Proof that Slash & Duff lied about signing over the GNR name.

[Boromir]

Read more:

http://mistersaintlaurent.proboards.com/thread/10998/proof-slash-duff-lied-signing

[D-GenerationX]

It was the foolish business decision of all time.  Can't be a day goes by they don't kick themselves.

Also believe "Velvet Revolver" would have been "Guns N Roses" if it legally could have been.  Never believed the "oh, they would never do that" routine.  That's convenient because they always had legal reasons they could not.

[sofine11]

Meh.  Whenever I see evidence from either side, however damning, I can't help but think "What's done is done." Does any of this really matter in 2013/14?

[D-GenerationX]

Meh.  Whenever I see evidence from either side, however damning, I can't help but thing "What's done is done." Does any of this really matter in 2013/14?

No, not even a little bit.

That's why I was sort of disappointed in Axl's chats.  Not that he did them, that part was great.  I'm talking content.  Look how much time was spent rehashing all this old shit about the old band.  So little time spent talking up the current operation.

And the reactions from some of the fans were disheartening too.  Here's a guy that never talks to us directly giving us his time, and all people are focusing on is "getting to the bottom of what happened" back in 1995/96. 

For who?  For what?

[sofine11]

Meh.  Whenever I see evidence from either side, however damning, I can't help but thing "What's done is done." Does any of this really matter in 2013/14?

No, not even a little bit.

That's why I was sort of disappointed in Axl's chats.  Not that he did them, that part was great.  I'm talking content.  Look how much time was spent rehashing all this old shit about the old band.  So little time spent talking up the current operation.

And the reactions from some of the fans were disheartening too.  Here's a guy that never talks to us directly giving us his time, and all people are focusing on is "getting to the bottom of what happened" back in 1995/96. 

For who?  For what?

Exactly.  People are acting like MSL blew the doors open on this, like it affects GNR one iota.  I just want the next album lol...

[jarmo]

That's why I was sort of disappointed in Axl's chats.  Not that he did them, that part was great.  I'm talking content.  Look how much time was spent rehashing all this old shit about the old band.  So little time spent talking up the current operation.

And the reactions from some of the fans were disheartening too.  Here's a guy that never talks to us directly giving us his time, and all people are focusing on is "getting to the bottom of what happened" back in 1995/96. 

For who?  For what?

Hold on. Maybe if you had read and heard all kinds of shit said about you for over a decade, you'd want to tell your fans what's actually true and what's not.
Isn't that exactly why some of these people wrote books? To "set the record straight"?

One minute people complain that there's no word from Axl about anything. Then when he tells us his side about some of the biggest misconceptions about GN'R, it's not good either.... If he hadn't mentioned it, I'm sure some would've said he refused to answer questions about old GN'R because he doesn't wanna talk about it. 

A lose-lose situation.
Nothing is ever good enough. For some people.




/jarmo

[JAEBALL]

three egomaniac rockstars who came from nothing got rich and famous and did lots of drugs and groupies and then  couldnt get along anymore and they broke up.... what a sad story......... ha

its sad and stupid that 20 years later its still going on

and its sad that people take sides like they know anything about it ...... theres what Axl says what Slash/Duff say and the truth is somewhere in the middle... that is the ONLY truth about it

[D-GenerationX]

Hold on. Maybe if you had read and heard all kinds of shit said about you for over a decade, you'd want to tell your fans what's actually true and what's not.
Isn't that exactly why some of these people wrote books? To "set the record straight"?

One minute people complain that there's no word from Axl about anything. Then when he tells us his side about some of the biggest misconceptions about GN'R, it's not good either.... If he hadn't mentioned it, I'm sure some would've said he refused to answer questions about old GN'R because he doesn't wanna talk about it. 

Well, who made that bed?

Axl had over 10 years to tell that story and could not be bothered.  Clearly had time to brood about people "spreading lies", but never moved enough to correct the record.  That's on him, I'm afraid.

But what is the upside or endgame of talking about all that old shit?  And let's not pretend he didn't relish talking about it.  At any point he could have pivoted more to his current band or his current album, no?  Instead, we talk about Slash?  A guy out of the band 12 years by that point?

[jarmo]

I didn't know there's a time frame when you're allowed to talk about things before they "expire"...

It was the first time Axl had participated in anything of the sort where he was talking straight to his fans. Maybe he had an idea what was important t talk about or maybe it was a spur of the moment kinda thing. I don't know.

I don't sit here five years later complaining about it knowing damn well that nothing he might've said would've made everybody happy. 



By the way, now it's been over 17 years since Slash quit. Do you think he's still being asked about GN'R? Wasn't he on Larry King recently talking about that? Why can't he skip talking about GN'R? Isn't it in the past by now? 


