Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Well I was kinda bored in my office so I made up this thread about horoscope cause I was talking to a friend and she told me that acuarians are cold and very proudful, dunno what that supposed to mean so what you think about horoscope, sometimes The Zodiac Signs can describe you a little but put all your future to it, mmm I dont think so  ::)

I don't believe in any of that crap. Horoscopes usually mention so many things that, atleast one of them is bound to be true. Lame  :P

Lol - some people believe this stuff - by making predictions ridiculously generalised u can hardly fail :hihi:

My horoscopes have always been way off. There's never anything really related to how my life is going. Whether it's postive or negative.

Well, I'm a cancer and my profile is pretty dead on with my personality. A guy that hides in his shell when there is trouble and constantly thinks the world is aganist him. But, can also be a very caring husband/father. That's basically what it said.

Well, i'm a cancer, but then, i have a sagitarian ascendant and my moon is in aquarius.

This plus many different aspects change the fact that i'm a cancer, because i am far from typical.

Also, i have mostly fire and air in my native chart, a little bit of earth ( thank god i can be a little grounded) and only 1 thingy in water.

What the hell...what's a native chart, I'm not even gonna ask you how you're moon is in aquarius? ;D

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

This is a native chart and this is mine :

(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y4/jessica197592/THEME.gif)

I believe that the zodiac is ok, but the horoscope is kinda bullshit I mean the whole astrology thing has already make a destiny for Us?? I do not think so. Wooooa due can you make my native char I was born 22 january 1980 at 10am  :peace:

I need to know where in the world, what town, country as well as date, year and time to do it or " have the site do it".

No shit! :hihi:

How anyone can believe this stuff ::) Are people so daft they believe their lives are controlled by the stars?! A personality defined by the day ur born - ya know i thought it was ur genetics and environment - but planets seem so much more likely :rofl:

Astrology was always seen as a science and is over 7000 years old.

When there are full moons, animals react and mad people in asylums do too. So does the sea. Why would it be so incredible to think that our solar system does have an influence on you, according to where the planets were the day of your birth ?

AND, the personality is not entirely defined by this nor by anything else. It's much more complex, but astrology is a good help as to what you could be doing in life, it's a help and should not be something that direct one's life, but there to help one understand it, at times.

Please, don't dress this up as science, this is a daft superstition.



 :rofl:

Do i need to say anything here?

I can't resist - mad people respond to it? And of course your not mad?


In science in order for a view to be accepted it has to be provable, if it can't be....well, its nonsense.

Got any proof?

The idea is laughable, there is not even a theoretical basis on which this could work - honestly, how? By Magic? Aren't u too old for that?

By the way the moon is made of cheese and the Earth is flat.



Yes. I know. Its defined by genetics and ur environment :D


So, u believe in reincarnation, ghosts, the future predicting powers of the planets - anything else? The Easter bunny? Santa? A Guns N' Roses song called 'My Favourite Pillow'? :hihi:

So, u believe in reincarnation, ghosts, the future predicting powers of the planets - anything else? The Easter bunny? Santa? A Guns N' Roses song called 'My Favourite Pillow'? :hihi:





I do believe some people have greater knowledge than you and i together and if einstein and newton believed in these and used stars and the universe to think and if that type of thinking helped them discover what we use today, then, i am not mad, nor were they and maybe both you and i do not have enough knowledge to judge ?

I'm a scorpio. I've read a few profiles on my zodiac. I didn't realize I was so mean. haha

I think Izzy's a virgo cause he likes to criticize. haha haha

Well if something is wrong untill it is proven right, then something has a chance of being right till proven wrong? :P
I'm not sayin' I belive in it, but no one can give any concrete proof that it's right or wrong? :-\

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

Astrology does go deep and get a litte too complex but there is a lot of truth to it. It's just not as simple as saying, astrology does not define my personality because that's not entirely what astrology is about.

Astrology is also about how you respond to certain siutations, your dedication to your job, your social life, all of that stuff. There has been too much truth in my horoscopes and profile for me not to believe in Astrology.

I just went to this site and it didn't give me the chart like it gave you but it says that my sun sign is Cancer but my moon sign is Aquaris. It also says my ascendant is in Gemini.

 ::)

Criticism or commonsense? If u believe this stuff you clearly went to a curious school - not Hogwarts perhaps? :rofl:

I'm Libra - which means i don't tolerate absurd superstitions.

 :confused:

Yeah, sure

The planets allignement controls our fate. Do u think that would stand up in court? I killed someone - but its okay 'cos it was the stars controlling me :hihi:

Not enough knowledge to judge, please don't lower me to your level. It really doesn't take much ''knowledge'' to know this is just silly, c'mon how does it work, i keep asking for ur explanation - is it magic? does it alter space/time? How much influence does it have?  How could a celestial body billions of miles away effect your personality?

Got any answers at all?

U lot are all the same - cling to this absurd position because it can't be disproved it must be true. Wrong - the emphasis is on u to prove it. So prove it.

If i was to tell u i own Chinese Democracy the emphasis would be on me to prove it, not someone else to disprove it -  because i would be the one making the claim, understand? If not try reading it again.

Strikes me is this mumbo jumbo is the same as all mumbo jumbo's in the past -  a desperte attempt to give meaning to a boring and pointless existence.

Its 2005 - look at the world, we have evolved beyond all this.

As for ur referal to Einstein - not sure he ever made a theory for the effects of the zodiac on personality, but maybe he did - care to find that equation?

It's no more stupid than organized relegion

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

What kind of defence is that?!

Besides i actually disagree

Atleast organised religion is organised - zodiac bullshit is a loose affiliation of nutcases and profiteers lacking the ability to even agree on a basic theory as to what this thing is!

At least children aren't forced at birth to join the zodiac thing, like with religion. People try to cram religion down others throats, and is the cause of many wars. Anyway I'm gonna stop arguing with you now because I agree with you that it's most likely bullshit, but all religions could just as easily be

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

saying that a planet's movement affects what we do is ridiculous...its like saying someone on the other side of the planet is influencing you...why is it planets? why not continents or monkeys?...the only influence a planet/moon has on another planet/moon is gravity which produces movement between 2 bodies...gravity is a very weak force that certainly has negligible impact on human movement, never mind human behaviour...i may lean a bit further to the left or right but thats about all

Astrology isnt a science , to be a science there has to be proof...there is no proof that astrology works...

Astrology is full of so many variables it conveniently makes it impossible to predict certainties...

i agree with *IZZY* , religion is based on faith that something exists, not proof that something exists...it makes it sooo convenient to say that it exists without proof...

Jessica where did you get that chart thing ? it looks interesting.

I believe my starsign is responsible for some of my personality traits, but that's it really.

If I want an indepth forecast, I'd go to Louise, my tarot reader and therapist.

At least in astrology you have an identity. It's all about you and how you fit into the whole puzzle of life.

the who stars hold the future thing dosnt hold any interest for me. i belive God hold my future in his hands.

What's wrong with reincarnation??, I do believe in that, I know its a lot of faith but a little faith goes a long way, but at least it ends on something. I guess i believe in reincarnation cause I grew up listening infinite dreams and I decided the way of heaven not hell  :nervous:

Im a capricorn and my description is me to the letter.

I thought this thread was about "the zodiac killer" boy, i was wrong...

its funny that im a capricorn and the description is almost completely wrong...im more like a virgo from the source i found...


i dont need astrology to tell me that you are you unique... ;)

www.astro.com, I think? : ok:

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

You have to go to www.astro.com, you create yourself a FREE profile ( unless you want to pay for more ) and then, you go to " free horoscopes and right at the bottom, there is a whole thing about charts ?

You can also mix your theme with someone else's ? To see wether you do or can get on with people, or not ?

You have a tarot reader ? Cool..Is she any good ?

Finally, someone else with a brain!


Bizarely Astrology is widely accepted as a science :nervous:


Ah the mysteries of the universe! :hihi:


Wasn't that what i said? It's a great situation to be in where u can claim something is true and yet not offer any proof ::)

Libra is a sign of justice. Having a fair mind and being able to argue all sides of a case.

I think you'd make a great lawyer, Izzy, because you could argue the brass horns off a bull.

Thanks, Jessica, I'm there right now.? :)


She is super amazing. She uses tarot as a healing weapon.

I owe her a lot, because not only has she given me accurate readings, she's given me a hell of a lot of advice that's saved me.

you into tarot ?

U see, this Zodiac thing is spot on :o

I don't do this for justice, i'm here to save you lot from yourselves


Argue? Who am i argueing against? No one has offered anything that could class as a defence yet

zodiac readings are often given for alignments of the planets taken thousands of years ago. add to that the fact that the universe has expanded a tad since then and that the planets have therefored moved and you've got yourself a big crock of horsehit.

You haven't offered anything as an offence, except the fact that you don't belive in it, that's fair enough. There is no proof that it's right and there is no proof that it's wrong _{I agree that you should be a lawyer though}


The word has changed since the Bible and other holy books were writen aswell (sorry 'bout by ignorance on other religions), but people still have faith in them

:smoking: Izzy ?:smoking:

 ???

