Here Today... Gone To Hell!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070920/ap_on_re_us/school_fight

thoughts?

Welll it seems that the "6" acted very american. they should be praised as heroes. Since when america condemns violence? ;)

david bowie donated $10,000 to the Jena 6 cause.

http://www.nme.com/news/david-bowie/31231

My thoughts are......I'm staying far away from this.  Both sides were wrong....the white teens that hung the nooses were idiots and should have been punished in some form.  The black teens went about retribution the wrong way.  I would have equally been pissed and ready to beat some ass if placed in that position, but it comes down to knowing better and being the bigger man.  Sticky situation indeed.

^^ agree more or less 100%

although I would say retaliating in such a manner is NEVER the answer.  I'd be more impressed if nothing violent happened and they were able to organize a protest and get sympathy from other people.  its hard to sympathize with someone after they beat the crap out of a kid, 6 vs. 1 - no matter how much of a scum bag the kid might be.  this isn't the wild wild west, we do have laws in this country.

i do think its beyond ridiculous the noose hangers weren't punished, and severely.

Sometimes you need ordinary people to explain what happened - as I've been trying to read the accurate story on line and am having a hard time

Is this the deal:?

? ? A white guy hung some nooses on a tree where some black guys were sitting - to send a message to them that blacks are not welcome?
The black guys later got him alone in a 6 to 1 situation and beat the crap out of him?? Now the march is because the white guys threw the black guy a beating and were not charged at all?


Thanks for your help!

I've had some trouble finding the "whole" story in the articles I've read as well, but I don't think the 'white guys' threw the 'black guys' a beating at all... The issue is the punishment the black guys will be receiving for the assault (Will they  be punished more severely because they are black?).  At least that's my understanding of it, I may be wrong.

Also, what the fuck kind of parents are raising kids that hang a noose?   :-\

EE thats what i got too.. and is kinda what is being said in the media here..... but to me it comes down to this.... whit guy hate crime... jail.... black guys assult in the 1st degree. Plead it out get min jail time and probation..... this to me would be the most balenced thing that could be done..... but it wont... "A time to kill" ......

That's it, blame everything on the parents. The parents can't control every aspect of the kid's life. If they're fucked up it's not always how they were raised.

Don't worry your pal Rev. Al will straighten it all out for all of us. ?Oh! and The Rev. Jesse Jackson. ?It's a stupid occurance that will be made even worse with the help of the good Reverends mentioned above.

According to this columnist, the kid who got beat up had nothing to with the nooses.

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7170510

Anyone that gang bashes someone is a dog. I see it so offten. I agree the nooses should not have been there but its no excuse to fight 6 on 1. These little cunts are worried they might get punched a few times if they go in 1 on 1.


 :peace:

Au contraire.  I'll bet you my left nut those noose-hangers weren't raised by "Atticus Finch-like" dads and well-educated, tolerant and caring yet firm mothers.  On that note, I'll bet you my right nut those thugs that beat the sh!t out of the white kid came from homes where they were either disciplined with corporal punishment or not disciplined at all. 

I see it time and time again.  My son just started pre-school last week. (yeah, I know, I'm old!)  Anyway, you can just watch the interaction between kids and parents for 15 minutes and peg the kids that will be completely out of control even b-e-f-o-r-e they start school!  Bad parenting creates bad kids which create bad adults/parents and the cycle continues.  :'( 

This thing has been building to a crescendo for a while. This was the third in a series of fights. While I think the charges are excessive, someone had to step in before a kid was killed. Remember this is the Deep South; there are firearms in every household, and everyone knows how to use them. Racism in the South is just under the surface ... by both sides, and it soesn't take much to bring it to the surface.

White kids did nothing illegal , the black kids should be punished according to what they did. I dont see the big deal , ok the white kids hung nooses and antagonized them , it worked says a lot.

^^Yeah, what's wrong with antagonizing minorities with nooses?   :-[

This topic is merely a drop of the Katrina thread, where prejudice ran wild.

Hang a few nooses from your front yard and let us know what happens  :hihi:

I am not condoning the retaliation that ensued, but it was provoked. Not a smart move.

Both sides are wrong, but I can't blame someone for responding to what is, essentially, an implied death threat (the nooses).  Of course, beating up some kid who had nothing to do with it was stupid and wrong.  The black students deserve to be punished, though the "attempted murder" charges they tried to lay on them were ridiculous.  It's a bad situation that was allowed to spiral out of control. 

But in reality, this whole thing could have been solved by tasering every single person involved with this case.  White and black.  The taser is color blind.

Ok it was provoked , therefore they deserve no punishment?! Whats wrong with antagonized minorities with nooses? A lot , whats illegal about it? nothing. Is it right to beat up people too?

as i read more about this story i would say this post is dead on.  the charges against the "6" are way over the top apparently.  the fact that the noose hangers were only suspended is a total joke.  thats a hate crime if you ask me.  so you have charges that aren't enough and charges that are too much.  I still don't think violence is the answer, but the charges do seem excessive.

"dont taser me bro! dont taser me!"

