National Debt at Record $9 Trillion

[Chief]

this is painful!!!!

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/071107/national_debt.html?.v=1

[freedom78]

Seems like yesterday that I was thinking "Wow... 5 Trillion.  That's astronomical." 

They sure do grow up fast! 

[SLCPUNK]

What a fucking mess.

[The Dog]

Just wait till the market crashes - its being kept afloat by bullshit smoke and mirror tricks. won't last forever though.  the bubble is going to burst and its going to be painful.

[SLCPUNK]

I was pretty much saying the same thing to the missus after I read this thread. I'm very interested to see what is around the corner. Although, at the same time, I'd rather not look.

[fuckin crazy]

These criminals have accumulated more debt, in our name, than all the other administrations combined.

[polluxlm]

These criminals have accumulated more debt, in our name, than all the other administrations combined.

Not adjusted to inflation...

But of course, it's the debt that causes the inflation...

Cute system.

[rds.06]

Who/Where do they borrow all this money from? Imagine the interest on that baby.

[polluxlm]

Who/Where do they borrow all this money from? Imagine the interest on that baby.

Some from the private sector and foreign countries, but the bulk of it comes from the FED.

[wink]

Who/Where do they borrow all this money from? Imagine the interest on that baby.

Some from the private sector and foreign countries, but the bulk of it comes from the FED.

I thought the US government was just printing more money, wasn't this (printing money) fast tracked through congress?

[freedom78]

Who/Where do they borrow all this money from? Imagine the interest on that baby.

Some from the private sector and foreign countries, but the bulk of it comes from the FED.

I thought the US government was just printing more money, wasn't this (printing money) fast tracked through congress?

We do print money, as the population grows and to replace old money (beat up and/or easier to counterfeit), but printing money leads to currency devaluation and inflation, rather than debt (indirectly, maybe).

[polluxlm]

Who/Where do they borrow all this money from? Imagine the interest on that baby.

Some from the private sector and foreign countries, but the bulk of it comes from the FED.

I thought the US government was just printing more money, wasn't this (printing money) fast tracked through congress?

Then this might come as a surprise to you...

The US government doesn't print money, the federal reserve prints money. In contrast to what most believe the FED is not federal. It is a consortium of privately owned banks who each hold shares according to their holdings. The federal reserve and the government is in what they like to call 'a special relationship' (from the FEDs own website). The only federal connection to the system is that the board of governors (or it might just be the chairman) is appointed by the President. Of course, since the President usually knows little about economics, it is the banking committees of congress and beneficiaries in the presidential campaign who compose lists for him to choose from, alongside probably follows recommendations to the most suitable candidates.

So whenever the government needs money for special programs, to smoothen over irregularities in the tax collections or war, especially war, they go to the FED. The FED then 'buys' securities from the government, injecting fresh capital into the system. Of course, they're not really buying anything since the money is created out of thin air. There are no reserves in the federal reserve system.

The problem is that the government has to pay interest on these loans. Meaning that there are never enough money in circulation to cover the loan, so they have to take up new loans to cover the old ones. Which means printing even more money. That is why the debt keeps growing and growing. Who pays for it? You do, through your federal income tax.

[The Chad Cometh]

Who/Where do they borrow all this money from? Imagine the interest on that baby.

Some from the private sector and foreign countries, but the bulk of it comes from the FED.

I thought the US government was just printing more money, wasn't this (printing money) fast tracked through congress?

What do you think happened to Russia?

We do print money, as the population grows and to replace old money (beat up and/or easier to counterfeit), but printing money leads to currency devaluation and inflation, rather than debt (indirectly, maybe).

[SLCPUNK]

I must wonder if any Bush supporters here, are able to finally admit the failures of this administration and what harm they have done to our economy?

***

Dollar Falls to Record on China's Plans to Diversify Reserves
By Stanley White and Kosuke Goto

Nov. 7 (Bloomberg) -- The dollar slid to record lows against the euro and the Canadian dollar on speculation China's plans to diversify its foreign exchange reserves will involve selling U.S. assets.

The currency slumped after Cheng Siwei, vice chairman of China's National People's Congress, told a conference in Beijing the country should improve the structure of its $1.43 trillion of foreign reserves by favoring stronger currencies. It pared losses after he later added that doesn't mean buying more euros. The dollar also slumped to a 26-year low against the pound and a 23-year low against the Australian dollar.

``Cheng Siwei, a China adviser, apparently said China should diversify into strong currencies,'' said Lee Wai Tuck, a currency strategist at Forecast Singapore Ltd. ``This is one of the comments that triggered the buying of the euro and selling of the dollar.''

The dollar slumped to $1.4666 per euro, the lowest since the 13-nation currency debuted in January 1999, before trading at $1.4615 at 11:31 a.m. in Tokyo from $1.4557 late yesterday. It fell to $1.0975 per Canadian dollar, the lowest since Canada's currency was floated in 1950.

Against the pound, the dollar declined to $2.0947, the lowest since May 1981. The currency slid against the Australian dollar to 93.75 U.S. cents, the lowest since April 1984 from 92.87 U.S. cents. The dollar may fall to $1.4700 per euro today, Lee forecast.

China Investment Corp., which manages the nation's $200 billion sovereign wealth fund, said last month it may get more of the nation's reserves to invest to improve returns.