Goddamnit

Read before u criticise

Science clearly says for something to be accepted it has to be provable. Zodiac can't be proved - its therefore nonsense. I need to give more of an argument than that??

The age old excuse that u can't prove it doesn't exist is the most laughable thing i have ever heard - ask yourself this, is that really a defence or desperation?

If i was to tell u Kennedy was shot by a gang of free-lance hippies working for Joe Perry u'd say 'where is the proof?' - i'd have to back up a statement i was making.

Where is the difference with the Zodiac stuff then?

This is so very easy

Read again through this thread, all the argument u could ever want is there - but i need to repeat what others have written so well? Sorry, i don't cater for your laziness




What is wrong with u?

What kind of defence is that? Two wrongs DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT

Religion doesn't stand up to any scutiny either. But this isn't a thread about organised religion, thats far too cliche.

I find the responses of those that believe in this stuff highly amusing - the utter irrationality of it!

The zodiac is just a further example of people's desperate need for an ideology - this need for something bigger than themselves to give their worthlives meaning. How small of them.

It infuriates me that people can sit at a computer with all the technology that represents, utilise the internet with all the human advancement that represents and then speak of magic! They can't both exist - either magic or science - u choose. Does the computer work because of technology or god's will or the planets?

Think about it. The sun rises in the morning because of the Earth's rotaion around the sun - not because Zeus wished it or because its being chased by the moon.

Tell me this, when ur ill do u take medicine or do u use a 'healing stone' and channel its energy?

The majority of you're post is insulting me or talking about "magic", both of which have nothing to do with the argument you seem so desperate to start

 :smoking: Izzy :smoking:

I agree with Izzy 100%...

I found this, and had a laugh

" in 1979 a French researcher placed an advertisement in a magazine offering free horoscope readings. Of the first 150 people who responded 94% said the horoscope they were sent was accurate. The only trouble was they were ALL sent the same horoscope - that of a convicted mass murderer! Still, we believe what we want to believe."

I have to wonder at your reading skills, once again, this time with all the long confusing words like 'magic' removed' :nervous:

The Zodiac is just a daft superstition like.....magic! Get the connection? Alright! :D

Ask yourself this - do u live in a world where events unfold because of science, chemical reactions, photosynthesis etc etc or because of planetery alignment and 'magic'?

As other people seem to be able to get my argument (and c'mon i'm making pretty obvious points) i'm guessing your failure to understand it has more to do with you than what i am saying

How on earth could a planet a hundred zillion miles away have ANY effect on your personality? How? Give me even a theorectical basis! If gravity effects your personality then the moon's orbit would cause people to behave differently during the course of a day - do u believe that happens?

Libra
Unforeseen circumstances may compel you to cancel a social engagement. Unattained goals that you have been trying to reach could well be weighing on your mind today, dear Libra, and therefore you might feel the urge to move forward with them immediately. This is a good idea, but take care to move slowly and methodically. You could be tempted to make some rash moves, and this is NOT a good idea at this time.

That is unbelievably general! How could that NOT apply to u - our whole lives revolve around goals we haven't yet achieved - that applies to everyone, everyday of their lives! Moving ahead slowly and methodically - thats what every rational person does anyway?!?!

Very sorry if my argument is too intellectual, i am prone to forget that not everyone on this board had the benefit of a school education.

Thanks :)



Exactly,

ps. great avatar, and a great film too

The Gravitational pull which planets like jupiter and saturn exert on you has about as much strength as a 2 seater sports car on the other side of the planet .... i.e astrology = bullshit.

And why is it that anyone who believes in astrology is female?

Maybe because men are closed-minded. haha (Just kidding)

Astrology has always been a spiritual science, in my opinion. It's not something that can be physically proven. Just like love, hate, or happiness can't be measured.

You are ignorant beyond belief.

..or maybe gullible...


it cant be proven, so its not a science...science relies on solid facts...astrology has no facts...

you dont actually know what the word "science" means but both Izzy and I know exactly what it means...how is that close minded or ignorant on our part?...no matter what it is, it has to be able to be explained rationally...astrology is just a bunch of generic rules with no basis of why those rules exist

There are guys that believe in Astrology. It's just women who believe in Astrology more. You don't have enough posts for me to take your seriously. I know I don't have a lot of posts either but I deleted my previous user account so realistically, I have about 700 posts now.

As far as the rest of you doubters of Astrology goes, it isn't a superstition. It is a set of laws you can live by but you don't have to. Most of the people that have spoken about astrology on this board are stupid and really don't know what you're talking about.

Now, I believe someone when they say how can a planet millions of miles away affect me here on Earth to an extent. But, I go by what my profile says and what my horoscopes have said and 90 percent of the time, it's been accurate.

It isn't about the difference between Science and Magic. You don't have to believe in one or the other.

Hey, not only do I believe in Astrology but I believe in Astronomy, Dinosaurs and God.

astrology is like anything else, u have to take it with a grain of salt and in moderation

if u live your life directly by it and put 100 percent faith in it, i dont think that's a good idea

People need to realize that life is what u make of it, if your horoscope says that your good days are the 18th,20th and 30th

that doesnt mean u cant make everyday a great day

just cause your horoscope tells u that great things are coming your way, that doesnt mean they will

life is what u make of it, you have to control your fate and destiny

if u depend on anything else to fix your life or make things great, you are gonna live a miserable unhealthy life.

 :hihi:

No, i think you'll find that those that contribute nothing to a thread and are unclear even on what the word 'ignorant' means are more befitting your post.

Is it to much to ask for a counter argument? Of course it is, cos u don't have the brain power to come up with one!

Sadly, despite what u think, it is a superstition

Superstition

An irrational belief that an object, action, or circumstance not logically related to a course of events influences its outcome.

-A belief, practice, or rite irrationally maintained by ignorance of the laws of nature or by faith in magic or chance.
-A fearful or abject state of mind resulting from such ignorance or irrationality.
-Idolatry.



What an accurate way to describe your post!

Ladies and Gentlemen the same person who attacks the more educated members of the board also wrote this


Your very very odd.

And i have loads more posts than u so there :hihi:



Idiot.

They are deliberately written to be so general that they apply to everyone virtually everyday of their lives.

Did your horroscope tell you to write crap on this board and delete your last account or was that your own idea?



 :rofl:

U genuinely frighten me.

U can't have both science and magic, science disproves everything magic says so how can u have both? Well? Well?



It's just as well Jesus loves u because no one else does.

answer in pm.

Izzy, you have got to be the biggest asshole here.

You sit there and qoute every section of my posts and then that last one is complete bullshit.

I'm not quite sure there was ever a human being inside of you.

I don't need to reply to your other comments because you obviousily didn't even read my post and I don't give a fuck how many posts you have.

I think it's very sad some people seem to confuse astrology and horoscopes. It's like confusing macdonalds and real food.

Here is a very overall view of what i could be like according to astrology and some of it ( won't ell you which) is very very accurate. I took uranus and the sun as examples of my chart.


You have clicked on Saturn . Read about its position by sign, house, and aspect:

Saturn in the Eighth House    8th hs
Saturn in Cancer   
Mars Square Saturn   
Jupiter Square Saturn   
Saturn Square Uranus   
Saturn Sextile Midheaven   

 

Saturn in the Eighth House    8th hs

You may have to learn some important lessons about money, property and other material resources. In particular, you may have to decide while quite young what rights you and others have to each other's possessions. You may have to learn to share your possessions instead of holding on to what you believe is yours alone.

A quite different expression of this position is a curious fear of change. It may be difficult for you to face the larger transformations that we all have to deal with, such as moving to a new home or losing a friend.

Your approach to life should be looser, for life always changes, and you should learn to flow with it. Unconsciously, you may be reacting to and fearing all changes as if they were death. But changes are really births, and if you can approach them that way, you will be much better off.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

The meaning of Saturn in a horoscope

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Saturn in Cancer   

This placement of Saturn indicates that you need a great deal of emotional security. You must believe that you are loved and that you can rely on your home and family as a refuge in times of personal trouble. Basically you are afraid that your family may not be reliable, that they may abandon you when you most need help.

It is especially important for you to know that you will be loved and supported no matter what you do and who you are. Otherwise, with this Saturn position, your deep-rooted insecurity will be expressed as distrust of others and hiding your feelings from everyone. You may pretend that you are unfeeling and have no concern for others, when really you are very much in need of warmth and affection from them. As an adult, you might get to the point of being totally out of touch with your feelings, not understanding your reactions to persons and situations and thus constantly doing violence to your inner self. Your emotional insecurity can also make you feel that you don't belong anywhere or to anyone, that you are isolated and alone in an unfriendly universe. This situation can be prevented only if you get lots of unconditional love while you are young.

