standard.

[killingvector]

scott has this whole 'woe is me, i'm an addict' whereas axl has this 'i'm an abused, tortured soul'? ?

I personally can identify with axl more than scott who has screwed himself over moretimes than not. The emotional problems that axl is dealing are quite deep and not easily solved. I feel for the guy.

[Top-Hatted One]

I think Scott's problems are a lot more serious. I know Axl was abused but that was sooo long ago

[dave-gnfnr2k]

I think Scott's problems are a lot more serious. I know Axl was abused but that was sooo long ago

Child abuse scars are something? that never heals and that was not axls fault, also axl is bi polar, another thing axl cannot help. Scotts problems, ie drug and alchol are from his own doing.? So how is drug and alchol abuse more serious than someone who is bi polar and was abused as a child?

So you are telling me being a junkie and drunk is more serious than having been abused as a child?

[killingvector]

At least an alcoholic or drug addict can seek help, quit the habit, and escape from the abyss. Someone who was abused can never put those demons to rest; they must live with them forever. It is a tough hand to play with; axl has not recovered from the abuse and neglect.

[younggunner]

I think Scott's problems are a lot more serious. I know Axl was abused but that was sooo long ago

lol, are you kidding? Scotts problems are addictions. Axls problems are things he cant control.

Im not going to pretend to know about Axls mental health, because in the grand scheme of things, hes healthy but he has issues. First off, any type of abuse could be traumatising, no matter how long ago it is. It has so many trickle down effects asd you live life you cant even imagine....

They both have thier issues. Its not really abouts whos are worse.

[Booker Floyd]

Despite my reluctance to  participate in what is really just one of Daves countless childish, whiny "Maddy wipes the floor with..."-style thread, I think I can help answer this question.

why are scotts song on contaband  not self indulgent but Axls on the UYIs and the ones we have heard from CD are?

Of course it depends on who youre asking, but common sense tells me that Axls UYI songs werent called self-indulgent because of their personal subject matter, but because they were 6-to-10 minutes long with string sections, choirs, synthesizers, sound effects, etc. 

Yes, thats why you think those songs are great, but if you want to know why critics called them self-indulgent, there it is.  Why arent Contrabands songs self-indulgent?  Because theyre relatively raw, short and straightforward.  Simple enough?

Self-indulgence is Weilands work on 12 Bar Blues, which certainly compares to Axls.

  also axl is bi polar, another thing axl cannot help

So is Scott.  His problems are a little deeper than just addiction...

They both have thier issues. Its not really abouts whos are worse.

A surprisingly on-point statement. 

[killingvector]

Good post booker. I agree with you.

[Top-Hatted One]

yes and it's a fact that Scott is bipolar and has been his entire life.

I guess you're right about never forgetting the abuse but I also don't think people who were abused 30 years ago think about it every day of their lives.

Scott problably has energies to go back to using heroin all the time because as they say heroin addiction never goes away. Right now Scott really seems to be controlling his addiction. I don't think he's gone this long without slipping in years.

[dave-gnfnr2k]

That?s funny booker since I didn?t say maddy is better than anything, I just used it as an example of people calling it self indulgent yet a song like falling to pieces is not.

As for the strings and all that other making the song self indulgent, so are zepplins songs self indulgent, is bohemian rhapsody, one of the best songs ever, self indulgent, are the beatles songs that do this self-indulgent?

Just because an album or song is not raw does not make it self-indulgent.

[killingvector]

yes and it's a fact that Scott is bipolar and has been his entire life.

I guess you're right about never forgetting the abuse but I also don't think people who were abused 30 years ago think about it every day of their lives.

Scott problably has energies to go back to using heroin all the time because as they say heroin addiction never goes away. Right now Scott really seems to be controlling his addiction. I don't think he's gone this long without slipping in years.

As someone who has suffered from abuse, not parental but another kind, when they were young, I can tell you that it affects my life every day. It is not something of which  I consciously think but it has effected the person that I am today.