 :hihi: I couldnt resist

How is it a hate crime no one was hurt? It's immoral but not illegal. The charges are over the top i do agree but people are over doing it and making it seem like these kids are innocent.

A hate crime doesn't have to involve someone being physically injured.

Hanging a noose in front of a black person's residence is the exact same thing as spray-painting a swastika on a Jewish person's house.

It's a hate crime.

Welcome to the 21st century ;)

Not exactly, bigotry is an ideal, thought or expression. As revolting as bigots and the hate that they spew are, it is not illegal to express those views ... nor should it be. The two examples given are well known means of intimidation employed in an effort to get a family, or business, to leave the area ... that is criminal.

One plays a dangerous game when trying to define what should, or should not be allowed to be expressed. It is a common tactic of tyrants. There is a reason that those wise men made "freedom of expression" the first amendment to the Constitution 226 years ago.

Kids in New York have been harrassed by police for displaying the Southern Cross on their vehicles, and in Alexandria La., yesterday a teen was arrested for "inciting a riot" for having a "noose" on his truck. It seems like an easy action to endorse, but remember this, Hitler imprisoned teens for listening to "Big Band" music. The parrallels are not that divergent.

So who will take up the cause?  Sean Hannity?  Rudoplh Giuliani?

Neo-Nazi Group Publishes Addresses and Phone Numbers of Jena Six Families



On the heels of Mychal Bell not receiving bail, the story of the Jena 6 continues to roil all sides.


Mychal Bell, the sole defendant who remains behind bars from the group of teens known as the "Jena 6," will not be released Friday, a court decided.


Bell, 17, has been in jail since his arrest more than nine months ago.


It was not immediately clear what happened in court Friday, where Bell's attorneys had planned to push for his release.

In what is not a surprising, but sad development, a white supremacist organization is being monitored by the FBI. William A. White is trying to stir up violence by posting addresses and phone numbers of the Jena 6 family on his web site, proclaiming: "Lynch the Jena 6." He operates out of Roanoke, Virginia:


William A. White also listed some of the defendants' telephone numbers, urging his readers to "Get in touch, and let them know justice is coming."


The review came as protesters gathered Thursday in Jena, the site of racial unrest since last summer. After a black student asked the school for permission to sit under a tree where white students traditionally gathered, three nooses were found hanging from the tree. Months later, the Jena Six were charged with beating a white student.


On his Web site, White complained of "agitators" who were demanding acquittals.


A posting Thursday afternoon that contained contact information for the six youths was headlined: "Addresses of Jena 6 N-----s; In case anyone wants to deliver justice."


In a second item, White was quoted as saying: "If these n------s are released or acquitted, we will find out where they live and make sure that white activists and white citizens in Louisiana know it ... in order to find someone willing to deliver justice."

The Southern Poverty Law Center has details on the other sites and groups fomenting violence in light of the march and search for justice in Jena. Take the bleatings at the neo-Nazi Vanguard News Network:


"I think a group of White men with AK rifles loaded with high capacity magazines should close in on the troop of howler monkeys from all sides and compress them into a tight group, and then White men in the buildings on both sides of the shitskinned hominids shall throw Molotov cocktails from above to cleanse the nigs by fire," wrote "NS Cat" on VNN. Another poster fantasized about a terrorist attack in Jena today: "Wouldn't that be sweet? Gosh darn, wouldn't that be sweet? Good LORD wouldn't THAT be SWeeeeEET? Boom, Boom, no more Coon! Well? A White man can dream can't he?"

As former White House press secretary Tony Snow said on an October 2003 edition of Fox News Sunday


"Here's the unmentionable secret: Racism isn't that big a deal any more. No sensible person supports it. Nobody of importance preaches it. It's rapidly becoming an ugly memory."



If anyone lives in central VA., "speak up" to these fucks.

How do I know?? All I know is when Rev Al is involved things get worse.? I had a run in with the phony back in his medallion wearing days.? Why would Hannity or Giuliani be involved?? What is the "cause"?? I know that Guliani would never recognize Rev. Al as a black community leader and he isn't.? I don't think it's his (Guiliani) place to get involved although he tends to micro manage.? Hannity can maybe cover it? I'm sure he has, being in the media and in 3 mediums print, radio and t.v.? What can he do though?? Harp on it with interviews with Rev. Al?? Let the black community and white community from the town take care of it with the officials local, state and fed.? I believe attempted murder may be too harsh for a beat down but again I don't hold the true bill indictment papers in front of me.
? ? I honestly haven't been following too closely but I would hope a fair ending for all involved will happen.? After reading crazy's post, I hope someone will step up to quell all stupidity and nonsence that serves no purpose.? Rev. Al serves no purpose but to inflame as do these white supremacists and they're probably worse.? Let the feds take them out and a peaceful sit down occur between thoughs involved.? They're all kids so they may need real guidance, not media and hate mongers.

What's your solution?? Because that's all I have.?

Thankfully, Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are doing more than just hoping.  Theyre using their celebrity to attract attention and achieve their goals the best they can.  Im glad to see them temporarily give up their frivolous recent causes for something serious.