/jarmo

[LongGoneDay]

I don't blame Axl for wanting to "set the record straight", but it's not as though he hasn't given his remaining fan base reason to complain.
Fair or not, when he made the decision to continue on as Guns N' Roses w/o Slash, Duff, Izzy etc he set himself up for criticism.
He had to know he was probably going to lose some fans completely, and it may be an uphill battle to keep and obtain others.
Sure there are plenty of fans who will accept and support anything Axl does, and there are those who will continue to buy tickets just to hear him sing the Guns N' Roses songs they love, but it wasn't going to be a free ride. For many, he was going to have to prove his decision to continue on as GN'R w/o vital members was warranted.

Years and years of not releasing new music, of not doing interviews, or explaining why new music isn't being released hasn't helped his cause.
At this point it is what it is. I personally no longer care the reasons why. Regardless of fault, I just know it's unfortunate that a once such incredible singer/songwriter's creative career essentially ended, or took an extended vacation right in his prime. Hindsight is 20/20, but as it stands today, 21 years later, winning the rights to the GN'R name seems a small victory, because he's failed to do much with it, and unlike the alumni, nothing without it.

[kyrie]

I don't get people complaining about the timeframe of this coming out. It's part of the public record, just no one bothered to go looking (or perhaps no one realized it was available) til now. It's still interesting. It backs up Axl's side of the story, after a lot of people simply assumed that what Slash/Duff said was true. It's not a smoking gun, but it go my attention, and it basically makes you wonder about other claims that have been made in the past.

I doubt we'll ever know what really led to the original band breaking up in full because I think those sorts of complications are way too complex, and if you're not living them you just won't get it, but this makes an interesting little footnote in GNR history.

[Rainfox]

What Jarmo said.

That some people chose to release a book and others not to.. shouldn't figure in.

Axl chose to spill some of what went down on a fan messageboard. Others wrote books (and made a dollar). Others also promote themselves via articles and tie ins. And spill what went down (according to them).

Complaining that Axl chose to answer the allegations by his former close bandmates - thrown his way over a 14 year period relentlessly - is something a lot of people have whined and complained about NOT getting... for years and years.

Really now?

[kyrie]

I don't blame Axl for wanting to "set the record straight", but it's not as though he hasn't given his remaining fan base reason to complain.
Fair or not, when he made the decision to continue on as Guns N' Roses w/o Slash, Duff, Izzy etc he set himself up for criticism.
He had to know he was probably going to lose some fans completely, and it may be an uphill battle to keep and obtain others.
Sure there are plenty of fans who will accept and support anything Axl does, and there are those who will continue to buy tickets just to hear him sing the Guns N' Roses songs they love, but it wasn't going to be a free ride. For many, he was going to have to prove his decision to continue on as GN'R w/o vital members was warranted.

Years and years of not releasing new music, of not doing interviews, or explaining why new music isn't being released hasn't helped his cause.
At this point it is what it is. I personally no longer care the reasons why. Regardless of fault, I just know it's unfortunate that a once such incredible singer/songwriter's creative career essentially ended, or took an extended vacation right in his prime. Hindsight is 20/20, but as it stands today, 21 years later, winning the rights to the GN'R name seems a small victory, because he's failed to do much with it, and unlike the alumni, nothing without it.

You seem to be treating this like it's Axl releasing this information. From what I know someone simply made an information request. Criminal court docs can be obtained via the PACER system (or at least that was the case years ago, it has been a while since I've looked into it) and I'm sure there's a civil court equivalent. No doubt someone just finally dug this up, it has nothing to do with Axl, and his online chats were years ago.

[D-GenerationX]

I don't sit here five years later complaining about it knowing damn well that nothing he might've said would've made everybody happy. 

Its not complaining, it was an observation that came up in the flow of conversation.  But I realize you take such things as declarations of war and a general impossibility to please.

But tell me this.  If any time from 1997 onwards, if Axl calls up Rolling Stone and pitches them "Guns N Roses : The Inside Story Of How It All Went To Hell", is he not on the cover?  And in such a piece he can give his spin and refute how people that write books are just liars and he's really the one done wrong. 

Wouldn't that make sense?  You give you side and then move on to your current band and current album?  Why not vent and be done with it?  Then your chat can be more about what you are doing now and how you are excited about it.

[D-GenerationX]

What Jarmo said.

That some people chose to release a book and others not to.. shouldn't figure in.

Axl chose to spill some of what went down on a fan messageboard. Others wrote books (and made a dollar). Others also promote themselves via articles and tie ins. And spill what went down (according to them).

Complaining that Axl chose to answer the allegations by his former close bandmates - thrown his way over a 14 year period relentlessly - is something a lot of people have whined and complained about NOT getting... for years and years.

Really now?

But most of the "get to the bottom of it" crowd also held some pie in the sky belief that the band would get back together. 