[Top-Hatted One]

the only gnr song that was self indulgent was "My World" because Axl had complete control over that song and it really wasn't necessary. i don't have a problem with his lyrics. He wrote the lyrics to those songs..you can't fault him for expressing himself

[Oddy]

dave and booker you guys seriously need to settle your differences.

don't you realize you two will always disagree? you have different unchangeable viewpoints on a subject.

i suggest you get in a boxing ring, play ping pong, play chess, i dunno have have a running race because you will never come to a resolution.

see at least if you guys verse each other in a chess game......there's a winner......and a loser. this constant arguing you guys never get anywhere. i dunno Booker i thought you would be smart enough to realize not to respond in these threads since you know 100% that you will disagree with it just by looking at who started it. 

Cumon' you were almost there and then you just had to go ahead and click on it and start writing. ah well atleast you tried

[younggunner]

Because theyre relatively raw

Theres nothing raw about CB.

Scott problably has energies to go back to using heroin all the time because as they say heroin addiction never goes away. Right now Scott really seems to be controlling his addiction. I don't think he's gone this long without slipping in years.

Im not saying adddictions are nothing and shouldnt be taken seriosuly. But with addicitons its all about choice and basic control....when you have mental health problems or  have been abused, those are things you cannot control or chose to be involved with.

[dave-gnfnr2k]

dave and booker you guys seriously need to settle your differences.

don't you realize you two will always disagree? you have different unchangeable viewpoints on a subject.

i suggest you get in a boxing ring, play ping pong, play chess, i dunno have have a running race because you will never come to a resolution.

see at least if you guys verse each other in a chess game......there's a winner......and a loser. this constant arguing you guys never get anywhere. i dunno Booker i thought you would be smart enough to realize not to respond in these threads since you know 100% that you will disagree with it just by looking at who started it.?

Cumon' you were almost there and then you just had to go ahead and click on it and start writing. ah well atleast you tried

First off this thread has NOTHING to do with booker, 2nd this post should have been sent thru PM, and 3rd I think this question is very fair, and its a new topic that has never been discussed and would be something good to talk about.

Bookers post would have been fine if not for his first personal statement about me that was not even correct.

So lets get back on topic, since? this thread has been good so far.

[younggunner]

suggest you get in a boxing ring, play ping pong, play chess, i dunno have have a running race because you will never come to a resolution.

We should have the first GNR Message board boxing match. That would be great. Tommy wasnt kididng when he said GNr fans are crazy....

Booker tends to have a grandiloquent vibe to his posts which tend to irritate,,, me atleast...can say nor do no wrong, calculated type  thang....

[Naupis]

Both singers are tortured and have a more than checkered past. It is the drugs and illnesses that give them something to sing about and have helped them sell millions of records. Both singers have been hugely successful in life in spite of their problems, for that they deserve an atta boy....not a contest to see who's more fucked up.

[Falcon]

It's definately due to song length and overuse of effects and goofy forays into orchestral drivel.  Not to mention the videos accompanying those those songs so rightly deemed self indulgent. 

12 Bar Blues is the ultimate act of self indulgent, a front man run amok left alone to his own devices.

That said, it's a solo record, rightfully used to reflect the artists musical vision..

[Mr Cowbell ?]

I think Scott's problems are a lot more serious. I know Axl was abused but that was sooo long ago

So you are telling me being a junkie and drunk is more serious than having been abused as a child?

Hell yeah being a junkie puts you, your family, your friends, your dealers, and the people you drive by when drunk or stoned in a serious situation, where as child abusers, most go after the people who hurt them (sometimes they go after children)

With that being said I can relate more to Axl's songs through. Scott's lyrics dont flow or really tell a good story, they are a good collection of thoughts, but I just prefer the story in Axl's and thats just my opinion

[dave-gnfnr2k]

I think Scott's problems are a lot more serious. I know Axl was abused but that was sooo long ago

So you are telling me being a junkie and drunk is more serious than having been abused as a child?

Hell yeah being a junkie puts you, your family, your friends, your dealers, and the people you drive by when drunk or stoned in a serious situation, where as child abusers, most go after the people who hurt them (sometimes they go after children)

With that being said I can relate more to Axl's songs through. Scott's lyrics dont flow or really tell a good story, they are a good collection of thoughts, but I just prefer the story in Axl's and thats just my opinion

You are missing the point.  You can help being a junkie or drunk. Just dont drink or do drugs.
And being a junkie or drunk you got that way on your own, you started doing that crap, where as being abused as a child is something you have no control over, and like i said those scars are with you forever.

I am still waiting for somethign to answer my analogy with those beatles, queen and zepplin songs and axls songs being self-indulgent.