On the plus side, with this placement you are able to discipline your feelings and remain in control at times when others are completely at the mercy of their emotions. You know how to feel without losing track of yourself and your objectives, but only if you are basically confident of yourself and of your place in others' lives.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

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Mars Square Saturn   

With this aspect, life seems hard and unloving to you. And the danger is that you will gradually become hard and unloving toward others. If your family, especially your father, does not give you enough emotional support, you will eventually come to believe that no one else deserves a better break than you got. Most people with this aspect do not become completely hardened, but it is a tendency to watch out for.

Often when you have a burst of energy that makes you want to go forward, something seems to hold you back. That is very frustrating, but what it really means is that you have to be very thoroughly prepared in anything you do. The universe will not let you get away with doing anything in a half-baked way. If you can accept that with patience, this aspect will lose much of its sting.

Anger and irritation are often a problem with this aspect, because the action of Saturn inhibits the action of Mars. Be careful that you do not let your anger build up so far that it takes over. You don't lose your temper easily, but when you do, you do it spectacularly. But bitterness can distort your vision and make the whole world look bad. It also causes you to withdraw from others and become unreachable.

Sometimes the effects of this aspect surface on the physical level as a tendency to break bones easily or have bone infections and even rheumatoid conditions at an early age.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

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Jupiter Square Saturn   

This aspect often signifies that you are mentally restless and find it difficult to accept the world as it is. Very often you may feel that circumstances or persons limit you unnecessarily, and you work very hard to get around any limitations imposed by others. Even your internal discipline is hard to maintain at times, because you tend to get restless very easily, always looking for something better and not being satisfied with whatever you have now.

This aspect is quite common among people who have made a great deal of money, as well as those who have lost a lot of money, because it indicates that you cannot stand still; that is, you must always be moving either forward or backward. As you get older, having money may or may not be a major objective in your life, but having the power to change the world around you will be important. You want to be a person of some significance in the world. However, your restlessness and impatience may cause you to lose out on many opportunities. You must calm down and be a bit more accepting of life as it is.

Try not to constantly change your activities and objectives. Many persons with this aspect continually move from place to place, changing jobs and careers but accomplishing very little each time. You can accomplish a great deal more if you stick to one objective for some time, because you do have many skills and abilities. The problem is that if your expectations are too high, nothing can ever live up to them. Life can give you quite a bit, but you must learn to live within its limitations.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

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Saturn Square Uranus   

This aspect indicates considerable tension within you, which you can usually keep under control. However, it will occasionally burst out in the form of sudden, unpredictable acts, such as breaking away from relationships, bursts of temper and such. You will not be easily driven to this point, but you may unconsciously construct the conditions that bring you to it. You must make an effort to learn how to relax and release your tensions gradually. It is particularly important not to hold in all outward expressions of tension, because psychosomatic illnesses can result if you do.

This aspect may be expressed in another way, as a tension in your life between personal freedom and authority or sense of duty. One part of you is always trying to toe the line set by others, while another part wants to break free. Usually you feel that you can fulfill your obligations only by giving up personal freedom. It is difficult for you to be yourself, do what you want to do, and at the same time do what you have to do. Rebellious behavior, along with a tense and grudging acceptance of your duties, are characteristic of this aspect.

All of this may lead you to take a very negative view of persons in authority, such as parents, teachers, police and officials. And if you do not learn to handle the tension in your life, you could have serious collisions with such persons, which you are not likely to win. Learn to stand up for your rights without being negative and difficult. If you can build discipline into your own life, it will not have to be imposed from outside by people whom you resent.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

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Saturn Sextile Midheaven   

This signifies that you have a strong sense of inner discipline and that you can work toward the goals you set for yourself steadily and without wavering. It may also indicate that you work mostly alone, without much help from people of your own age. They will not hinder you, but you work best by yourself.

Whatever task you undertake, you work at patiently, with thorough organization and method, leaving no stone unturned. You may take on responsibilities that most young people would be reluctant to attempt. In many ways you may be older than your years.

You are independent, even a loner, because having other people around may seem to distract you from your purposes. For this reason you may not have many friends while you are young, but that will be because you have chosen it, not because no one can get along with you. When you are older, you will be a very dependable person, because you have worked out your own methods and have proved to everyone that they work.

As you grow, you will have the aid and assistance of those in authority, such as teachers and parents. They will approve of your early maturity and will help you find your course. When you are older and working for a living, your relations with employers should also be good, because they will know you can be trusted to do a job well and take responsibility.

ou have clicked on the Sun . Read about its position by sign, house, and aspect:

Sun in the Seventh House    7th hs
also: Sun in the Eighth House    8th hs
Sun in Cancer   
Sun Square Pluto   
Sun Trine Uranus   

 

Sun in the Seventh House    7th hs

You are at your best with another person, either working or just having a good time. You are able to adjust your own needs to someone else's so that together you make a pair that works better than either of you would separately.

You are very social, and you have learned early in life to get along with others. For this reason, you are able to help others patch up an argument, because you see both sides of the controversy.

Some people express another side of the seventh-house Sun. You may really feel like arguing and fighting with others, instead of trying to get along. Don't make a habit of it, because everyone gets tired of fighting eventually.

You should learn to be more independent. Also avoid making compromises that require you to give up something essential just to keep a friend.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

The meaning of the Sun in a horoscope

The Sun is located near the end of the seventh house and is therefore also interpreted in the eighth house.

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Sun in the Eighth House    8th hs

A serious person, you know that you will have to go through many important changes as you grow. You are attracted to mysteries and to finding out about the deepest aspects of life.

While you are young you may not be able to distinguish between what is yours and what belongs to others. As an adult, however, you will probably make a career of handling other people's property or money; if you learned the lessons of your youth, you will be unusually responsible about handling possessions - yours as well as others'.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

The meaning of the Sun in a horoscope

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Sun in Cancer   

You are an emotional person who is sensitive to the subtle ways that people communicate with each other.

You very much need to have emotional support and to know that your loved ones love you, especially your mother. When these needs are fulfilled, you are a very generous and giving person.

However, if your own basic needs are not provided for, you will withdraw into yourself and act very insecure. An insecure Cancer can be very selfish, just as a secure one can be very generous.

You probably have a secret, quiet place that is all your own, where you can go and be alone with your thoughts. Wherever you go in life, one of your first objectives in new surroundings will be to find such a place for yourself.

Your home and family will always be important to you.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

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Sun Square Pluto   

You must learn to be very careful how you deal with others, especially people in positions of authority. You tend to get involved in personality conflicts in which you have to prove your strength or suffer defeat. These conflicts often arise without your understanding how they came about. Others often misunderstand your actions, which puts them on their guard. You know that you do not intend any harm, but others may not realize this. Another problem is that when you are angry, you are likely to be extremely angry, and you may seem rather violent. Even if you cool off quickly and never carry out any of your intentions or threats, you may scare others into protecting themselves.

As you get older, you will probably be quite ambitious, and you will work very hard to get ahead. Do not expect to have an easy time, however. Others will continually force you to prove that you are good at what you do. This opposition from others could make you so strong that you will triumph over it, or it could make you give up in defeat. If you can keep trying against all odds, you will probably achieve quite a bit in life. You should know that in spite of the obstacles you may encounter, if you try as hard as possible, the results will be worth it.

Interpretation by Robert Hand from "Youth Portrait", which is also an interesting read for grown-ups.

Alternative interpretation by Robert Pelletier

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AstroClick? Portrait top

Sun Trine Uranus   

You are fond of anything new and want to live just the way you want, with plenty of excitement and interest. You want your life to be filled with change. The idea of spending a lifetime in one place doing one thing is very unpleasant, and you will do everything you can to prevent it. As you get older, you will probably break away from your family and your past and move out in a totally new direction. You may remain on friendly terms with your family and birthplace, but you will refuse to be tied down by them.

Also you won't be tied to the standards of behavior that have come down from the past. Even while quite young, you will work out your own code. You will always be tolerant of persons who are quite different from yourself; in fact, you may even be attracted to them because of that. You want to see as many different aspects of life as possible.

You will enjoy new and stimulating kinds of recreation, such as hang-gliding, sky-diving or other wild pastimes, even if others consider them quite risky or terrifying. You enjoy the excitement, however, and are bored by the tamer games that most people play. Although by itself this aspect does not create much danger from accidents, you should be careful that your desire for excitement does not get you into truly dangerous situations.

you believe in dinosaurs????...have you ever been to a museum? an archeologist can prove that dinosaurs exist...there is no doubt that they did...how can you "believe" in them when its a fact? archeology is a science, proof

astronomy is the study of stars and their origins...how can you believe in this? are you saying there are no stars to study?


horoscopes are taken as a generic form of astrology, no confusion...they are from the same corner...i disagree with your analogy...more like its like confusing mcdonalds with kentucky fried chicken..real food would be astronomy

and still noone offers a decent argument for the existence of astrology

who decided which date is associated with certain actions and emotions?
if an astrology chart is unique then there would be trillions upon trillians of combinations...where do these combinations derive from? who said what was what? so many different variables it would be impossible to compile all the associations...

i was looking at a horoscope of mine for today...and i was thinking it could easily apply to hitler too...so generic...i cant believe that people believe in this

Thank you, you bring so much to this board.