Fed Rates

The currency also slid against higher-yielding currencies including the Australian dollar and the Norwegian krone as losses from subprime-mortgage defaults added to pressure on the Federal Reserve to lower its target for the overnight lending rate between banks to 4.25 percent next month.

The Reserve Bank of Australia raised its benchmark borrowing cost to 6.75 percent today, while traders added to bets Norway's central bank will increase its 5 percent deposit rate.

``The interest-rate outlook is dragging down the dollar against major currencies such as the euro and the Australian dollar,'' said Seiichiro Muta, director of foreign exchange in Tokyo at UBS AG, the world's second-largest currency trader. ``I cannot see the bottom of the dollar depreciation yet.''

It declined to 5.3403 kroner from 5.3474. It may fall to $1.46 a euro today, Muta said.

Central Banks

Interest-rate futures traded on the Chicago Board of Trade show a 62 percent chance of a quarter-percentage point Fed rate cut on Dec. 11, compared with 6 percent a month ago. Citigroup Inc. may write down an additional $2.7 billion worth of subprime-related assets, CreditSights Inc. said yesterday.

Australian central bank Governor Glenn Stevens, announcing today's quarter-point rate increase, said inflation will exceed his target. Norwegian forward-rate agreements, a kind of interest-rate futures contract, gained yesterday on speculation the central bank will lift borrowing costs at least once more by the end of 2008. The Norges Bank next meets Dec. 12.

New Zealand's dollar rose to 78.35 U.S. cents from 78 U.S. cents on speculation a report tomorrow will show the unemployment rate remained at a record low, boosting the chance of another increase to the country's record 8.25 percent benchmark interest rate.

Subprime Loans

``The dollar is weak against a host of currencies, including the euro, the pound and the Australian dollar,'' said Mitsuru Sahara, senior currency sales manager at Bank of Tokyo- Mitsubishi UFJ Ltd., a unit of Japan's biggest publicly traded lender. ``We can't tell how much money banks will loose on subprime loans. The Fed is likely to cut rates again before the end of the year.''

The U.S. currency may fall to $1.46 against the euro and 114.30 yen today, Sahara said.

Gains in the euro may be limited by speculation European economic growth is peaking out, reducing the need for higher interest rates.

The European Central Bank will keep its key rate at 4 percent tomorrow, according to all 61 economists surveyed by Bloomberg News. Data yesterday showed manufacturing orders in Germany fell more than expected in September.

``There is a European industrial complex which is now suffering from the euro being at such super expensive levels,'' said Peter Pontikis, treasury strategist at Suncorp-Metway Ltd. in Melbourne. ``The data all suggest you'll get a real slowdown. I'd be against the possibility of a rate hike.''

Europe's single currency will trade at $1.43 versus the dollar by year-end, according to the median forecast of 42 analysts and brokerages surveyed by Bloomberg News.

[sandman]

a weak dollar does not equal a weak economy. in fact, a weak dollar is not necessarily a bad thing.

the U.S. economy is healthy.

but not many people understand economics even a little bit, which is why headlines about weak dollar and national debt scare them into believing things that simply are not true.

[polluxlm]

a weak dollar does not equal a weak economy. in fact, a weak dollar is not necessarily a bad thing.

the U.S. economy is healthy.

but not many people understand economics even a little bit, which is why headlines about weak dollar and national debt scare them into believing things that simply are not true.

But you do, right?

The reason so few 'understand' economy is because it's a ridiculous complex system created to hide the fact that we're being cheated out of money. Fraud is what it is. Legal crime.

A nation does not need to pay anyone for printing the money needed in the economy. In fact the US Constitution explicitly state that this is not only unnecessary, but illegal.

Please give me one sound reason why we're paying our private central banks to provide us with liquidity?

[SLCPUNK]

a weak dollar does not equal a weak economy. in fact, a weak dollar is not necessarily a bad thing.

the U.S. economy is healthy.

but not many people understand economics even a little bit, which is why headlines about weak dollar and national debt scare them into believing things that simply are not true.

People like you are why people like Bush are allowed to run this country into the ground.

I'll be a gentleman and let you go first.

Why is a weak dollar not necessarily a bad thing?

Explain how the US economy is healthy ?

Please explain to the meager proletariat, we'd love you to bestow your economic wisdom onto the masses who are only capable of reading headlines from the liberal media.

[SLCPUNK]

Please give me one sound reason why we're paying our private central banks to provide us with liquidity?

For chrissake, you and your fucking crusade, must you hijack every thread in this section with your Zeitgeist drivel?

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

a weak dollar does not equal a weak economy. in fact, a weak dollar is not necessarily a bad thing.

the U.S. economy is healthy.

but not many people understand economics even a little bit, which is why headlines about weak dollar and national debt scare them into believing things that simply are not true.

the ol' "weak currency = strong exportation" ... ?

[polluxlm]

Please give me one sound reason why we're paying our private central banks to provide us with liquidity?

For chrissake, you and your fucking crusade, must you hijack every thread in this section with your Zeitgeist drivel?

I'm sorry, but your lack of self esteem is of little concern to me. Go and bait some republicans again. I'm honestly tired of seeing your pathetic comments on everything that doesn't fit your world view.