Fuckin Crazy, I apologize for the lateness of my reply.

However, I was looking through some of my old law notes today and found a few interesting tidbits I thought I'd share with you.

In a free society like Canada, we are entitled to hold our own beliefs and opinions.

However, if you act prejudicially and treat someone in a discriminatory manner, then your are breaking the law.

Discrimination - Treating a person differently, negatively, or adversely, with no valid reason.

Human rights legislation prohibits discrimination, and helps protect society against it.

The rights of an individual that are considered basic to life in any human society include:

The right to religious freedom
Equality of opportunity

When such rights require protection, intervention by the state is necessary.

Currently there are 4 mechanisms in Canada to protect human rights:

The Canadian Charter of Rights & Freedoms
The Canadian Human Rights Act [1978]
Provincial human rights legislation
Human rights commissions

If the parties cannot solve their differences - a human rights commission then intervenes

If further investigation is needed, the case will then be referred by a human rights commission to a human rights tribunal for a formal hearing.

The tribunal allows witnesses and parties to plead their case without having to follow the normal rules of evidence.

If the tribunal believes discrimination has occurred, then the respondent must prove that there was a bonafide reason for the discrimination, and to act otherwise would bring undue hardship

Judgments may be appealed, sometimes all the way to the Supreme Court of Canada

Penalties provide for civil remedies, not criminal.

That is one of the primary differences between our two countries. Canada does not have freedom of the press or speech.

Go to your local bookstore and try to pick up a copy of "The Anarchist Cookbook", or see if you can get a permit to have a Klan march.

Read it again:

In a free society like Canada, we are entitled to hold our own beliefs and opinions.

HOWEVER, if you act prejudicially and treat someone in a discriminatory manner, then your are breaking the law.


 ???

I'm sure that book can be found rather easily.

Even if I have to order it, who cares?


We have the right to peaceful assembly.

I doubt a Klan march would qualify.

Are you really going to lose sleep at night if you aren't able to hold a Klan meeting? ???

With rationalizations like yours, perhaps this is why racism is far more prevalent in the US than it is Canada.

You would be breaking the law if you did.


You just made my point.



That is a strawman argument.

Not that I'm aware of.

Care to elaborate?

Why do you need a copy of The Anarchist Cookbook?

Why would I need a copy of The Anarchist Cookbook?


You had a point? ???

It seems as if you think you should be able to say whatever you want to say, just as you no doubt think you should also be able to carry around a gun everywhere with you.

I'm sorry, but Canadians just aren't like that.

Perhaps these are contributing factors as to why Canada isn't currently despised by nearly as many countries as the US.

Or why Canada hasn't experienced it's own 9/11.

No it's not.

Go watch Fahrenheit 9/11.

Michael interviews American citizens who are black, asian, etc who come from Detroit up to Windsor to enjoy the bars.

What do they say?

"Racism is far more severe and prevalent back home in the US. Here in Canada everyone is treated with respect no matter what their skin color or ethnicity."

Why not? Maybe for knowledge. It is really none of anyone's business why I would want to read any book, as long as I don't have an ulterior motive.
You are making some of the same arguments Herr Bush made in defense of the "Patriot Act".


No, not everwhere.


Dude, lay off the strawman shit.

Sure it is ...


Your are calling me a racist.

If that book your reading poses a threat my family or to society, then it absolutely is my business what you read.


Canada has it's own version of the Patriot Act, enacted by the former Liberal government, not the current government.


Your right.

Perhaps the merits of what I stated shouldn't be discussed because to you they are those of a "strawman argument," yet you still haven't explained how anything I've stated can honestly be construed as such.

Have you actually been to Canada?

Do you know this for certain?


No I'm not.

Don't get so defensive, this is only the internets afterall.

I'm saying that based on the tired and clich?d rationalizations that you opted for as to why people should be able to say whatever they please, it really doesn't surprise me that racism is more prevalent in the US than here in Canada.

The "sure it is" was addressing your denial "no it's not", not something to do with Canada. Your implication was clear regarding racism and me. Then, you accuse me of using clich?s. Damn dude, that is the primary component of your responses. Then, in the last part of your argument, as if to confirm what I just wrote, you resort to the same old bullshit that you accuse me of doing.

Regarding "don't get so defensive", I'm not; You are the one that came back with the strawman shit when I just noted that Canada doesn't have freedom of the press of expression. If you have a problem with that, take it up with your government.

And NO, it is none of your fucking business what I read.

I don't want to pick a fight with you. "Don't get so defensive",  : ok:



Anyway, I'm through with this; since it seems to be going in circles. Have a good day :smoking:

I have no idea what you're saying here.


If you fancy seeing implications where there are none, go right ahead.


Canada does have freedom of press : ok:

Is it allowed to publish falsehoods or spread hate?

No it's not.


You too Sir :beer:

At my old apartments, we had a black caretaker. A buddy o' mine hung a noose in the tree. He let it sit there and as far as i know it's still there.

nice friends you got there  ::)

A series of tubes.......

Your all anti strawmantics.?