I agree - posts in which people say gibberish are much better - i have reformed my evil ways and will now emulate (that means copy) your style.



You know i'm a robot - what gave it away? :rofl:



 :rofl: :hihi:

I quoted every single line of your post - and yet...didn't read it? How did i do that without reading it? Go on, explain that.



You don't? Then why did u write this:


Post's seem to concern you A LOT

I'm still waiting for a sensible reply to the points i made eg. how u can believe in both science and magic, how the zodiac could work etc.

When u feel like contributing to this thread, please return :)

Another excellent post.

To those who believe this superstition,

Who come up with all this stuff and why is he/she accepted to know the 'truth'?

Maybe they made a mistake? Maybe they were high.....or maybe they were an opportunist, and realised they could make lots of money from this?

 Questions - Answers
Question: How does astrology work?

Answer: There are many theories but no proofs. The fact is that we do not know how astrology works.

Question: If you don't know how astrology works, then doesn't that prove that astrology is not scientific. Science is based on theories, right?

Answer: Wrong! Science is based on observation. More specifically, science is based on the scientific method. Theories are extremely important in science because theories help the scientist make predictions of how things will behave in a new context. Without theories, science would proceed at an incredibly slow pace. But one can make clear, indisputable observations without any theory at all. For example, I can predict that any heavy object dropped from a table will fall to the ground. The fact that heavy objects fall to the ground was true before Newton discovered the laws of gravity. The laws of gravity, however, expand our understanding of how gravity works and allow us to predict the movement of celestial objects and of astronauts in space, for example. Theories enable us to synthesize seemingy unrelated facts into a coherent paradigm, and enable us to make other predictions and discoveries. Theories are critically important, but a theory can change without affecting the validity of an observation. Before Sir Isaac Newton discovered the laws of gravity, one could still predict that an apple will fall out of a tree and hit the ground rather than fly out into space, and you do not need to master physics to know that apples fall to the ground.

Question: But astrology just doesn't make any common sense at all. There is no magnetic or gravitational force or any other explanation for why planets should affect humans, and the theories of astrology just don't make common sense, they seem more superstitious. How can astrology be considered a science?

Answer: Lots of theories in physics don't make common sense either. Albert Einstein and other 20th century physicists have proposed all kinds of absurd and seemingly ridiculous ideas such as space is curved (so therefore the fastest way to get to distant galaxies is a curved path rather than a straight line!), that time is really a fourth dimension, and not separate from space, that looking at something alters its position, that subatomic particles move so fast that time is experienced differently for these particles; time can speed up or slow down as the speed of an object changes! Now these ideas don't make common sense, and sound like the stuff of science fiction, but they are taken seriously by physicists not as science fiction but as valid and serious scientific theories. In short, it is not necessary for an idea to make common sense to be scientifically sound. A theory only needs to fit the data, that's all.

Question: But what data do you have in astrology? Hasn't astrology been disproven?

Answer: Many people have conducted very impressive research studies in astrology. Here are the names of a few of these people: John Nelson, Mark Urban-Lurraine, Ann Parker, Ray Merriman, Theordor Landschedit, and John Addey. There are many others. The research results are very impressive. Click here to read a very recent, very impressive research study conducted by David Cochrane. In order for these studies to be considered scientifically valid, they must however be reviewed by experts in the scientific method, and be published in an accepted scientific journal. This level of research requires huge amounts of time and typically a great deal of money as well. Astrology currently is caught in a chicken-and-egg situation: the research requires great amounts of time and money, and the interest of a prestigious scientific journal in publishing the research, but astrology is still foreign to our college and universities, and they are unwilling to invest the resources required to validate the studies. No, astrology has not been disproven. The scientific method is one of the great keys to the great advancements of our modern times, and the scientific method should be adhered to and respected. Ironically, astrologers are sometimes attacked by scientists for promoting pseudo-science and superstition, and I have heard scientists state that astrology has been disproven, a statement which is untrue and unscientific! I do agree that the silly Sun Sign column in the newspaper is absurd, and the image of astrology that much of popular astrology conveys to people is simple-minded at best, and often completely ridiculous. Until articles are published in respected journals that validate or invalidate astrological principles, the question of astrology's status as a science is undetermined, but I think that anyone who reads the work of serious researchers such as those listed above will be impressed by the research done and feel as I do: eventually thorough research will be done and will demonstrate that there is validity to astrology.

Question: So what is astrology? Is it more than Sun signs?

Answer: In the latter half of the 20th century astrologers have discovered complex interactions among the planets, which have developed new schools of astrology, two of which are known as the theories of harmonic astrology and cosmobiology. These new approaches to astrological interpretation are extremely cumbersome without the calculating power of a computer. Even older analytical procedures used in astrology require a great deal of computation. With the advent of the home computer astrology is now liberated from the restrictions of hand-held calculators and books of tables, and serious astrological work is now available to everyone. In short, the rules for astrological analysis are very complex and intricate, and in order to use newly discovered techniques it is, practically speaking, necessary to use computer software to perform these calculations.

We are dedicated to developing the tools (that is, computer software) that make real astrology, the sophisticated analytical techniques that really work, possible. The result of this work is the Kepler program, which we continue to work very hard on improving, refining, and expanding. Along with all of the technical issues, we continue to add features that make the program entertaining and interesting, such as many hundreds of original graphic pictures, a "Live Mini Reading", a part of the program where the interpretation is spoken as you watch graphic illustrations on the computer monitor, the "AstroEncyclopedia" which contains a huge reference work of information, and "Avalon College" which teaches you astrology, so if you aren't an advanced student or expert astrologer, you can learn right within the Kepler program. The Live Mini Reading, AstroEncyclopedia, and Avalon College are all part of the Kepler program. We use very accurate planetary routines to ensure that the chart calculations are accurate, and we supply a complete atlas of cities, time zone, and daylight savings time information within the Kepler so that charts are calculated accurately; without all of these components, the calculations will simply not be consistently and reliably accurate.

Question: I am new to astrology and I am skeptical, but let's suppose that astrology does have some validity. So what? What can I do with it? Is it useful to me?

Answer: Astrology is useful to nearly everyone. The Kepler program comes with several interpretive reports, which are known as the Cosmo Natal Report, Cosmo Compatibility Report, Cosmo Forecast Report, the Major Life Theme Report, the Live Mini Reading, and the Profile Report. There are also many additional interpretive report options which can be purchased, but even with the interpretive reports that are included with the Kepler program, you can begin to see the pattern of a person's life, the inner drive and meaning behind their behavior, and you can really appreciate and respect, not just intellectually understand, people in a way that is difficult to achieve with other tools.

People use astrology in many different ways, from investing in the stock market, making business decisions, to analyzing political situations and social movements. The applications of astrology are almost endless. There are many theories and approaches to astrology, and very little hard and fast scientifically proven facts, but a new foundation for astrology is being built, and there are people using astrology succesfully in very concrete areas, such as investing and finance - that is certainly an area where you can pay dearly for making a mistake!

Keep in mind also that a great deal of modern psychology has not been proven yet. For example, many psychologists emphasize the importance of self-esteem in people's lives, and the importance of developing self-esteem in children. This is a concept that is extremely difficult to prove scientifically, but for people that work with people and analyze situations carefully, the importance of self-esteem is obvious. Psychological theories, such as repression, projection, or displacement or also difficult to prove scientifically, but to a person trained in psychology often easy to identify, and very useful to better understanding an individual. Astrology currently does not have the support and endorsement of universities and research journals, and there are many very tricky and difficult problems that one encounters in attempting to scientifically test astrological theories, but it can be done, it has been done already to a small degree, and the development of good software tools and the dedication and interest of many talented people in the field of astrology is now giving a re-birth to what may appear to be an ancient superstition which is gasping on its last breath, but is now proving to be one of the great technological wonders of the future.

Congratulations - u can copy stuff from a web site. please note to fit the word limit i have had to cut the quotes, its not an effort to remove points i can't counter ::)


 :nervous:

U don't know how it works - yet still claim it does? If u don't know it it works how do u know when its working properly, or not at all?


What a curious argument! Science is also based on experimentation that can be repeated.

It's just a 'clever' way of saying 'you can't disprove it'. The absence of an argument not an argument itself.

By the logic of that argument every religion can also exist, in fact by that argument anything and everything can exist and is simply waiting for a supporting theory!

Because there is no theory doesn't preclude its existence? True, gravity was just waiting to be discovered - but that's the key point, it existed and was waiting to be explained coherantly. The Zodiac fits into no scientific framework - there is no theory because there is nothing to discover.

How does the zodiac fit in with all the scientific laws that have been established and proven and leave no room for the zodiac- like the theory of relativity - do u honestly believe all these physists etc are wrong? The arrogance! How dare u claim without even a formal background in the sciences the corner stones of science to be false!

Stephen Hawking and Eistein never found a basis for this - but you would claim to posses a greater knowledge of the universe?!?!

The curious point about observations - have u actually observed the zodiac in effect? If so then u can surely answer the first point about how it works?