I was online that night at MYGNR.  The overwhelming number of people asking those questions has spent 5 years saying Axl was a disgrace that soiled the band's legacy and ruined the band's good name.  Now I'm supposed to believe they were interested in Axl's side?  Yeah, if he was going to say he fucked it all up and begged their forgiveness maybe.

Look how many simple minded idiots put all their eggs in the RNR HOF basket.  That was going to be the miracle Hollywood ending where Axl "did the right thing".  People were pissed when that didn't happen. 

[jarmo]

Wouldn't that make sense?  You give you side and then move on to your current band and current album?  Why not vent and be done with it?  Then your chat can be more about what you are doing now and how you are excited about it.

Well, if he wanted to be on the cover of said magazine... Not everybody wants that. Not everybody wants to be on reality TV
Is that horrible?

He chose a direct line to the fans. The people who are the ones wondering about what really happened. I bet a bunch of magazine readers wouldn't even know who quit GN'R and when...


Anyway, you chose to ignore the fact that former members get asked about GN'R to this day....
Also, the subject isn't about the chats. It's about what we've been told over the years.

Personally I don't believe everything I read... Even if it's in an official biography...


/jarmo

[JAEBALL]

Wouldn't that make sense?  You give you side and then move on to your current band and current album?  Why not vent and be done with it?  Then your chat can be more about what you are doing now and how you are excited about it.

Well, if he wanted to be on the cover of said magazine... Not everybody wants that. Not everybody wants to be on reality TV
Is that horrible?

He chose a direct line to the fans. The people who are the ones wondering about what really happened. I bet a bunch of magazine readers wouldn't even know who quit GN'R and when...


Anyway, you chose to ignore the fact that former members get asked about GN'R to this day....
Also, the subject isn't about the chats. It's about what we've been told over the years.

Personally I don't believe everything I read... Even if it's in an official biography...


/jarmo

I have enjoyed reading ur knocks on Slash's books for the past several years lol...

what a despicable human being he is....

as far as how Axl speaks out...that his prerogative... you can agree with his method or not , if he doesnt want to do Rolling Stone or something like that...thats his choice


but it puzzles me why people cant look at GNR objectively and realize the truth is not on one side or the other  but somewhere in the middle

[Ali]

Hold on. Maybe if you had read and heard all kinds of shit said about you for over a decade, you'd want to tell your fans what's actually true and what's not.
Isn't that exactly why some of these people wrote books? To "set the record straight"?

One minute people complain that there's no word from Axl about anything. Then when he tells us his side about some of the biggest misconceptions about GN'R, it's not good either.... If he hadn't mentioned it, I'm sure some would've said he refused to answer questions about old GN'R because he doesn't wanna talk about it. 

Well, who made that bed?

Axl had over 10 years to tell that story and could not be bothered.  Clearly had time to brood about people "spreading lies", but never moved enough to correct the record.  That's on him, I'm afraid.

But what is the upside or endgame of talking about all that old shit?  And let's not pretend he didn't relish talking about it.  At any point he could have pivoted more to his current band or his current album, no?  Instead, we talk about Slash?  A guy out of the band 12 years by that point?

As other people have said, for whatever reason, he wanted to wait until a particular, perhaps when CD was set to come out, to clear the air and tell his side of the story.

Slash and Duff both told their sides of the story years after it happened, Slash in a 2002 interview and Duff in his 2011 autobiography.

So, really, all of them waited to tell their side of this particular story, and Duff even waited longer than Axl to tell his.

In reality, that question could be asked of all of them, couldn't it?

Ali

[D-GenerationX]

Anyway, you chose to ignore the fact that former members get asked about GN'R to this day....

True, they do.

But do they spend years working on a new album and then say what they'd like to talk about it something Axl Rose said 10 years ago?  I realize this is not a perfect analogy, as it suggests Axl would be doing official promotion.  But you get my point.

I am one of the first ones that tell the reunion zealots to move the hell on already.  Its over and done and not coming back.  The same could be said to Axl.  Tell me about your new band.  Tell me about your new album.  Don't tell me that you or Slash will be in a coffin before you speak again.  Who gives a fuck?  Was there some sort of doubt about how much Axl hates Slash?

Not even getting into the fact that "he's a cancer best removed" and whatnot gets you nothing but grief.  You lectured me earlier about "the Axl Rose asshole myth".  Comments like that?  Not a myth, guy.

[D-GenerationX]

As other people have said, for whatever reason, he wanted to wait until a particular, perhaps when CD was set to come out, to clear the air and tell his side of the story.

A better balance could have been struck between rehashing old shit and talking about the present and future.

People on the street could not name you 5 members of this band, and that's spotting them Axl and Dizzy.  That's a problem.  These guys stuck with him for 10 years, presumably thinking they would get their due when the album came out.  Instead, we talk about Slash.  Its a disservice to the current line-up.