Er...it makes perfect sense to me. What's more it has been tested by everyone under the sun and they find the positions fully inline with the evidence. Why wouldn't it make sense?



Hence why there is no theory for the zodiac - we have no data, no data because there is no evidence, no evidence beause no one has ever shown the zodiac to have any effect...



I bet they are!

In Nazi Germany doctors ''proved'' a Jewish race. Its quite remarkable what biases research can achieve!


 :rofl: The old argument by default again - by that logic i can claim to be the real Izzy Stradlin', it can't be disproved can it? Prove i am not Izzy writing from a computer in England. U can't

Doesn't mean i am Izzy though

U understand?

We can't prove it because we haven't got the money! Fantastic, i love that one. Sounds like an excuse to me ''the man's keeping us down!' :rofl:

Ever thought why they might be unable to get funding?

 :rofl:

How much money do u think Einstein needed for the theory of relativity? How many computers did he need? None. They didn't exist.


Fantastic, without any idea of how it could concievably work they plan to chart it and control it, well good luck with that!


I think you'll find a person's behaviour is driven by their genes and environment - the idea some supernatural force controls your behaviour is laughable. By that logic my argument against the zodiac would be controlled....by the zodiac :rofl:

How much control does it have? Why can two people with the same 'prediction' behave differently?


 :rofl:

They ''achieved'' because of their star sign - as opposed to ability, understanding and opportunism. Of course :D


Indeed - and large amounts of that is grossly unsound as well, and is viewed as such

 
Something has been observed and a satisfactory explanation is under formulation - what has been observed in the zodiac?


Especially if the psychologist is looking for it : ok: By ignoring what disagrees u'll be amazed how often things agree with your perception.

Many of these 'syndromes' come about because of selective use of the evidence - Attention Hyperactivity disoder (AHAD) is a case in point

 
I'd say so - proving something that doesn't exist is a challenge and a half.

Ever thought why the universities might not be intrested in this?

Two reasons possible reaons:
 
one: they are evil people seeking to maintain a status quo they benefit from

two: they represent the finest minds on earth and realise this is rubbish

If u choose the first you should seek help, that kind of paranoia is dangerous, do u also believe secret organisations run the world and the Government covered up aliens at Roswell?


This article is truly scary. I have read similiar justifications for those new age cults where they all kill themselves. By suspending commonsense it is amazing how far you can go.

Proving a technological wonder? How is it proving? Please show this 'proof'

That article is absurd - neatly side stepping the fact they have no evidence at all.

Ask yourself this: if evidence is not needed to support a viewpoint, what would be fundamentally wrong with a belief the internet is actually a living being? Or that trees eat people?

There is nothing that supports the zodiac anywhere - so how can it be true? Because scientists are incompetant?

A position can only be accepted when there is evidence that supports it - if u take away the need for evidence anything goes.

Please don't reply by saying the evidence does exist it just hasn't been found yet - that is NOT an argument. And even if it is accepted as an argument it can be used for anything.

Izzy, although you always want to be right about everything, the reason i posted this was because i thought it would be a good read.

Contrary to you, i don't try to impose my view on others. I have my own beliefs and so do you.

excellent post izzy, it said just about everything i wanted to say and much more

there is no evidence to support the validity of astrology...that definition of science is correct but the fact is that scientific experiments are repeatable again and again is the important step...there has been no article in any magazine which verifies that astrology produces repeatable results...

not to mention that humans tend not to know exactly how they feel which can make the results even more skewed towards astrology's favour as people seek to find something to attach themselves to...its all in the mind, its psychological

where did astrology and all the other foretelling practices come from? it would be good to see if anyone knows the answer...tarot for instance used to be a card game :hihi:

here is a link you may be interested in...pseudoscience...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudoscience
imo astrology et al fall into this category...

Agree With You, even though I dont believe in astrology and stuff but I dont try to obligate people to think what I think, I guess this topic is more for opinions than for saying whats right or wrong.


As I said before I dont believe in zodiac either remember I was bored and a friend told me something about astrology, but the paragraph you just post doesn't mean anything at all, I mean the things to be discovered are supossed to be waiting, how can anyone expect that something that hasn't be discovered yet can be discovered later If it's not supposed to exits just an hypothesis?. Once again my opinion

feck it I realise that astrology is about as accurate as US intelligence on Iraqi WMDs, but people (i. e. women  ;) ) have every right to believe in it if they want. After all their not hurting anybody right? besides if u know some sexy chick is into astrology you can use it to your advantage with lines like "Wanna bring Uranus back to my place?"  ..... take that one home with ya

:rofl: That was priceless? : ok:

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

errum whats the story ladies?
If I didn't agree with ye about the whole astrology thing ye would be getting a mighty slagging.
I better remember to keep my arse to the wall in this place

Mine is rarely ever close to being right.

Changing someone else's post could be viewed as libel.....

and look - i can do it too ::)


Caesar, why did u write those things? :hihi:

C'mon, if u wish to be ''funny'' try harder :)

 :o

You DON'T want to be right all the time? Ur happy being wrong?

Obviously i want to be right :confused:


And not to try and argue all my points? That was just a amazing consequence?



You claim the Zodiac is right - by definition that is a view and by addressing it to me you are trying to influence my opinion....


Indeed, but not all views can be just accepted as an individual's right - people out there advocate suicide bombing and worse, there comes a point when a dangerously wrong view must be addressed.

I don't want to live in a world where any one can say any old rubbish and not be held to account - that's a dangerous society, i think rational people will agree.

People see evidence and seek to account for it, apples fall to the gorund someone asks, 'why?'

From the evidence - the falling applies - comes a theory to explain

The evidence comes FIRST. Without evidence many things will never be discovered, we may never know how the universe was created, or why or when it will end, or even if it will.

With the Zodiac there is nothing to explain - no evidence hence no theory, and a theory without evidence is meaningless

A theory or hypothesis is only an attempt to explain something, but what is there to explain in the Zodiac as there is nothing to indicate it exists?

I hope i answered your point, if if i've totally missed your point just fire it my way again and i'll have another go

Get over yourself, no one is trying to infleunce your opinion

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

 :confused:

Any post addressed to someone that offers a view different to the recipients own is trying to influence them, that's the way language works. If your not trying to influence someone u say nothing. How can someone say 'your wrong' without implying that the recipient should alter their position? How can that not be an attempt to influence? I don't think anthing i have said is really that profound to cause confusion.

Why do people feel the need to post meaningless replies? Wannabe-izzy you have proved you don't understand what we are talking about, so why don't u just stay away?

awwww come on dude, dont be a prude, there is always space for one more  :hihi:

funny, that by saying what you just said you are trying to get izzy to stop believing that he is being influenced...therefore he is being influenced...geddit?

Funny, you bear one of my greatest flaws or what used to be :

you think you are so godam intelligent !

And your ego is as large as a field of potato !

You must be so insecure to try and crush people's opinions like this !

O P I N I O N

Like sharing an info and not necessarily trying to influence the other but wanting to learn about his/her view on a given subject ?

opinions and arguments need facts to support them...you have not given any facts or theories to support your arguments, all "facts" you have given have been easily disproved...no facts, no proof, i think eskimos live on pluto without breathing masks, i have nothing to verify that this is true, although i have seen little white specs of dust in the planets atmosphere so clearly it must be true...astrology is a false science

opinions and beliefs are not sacred.

After the assassination attempt on Ronald, Nancy Reagan began planning everything Ronald did around astrological principles.  Everything-- speeches, travel, press conferences, etc.-- were all planned around readings from one of the world's top astrologers.  Make of that what you will.

And if this has already been mentioned, my apologies.  I'm too lazy right now to read the entire thread.

opinions and arguments need facts to support them...you have not given any facts or theories to support your arguments, all "facts" you have given have been easily disproved...no facts, no proof, i think eskimos live on pluto without breathing masks, i have nothing to verify that this is true, although i have seen little white specs of dust in the planets atmosphere so clearly it must be true...astrology is a false science

FALSE! i know the leaning of words better than you do " iq" :

opinion
 
 
 
 
o?pin?ion [ ə p?nnyən ] (plural o?pin?ions)


noun 
 
1. personal view: the view somebody takes about a certain issue, especially when it is based solely on personal judgment
In my opinion it?s all a waste of time.

 
2. estimation: a view regarding the worth of somebody or something
They had a pretty low opinion of me.

 
3. expert view: an expert assessment of something
I told the doctor I wanted a second opinion.

 
4. body of generally held views: general assessment, judgment, or evaluation
pundits and other opinion formers

 
OR

A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof: ?The world is not run by thought, nor by imagination, but by opinion? (Elizabeth Drew).
A judgment based on special knowledge and given by an expert: a medical opinion.
A judgment or estimation of the merit of a person or thing: has a low opinion of braggarts.
The prevailing view: public opinion.
Law. A formal statement by a court or other adjudicative body of the legal reasons and principles for the conclusions of the court.

 
 

So next time someone tries to speak to me as if i was a brainless bimbo, check your facts and open a dictionnary, because i love the word" opinion". It is also one of the rare words that has a legal value and that cannot be attacked in a court of justice. Because an opinion is not based on facts. Therefore it is not a proof and therefore, it cannot be attacked.

I love words, i love debating, although i am not the most intelligent person on the planet, i love to share what i like with people who either like i too or who are mature enough to ask without judging.

What i dislike is being spoken to like shit solely on the fact that some might think themselves a lot more clever than they really are.

I do not have that pretention.

Oh my......pray tell, what are your other ''great'' flaws? A belief in the absurd? Being Gullible? Unable to structure a coherant defence?


I believe judgements need evidence to be meaninful and can structure an argument - if this strikes u as arrogant, then so be it.

I would say any human of sound mind and judgement could do the same.


Your mama is so fat :confused:



I'm a monster ain't i? ::)

I have explained my motives for why i reponded - i'm trying to save you ignorant bastards from yourselves :hihi:


We have already established you are trying to influence 'non believers' so don't give me that :)

I can't help but view your posts as a desperate attempt to deflect attention from your lack of ''argument'' - i'm still waiting for the proof and research your article talked about

Also, i'd really, REALLY like a reply to all the points i've been making which include:

Why is it that Universities and journals want nothing to do with the zodiac nonsense?

There are plenty of others.

Izzy, even if anyone gave you solid proof that this Zodiac business was correct you'd still say it's bullshit

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

Please, we don't view you with nearly as much respect :rofl:



This has me baffled....it really does

An opinion is nothing more than your personal views, they prove nothing - having an opinion on the zodiac doesn't legitimse it.

Can't attack it in court? What courts do u have in France? An opinion can be attacked for its baseless nature, which goes on in every court in the free world


 :nervous: :confused: ::)

What the fuck? Once again:

It can be attacked for its baseless nature....



...Just struggle as to how to use them, you don't seem familiar with the concept that if u express an opion to someone who holds a contray view you are trying to influence them...


You call this a debate?!

You haven't managed a sensible reply yet....


Or even in this thread....


OMG

Mature enough to ask without judging?? RU Serious?? Maturity involves a skeptical mind, you just accept things? Okay then - the world is flat and moon made of cheese


The percieved slights come from a sensible position that reveals you as absurd


Just like you don't try and influence! :rofl:

Is someone going to give a sensible view, certain people on this board have made it clear they would rather speak nonsense, and i grew tired of it.

 :rofl: :hihi:

You refuse to read my argument and then just drop in pointless posts to boost your post count - ur getting there!

My complaint with the Zodiac is there is no proof = doesn't exist, and that people claim otherwise in the face of reason

Clearly this opinion would be set aside in the face of proof....


By the way you got any proof?? :hihi:

My god! Your right!

Clearly this prevented him from being shot again! This is the proof we've needed! :rofl:

Pray tell - did the zodiac also compel him to sell illegal weapons to fund the Nicuraguan rebels? :hihi:

BS, I did read you're "argument"

Well which one of us just posted three times in a row? :confused:

I'm not sure exactly how many more times I'll have to say this: I don't need proof because I don't even belive in this stuff. All I'm tryin' to say is that you're reasoning skills are shit, even if you're confident that you're 100% correct could you at least listen to others opinions with out posting back insults? ???

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

Goodie, more!


My bad, sorry, i just thought because you never seem to understand my position u just must not have read it

But of course you have read it..so why u misunderstand me...well, who knows?



Ohh swish! I was replying to posts my three different people - i have enough respect for them to do it individually rather than bunching them all together, i want them to be able to find my reply - i'd hate for people to get...confused ;)



U don't believe in it...and don't have an argument against it - remind me, why are u in the this thread? Oh i forgot - post count.



U have examples of this of course? U will promptly reply demonstrating the gaping hole's in my argument? I'm waiting :)

My reasoning skills :rofl: I am argueing against people who believe in what doesn't exist and its my skills your commenting on :rofl:


 ::)

I quote every fucking line - how can i do that and not have listened to their frantic screams?
 

No, no - its my argument which is making u feel stupid, i merely have to put in a few smilies to make it look cool 8) ;)


Is the stuff your smoking the reason you post such...curious...replies?

Yes? :yes:

If you want me to stop "raising my post count" then stop replying to me, if you want to have a proper argument, which it seems you do, then stop refering to my post counts and my lack of education and start giving me points that you dissagree with and i will try and prove them since the people who actually belive in this stuff have left due to your "friendly" and "welcoming" presence, by the way I was being sarcastic

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

This is all my fault I just want a fun topic  :no:

amusing...you claim to know more about english, my first language and clearly your second...you should pay more attention to understand the meaning of the word and not to quote from a dictionary...if opinion is your favourite word and you dont even understand it, ...

opinion has no basis in fact...it is a personal view...opinions cant be attacked in court...laughable...you clearly no nothing of law either...

so if i came into court and voiced my opinion about 13th century bedpans, and that cannot be argued against even though i know nothing of such things?...opinions can only be taken seriously from people who have the knowledge of that subject...their qualifications, knowledge etc is based in fact and even then nobody would base a judgement on one persons opinion...are you nuts?...opinions are like assholes, everyone has one


its only arrogant if your arguments are baseless...its good to see someone who is coherent and is willing to challenge their mind

I've got to be honest - i've run out of points to make, as you haven't yet challeneged any of the existing ones i'm thinking you can just go back and look at what's already been said rather than having me repeat myself.

Anyway, i grew tired of this, its been a lot of fun, but i've made my position clear, take it or leave it, all the justification needed has already been said.

I aim to gracefully withdraw from the debate

I can't answer your previous questions because really to tell you the truth there is no proof only opinions, but you knew that anyway.? So I might aswell just admit you were right all along? :-\

Sorry for ruining your thread? :(

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

I'll buy the beers and lets all chill  :peace:  :beer:


Don't worry lets focus on alcohol  ;D, even though I dont agree  with you either  ;)

It's Saint Paddies Day tomorrow so we might aswell drink till we drop, they think Oktoberfest is the biggest beer festival, but they're wrong? : ok:

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

 :beer: as good a reason as any to have a few drinks...the parade in Dublin is fantastic, definitely worth going to see it  :beer:

I'm not in Dublin but I'll asume Im there.  :peace:

Happy St. Patricks day everybody (http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/travesmilies/flaggen1/smilie_flagge16.gif)? : ok:

 :smoking: Izzy? :smoking:

Find your birthday and then read about your tree. This is just for fun but somewhat accurate...

1. Dec 23 to Jan 01: Apple Tree
2. Jun 25 to Jul 04: Apple Tree
3. Jan 01 to Jan 11: Fir Tree
4. Jul 05 to Jul 14: Fir Tree
5. Jan 12 to Jan 24: Elm Tree
6. Jul 15 to Jul 25: Elm Tree
7. Jan 25 to Feb 03: Cypress Tree
8. Jul 26 to Aug 04: Cypress Tree
9. Feb 04 to Feb 08: Poplar Tree
10.Aug 05 to Aug 13: Poplar Tree
11.Feb 09 to Feb 18: Cedar Tree
12.Aug 14 to Aug 23: Cedar Tree
13.Feb 19 to Feb 28: Pine Tree
14.Aug 24 to Sep 02: Pine Tree
15.Mar 01 to Mar 10: Weeping Willow Tree
16.Sep 03 to Sep 12: Weeping Willow Tree
17.Mar 11 to Mar 20: Lime Tree
18.Sep 13 to Sep 22: Lime Tree
19.Mar 21 : Oak Tree
20.Sep 23 : Olive Tree
21.Mar 22 to Mar 31: Hazelnut Tree
22.Sep 24 to Oct 03: Hazelnut Tree
23.Apr 01 to Apr 10: Rowan Tree
24.Oct 04 to Oct 13: Rowan Tree
25.Apr 11 to Apr 20: Maple Tree
26.Oct 14 to Oct 23: Maple Tree
27.Apr 21 to Apr 30: Walnut Tree
28.Oct 24 to Nov 11: Walnut Tree
29.May 01 to May 14: Poplar Tree
30.Nov 12 to Nov 21: Chestnut Tree
31.May 15 to May 24: Chestnut Tree
32.Nov 22 to Dec 01: Ash Tree
33.May 25 to Jun 03: Ash Tree
34.Dec 02 to Dec 11: Hornbeam Tree
35.Jun 04 to Jun 13: Hornbeam Tree
36.Dec 12 to Dec 21: Fig Tree
37.Jun 14 to Jun 23: Fig Tree
38.Dec 22: Beech Tree
39.Jun 24: Birch Tree

YOUR TREE (in alphabetical order)

Apple Tree (the Love) - quiet and shy at times, lots of charm, appeal,and attraction, pleasant attitude, flirtatious smile, adventurous,sensitive, loyal in love, wants to love and be loved, faithful and tender partner, very generous, many talents, loves children, needs affectionate partner.

Ash Tree (the Ambition) - extremely attractive, vivacious, impulsive,demanding, does not care for criticism. Ambitious, intelligent, talented,likes to play with fate, can be very egotistic, reliable, restless lover,sometimes money rules over the heart, demands attention, needs love and much emotional support.
Beech Tree (the Creative) - has good taste, concerned about its looks,materialistic, good organization of life and career, economical, goodleader, takes no unnecessary risks, reasonable, splendid lifetime companion, keen on keeping fit (diets, sports, etc.).

Birch Tree (the Inspiration) - vivacious, attractive, elegant,
friendly,unpretentious, modest, does not like anything in excess, abhors the vulgar,loves life in nature and in calm, not very passionate, full of imagination,little ambition, creates a calm and content atmosphere.

Cedar Tree (the Confidence) - of rare strength, knows how to adapt,likes unexpected presents, of good health, not in the least shy, tends to look down on others, self-confident, a great speaker, determined, often impatient, likes to impress others, has many talents, industrious,healthy optimism, waits for the one true love, able to make quick decisions.

Chestnut Tree (the Honesty) - of unusual stature, impressive,
well-developed sense of justice, fun to be around, a planner, born diplomat, can be irritated easily, sensitive of others feelings, hardworker, sometimes acts superior, feels not understood at times, fiercely family oriented, very loyal in love, physically fit.

Cypress Tree (the Faithfulness) - strong, muscular, adaptable, takes what life has to give but doesn't necessarily like it, strives to be content, optimistic, wants to be financially independent, wants love and affection, hates loneliness, passionate lover which cannot be satisfied,faithful, quick-tempered at times, can be unruly and careless, loves to gain knowledge, needs to be needed.

Elm Tree (the Noble-mindedness) - pleasant shape, tasteful clothes,modest demands, tends not to forgive mistakes, cheerful, likes to lead but not to obey, honest and faithful partner, likes making decisions for others, noble-minded, generous, good sense of humor, practical.

Fig Tree (the Sensibility) - very strong minded, a bit self-willed,honest, loyal, independent, hates contradiction or arguments, loves life and friends, enjoys children and animals, a social butterfly, great sense of humor, likes idleness and laziness after long demanding hours at work,
has artistic talent and great intelligence.

Fir Tree (the Mysterious) - extraordinary taste, handles stress poorly,loves anything beautiful, can become depressed at times, stubborn, tends to care for those close to them as well as helping strangers, rather modest,hard worker, talented, unselfish, few sexual relationships, many friends,
doesn't want foes, very reliable.

Hazelnut Tree (the Extraordinary) - charming, sense of humor, very demanding but can also be very understanding, knows how to make a lasting impression, active fighter for social causes and politics, popular, quite moody, sexually oriented, honest, a perfectionist, has a precise sense of judgment and expects complete fairness.

Hornbeam Tree (the Good Taste) - of cool beauty, cares for its looks and condition, good taste, is not egoistic, makes life as comfortable as possible, leads a reasonable and disciplined life, looks for kindness and acknowledgment in an emotional partner, dreams of unusual lovers, is seldom happy with its feelings, mistrusts most people, is never sure of its
decisions, very conscientious.

Lime Tree (the Doubt) - intelligent, hard working, accepts what life dishes out, but not before trying to change bad circumstances into good ones, hates fighting and stress, enjoys getaway vacations, may appear tough, but is actually soft and relenting, always willing to make sacrifices for family and friends, has many talents but not always enough
time to use them, can become a complainer, great leadership qualities, is jealous at times but extremely loyal.

Maple Tree (Independence of Mind) - no ordinary person, full of imagination and originality, shy and reserved, ambitious, proud, self-confident, hungers for new experiences, sometimes nervous, has many complexities, good memory, learns easily, complicated love life, wants to impress.

Oak Tree (the Brave) - robust nature, courageous, strong, unrelenting,independent, sensible, does not like change, keeps its feet on the ground,person of action.

Olive Tree (the Wisdom) - loves sun, warmth and kind feelings,
reasonable, balanced, avoids aggression and violence,tolerant, cheerful,calm, well-developed sense of justice, sensitive, empathetic, free of jealousy, loves to read and the company of sophisticated people.

Pine Tree (the Peacemaker) - loves agreeable company, craves peace and harmony, loves to help others, active imagination, likes to write poetry,not fashion conscious, great compassion, friendly to all, falls strongl in love but will leave if betrayed or lied to, emotionally soft, low self esteem, needs affection and reassurance.

Poplar Tree (the Uncertainty) - looks very decorative, talented, not very self-confident, extremely courageous if necessary, needs goodwill and pleasant surroundings, very choosy, often lonely, great animosity, great artistic nature, good organizer, tends to lean toward philosophy,reliable in any situation, takes partnership seriously.

Rowan Tree (the Sensitivity) - full of charm, cheerful, gifted without egoism, likes to draw attention, loves life, motion, unrest, and even complications, is both dependent and independent, good taste, artistic,passionate, emotional, good company, does not forgive.

Walnut Tree (the Passion) - unrelenting, strange and full of
contrasts,often egotistic, aggressive, noble, broad horizon, unexpected reactions,spontaneous, unlimited ambition, no flexibility, difficult and uncommon partner, not always liked but often admired, ingenious strategist, very jealous and passionate, no compromise.

Weeping Willow (the Melancholy) - likes to be stress free,loves family life, full of hopes and dreams, attractive, very empathetic, loves anything beautiful, musically inclined, loves to travel to exotic places,restless,capricious, honest, can be influenced but is not easy to live with when pressured, sometimes demanding, good intuition, suffers in love until they find that one loyal, steadfast partner; loves to make others laugh.

Damn

Damn

Damn!

I came here to ridicule this superstitious nonsense - but now i don't know what to say as that could almost apply to me.....? :rant:

(except the popular bit of course :D)

And what the hell does sexually orientated mean? :nervous:

of unusual stature - Er, Yeaah  ???

impressive - That's what she said :P

well-developed sense of justice - Yep.  I believe in justice, good old fashioned justice, murders should be killed for instance, eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth, arse for an arse....all that stuff....

fun to be around - Well i like being around me..... :nervous:

a planner - Indeed, If i fail to plan i plan to fail, either way i plan ya see ;)

born diplomat - Don't think so....

can be irritated easily - Yeah, kinda, well some might think it's easily, like i fuckin' hate it when people on this board can't find the search function, or can't find the edit button and they end up replying to their own friggin' posts 2 minutes after posting the first time, cunts!

sensitive of others feelings - Unfortunately yeah, probably why nice is one of the 2 most regularly associated words with me, i'm not telling you the other one :P Remember back in the day in R.E. when we did this empathy test thingy, ya know seeing it from someone elses point of view and all that, well anyway i got the top possible one ;D

hardworker - That one must of been put in by mistake i think, i only work hard if i'm passionate about something which kind of limits me to, writing about wrestling, rolling good joints and working hard at the gym.....

sometimes acts superior - Sometimes i'm right and you're wrong ok? Just accept it, i'm just better sometimes :P

feels not understood at times - I'm too complex for the human brain to comprehend......my Goldfish understands me though ;)

fiercely family oriented - Yep, very.  Love my family, believe in sunday dinners together and all that, brought the family back together this Chrimbo for the first time in years, family is very important, always people you can count on.

very loyal in love - If i love someone i will never cheat on them, i'll be wonderful :yes: if i don't love you though i'll cheat first chance i get :)

physically fit - I may be a pot smoking layabout, but i also go the them gym at least 2wice a week and have a strick routine and am damn fit....

Not bad, fairly accurate i'd say : ok:

it means that you are a very passionate person, i. e. showing or involving very strong feelings of sexual love ;D
I'd say that's good... :P

Pleasant shape.- Im out of shape  :(
Tasteful clothes.- Im ok with that
modest demands.- ok
tends not to forgive mistakes.- mmmmmmm nop
cheerful.- agreed
likes to lead but not obey.- who likes to obey?
honest and faithful partner.- yes
likes making decisiones for others.- nop
noble-minded.- i dont know you tell me
generous.- yes
good sense of humour.- yes
practical.- yes

Thats weird, 2 days ago I was looking who was reading what in the message boar (ok i was bored) and I found a guest looking the zodiac thread, and it came back 2 days later, I mean nobody post since march last year.
Was it you journey?  :nervous:

"Poplar Tree  (the Uncertainty) - looks very decorative, talented, not very self-confident, extremely courageous if necessary, needs goodwill and pleasant surroundings, very choosy, often lonely, great animosity, great artistic nature, good organizer, tends to lean toward philosophy,reliable in any situation, takes partnership seriously."

Hmm, I don?t find myself lonely. But I am very courageous!  ;D

Either that or a ghost ?:nervous:



Strong - Stronger than you ?:P
Muscular - Not very ?:hihi:
Adaptable - Totally
Takes what life has to give but doesn't necessarily like it - True
Strives to be content - Most people do
Optimistic - Nay ?:no:
Wants to be financially independent - True enough
Wants love and affection - True
Hates loneliness - No loneliness is cool
Passionate lover which cannot be satisfied - Okaaaaay ?:confused:
Faithful - Yeah
Quick-tempered at times - Fuck yourself
Can be unruly and careless - I said get to fuck
Loves to gain knowledge - Yeah
Needs to be needed - Bah, I don't need you

No. I only looked in here last night. Maybe it was Izzy. I think he's a closet astrologer.? :hihi:


My tree is kind of negative. I'd like a different tree. haha

Walnut Tree (the Passion) - unrelenting, strange and full of contrasts,often egotistic, aggressive, noble, broad horizon, unexpected reactions,spontaneous, unlimited ambition, no flexibility, difficult and uncommon partner, not always liked but often admired, ingenious strategist, very jealous and passionate, no compromise.


Not always liked? That hurts.? :hihi:


 

I'm seroius dudes, I think we are being spy  :nervous:

We share the same tree Aava, when is your birthday? :D

That applies to me pretty damn accurately, and I often find myself lonely, not always a negative loneliness but painfully persistant when it happens.

Ive been studying all different kinds of fate and fortune reading techniques for months now such as I-Ching, Palmistry which is truly amazing, The Tarot, and most interesting of all to me: astrology/horoscopes. I definately try and read mine everyday. Somedays they're scary how acurate they are, and other days they dont relate to me at all.

As a Taurus I:

"Represent strength; not necessarily of body, for the strength may be of character, or of purpose. Extremely strong-willed, can be led but never driven. The taurus tends to be conservative and opposed to change. He/She is slow to anger but when enranged can become violent and loose all control. Taureans are faithful and generous  friends, but when their self-respect is injured, it can only be regained by an appeal to their better natures. They may provoke trouble solely for the perverse pleasure of "making ammends" ;D

2nd of may, taurus too.

I, am:
A scorpio
And a Walnut tree.
So
If a scorpio eats a Walnut,
What does that make me?




No, seriously?

Now i know who's spying on us, is yahoo slurp spider  :yes:

A vegetarian insect.

Are you a Scorpio or an Eagle?



What/who is that?

Yahoo slurp spider?
Well is search engine in yahoo, if you put your username and the name of the page it appears to see as guest a lot threads try it ;)

I have the same one and I don't take it as being negative.  I take it as a strong person that doesn't take any shit!  ;D

OK - I may not always be liked - especially at work given that I'm a manager, but who cares because I'm an ingenious strategist. ;)

Well since you put it that way, I guess it's not so negative. But I do tend to overreact over a lot of trivial things. One more thing to work on.  :hihi:

As if in a million years we have the same Birthday too! :o


I was born at quarter to 9, how about you? :P

http://www.pixelgirldesign.com/astrology/index.html

This is what mine says about me:

Your most likeable trait: RESPONSIVENESS
People born under this sign are many sided, quick in thought and action, clever with words, skillful at handling others, brimful of new ideas.
Astrologers regard this third sign of the zodiac as the quintessentially human sign, for it seems to sum up qualities that are the distinguishing hallmarks of the human race?intelligence (Gemini is an air sign), adaptability (Gemini is a mutable sign), and communicativeness (Gemini is ruled by Mercury).
Gemini people do not sit back and watch the scenery go by. As a Gemini, you are endlessly curious about everything and must be part of the busy passing scene. If all the world's a stage, Gemini must be the actor on that stage. Unlike Leo, who wants only to be the star, Gemini wants to play all the parts?and be the director, the producer, and the stagehand!
Duality is your most famous trait. You usually want more than one of everything. That includes jobs, hobbies, careers, lovers. Basically your nature is restless, on the go, in quest of new ideas and fresh experiences. As a result, you often leave a trail of unfinished tasks. Your tendency is to fritter away energy on too many projects instead of concentrating your cleverness on one task.
Gemini is the sign of communication?and its natives have an urgent and continual need to communicate. You enjoy writing notes, chatting with strangers, and the telephone is a major means of communication. People should learn not to give you their number if they aren't the kind who like to spend a lot of time on the phone!
Born with the gift of persuasion, you could sell ice in Greenland. Your quick mind can explain any action, defend any position, justify any course. A mental magpie, you pick up information here, gossip there, tidbits everywhere. This makes you an ideal conversationalist, for you know a little about everything. You also are inclined to have firm opinions on everything (subject to revision at a moment's notice).
A Gemini weakness is superficiality. Because you are so quick to grasp an idea or size up a situation, you tend to skim its surface, not bothering to explore it in any depth. The other side of the coin, however, is that with very little preparation you can make a marvelous initial impression.
Your facile gifts of writing, speaking, and self expression make you a success in dealing with the public. You have a quicksilver personality that can adapt to many kinds of people. You are often drawn to the stage and the dramatic arts. Among famous writers and performers born with the Sun in Gemini are Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Dashiell Hammett, Lillian Hellman, Laurence Olivier, Marilyn Monroe, and Judy Garland.
Amusing, versatile and witty, you are a wonderful friend who lifts people out of their doldrums. It's easy to see why you are usually surrounded by friends and admirers because you're such fun to be with. True, you can be impatient with persons who aren't as quick as you are, or who can't keep up with the rapid flow of your thought and speech. However, your natural exuberance sweeps even the most reluctant and surly along with you. In almost any situation you can be as charming as you want to be?with a little extra thrown in.
Life is jest and all things show it; I thought so once and now I know it,
spells out the philosophy of Gemini. You don't waste time plumbing dark emotional depths. There is a brooding side to your Jekyll and Hyde disposition, but you don't let it dominate your lighthearted high spirits. You're too interested in fun and games.
Gemini's have a wide range of contacts and benefit from the advice and help of influential people. You will attract financial luck, but a tendency toward extravagance often more than offsets it. In your ledger, income always adds up to something a little short of outgo.
Routine and monotony are two things you dread and you will go to any lengths to avoid them. Change is your keyword, and what you value most is freedom. It's useless for anyone to try to pin you down. For you, the fun is in traveling, not in arriving at a destination. You love to explore new territory, see the way people live on the other side of the world. Inquisitive and imaginative, you are open to a different way of looking at things. Your trendy, up-to-date lifestyle has you constantly living off the fad of the land.
For the sheer fascination of it, people should have at least one Gemini in their lives (two might be exhausting).

Maple Tree (Independence of Mind) - no ordinary person, full of imagination and originality, shy and reserved, ambitious, proud, self-confident, hungers for new experiences, sometimes nervous, has many complexities, good memory, learns easily, complicated love life, wants to impress.

Fuck. :o
That is quite weird.

Well about acuarians and love compatibilities

His first contact with a woman has to be made through the mind. Before he can become physically stimulated, he must be intellectually stimulated. For Aquarius the meeting of minds always precedes the meeting of bodies. He wants to make love to somebody, not just any body.

Give him half a chance and he'll fall in love. He thinks that that is a natural?and delightful?condition. But falling in love and loving mean two different things to this man, and the latter is likely to bring out his inner conflicts. One reason is that Aquarius tends to repress emotion. He is a cerebral sign, and he's somewhat unnerved and embarrassed by emotion. Also, love represents a demand on him and he has a fierce need for independence. In addition, loving means making room for another person, and in common with the other fixed signs (Taurus, Leo, and Scorpio). Aquarius does not adapt easily to others. Others have to adapt to him.

He is very attractive to women, but he may not linger long in a liaison. To him, love passes like a train in the night and there is always another train coming along the track. Yet Aquarius isn't a Don Juan. He is remarkably true to this women?in his fashion. He doesn't try to keep many women on his string at one time. Rather he believes in consecutive monogamy. Even if he marries, he doesn't consider the bond to be forged in steel. Aquarius men are the most often married in the zodiac.

The Aquarius man does not expect any woman to be easily won. His patience is proverbial and a woman may finally make the proposition herself. Then, surprisingly, she'll discover how intensely and passionately her Aquarius lover has wanted her. When a love affair is underway he makes up for lost time. A woman will find that making love with him is like living in the midst of a carnival?there's always a new and exciting ride.

Aquarius is the sign of truth, and this man doesn't lie or misrepresent himself. This is, of course, a winning quality?though in Aquarius's case it sometimes has unexpected consequences. One young woman I know spotted this quality in her Aquarius lover. She compelled him at various times throughout the day to tell her how he felt about her at that exact moment: "To tell you the truth, right now I'm not as much in love with you as I was this morning."

In a love affair Aquarius is generous and tolerant, the kind who tries never to encroach on your rights or to give orders. A love relationship with him has many of the elements of friendship?intellectual interests, social compatibility. He won't be selfish or domineering either. He may be less than fiery, but he is a surprising, stimulating, broadminded, and inventive lover.

Don't fence him in. Once this man is in love with you he will stay pretty much in his pasture. But he must feel the escape routes are open.
 So I need a libra, gemini or aries, so where are thos ladies?  ;D

Ah this old thread

I thought after the burial i gave to the last lot that tried to tell us the stars and moon's controlled our behaviour that people would think twice before trying again!

April 20th.....Im a Maple tree....keekee... :D