Here Today... Gone To Hell!

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-et-12-20-axl-rose-interview-20111221,0,201100.story?track=rss

Good article, I'm glad Axl is starting to talk more.

I hope this group sticks together. I've seen the original group, less Steven and I had more fun watching this group on this tour.

Anybody can be a friend in good times, but some of these guys like Tommy were there when it was bad apparently, as in Tommy's interview about CD. I hope that is not forgotten. This group deserves a lot of recognition too.


Merry Christmas to all!


By Randall Roberts, Los Angeles Times Pop Music Critic
 
December 21, 2011
Reporting from Seattle ?? Axl Rose is wearing a white cotton bathrobe and white tube socks, relaxing on a couch backstage Friday night after a three-hour concert at Seattle's Key Arena, where he'd snaked his way through 34 songs with a version of the band he co-founded a quarter-century ago, Guns N' Roses. It's 3 a.m., and the singer, the sole remaining original member, has shed the bad-ass sunglasses and flat-brimmed Stetson-style hat he wore onstage, pulled off the snakeskin boots and changed out of his faded bell bottoms.

It's been a whirlwind year for the notoriously unpredictable and polarizing Rose. The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame recently announced Guns N' Roses' induction, 25 years after he and former core members Slash, Izzy Stradlin, Duff McKagan and Steven Adler set the Sunset Strip, and then the world, on fire. The announcement prompted speculation that at the April 14 rock hall ceremony in Cleveland, the original "Appetite for Destruction" lineup ? a historically acrimonious lot with the opinionated Rose at the center ? might perform together for the first time in two decades.

But this positive ray comes amid a stormy 2011 that has seen Rose, 49, fire two managers in the last year, the most recent of which, Peter Katsis, was let go in early December. Since the dissolution of that first lineup, the iconic singer has released just one album, "Chinese Democracy," which he spent 13 years and millions of dollars making. And his current tour is part of a settlement agreement with former GNR manager (and Live Nation Entertainment executive chairman) Irving Azoff that dictated the band do a number of performances with Live Nation as the promoter, and Rose is worried that it's not being properly marketed. He and Guns N' Roses bring this tour to the Forum on Wednesday night.

It's the kind of negative energy that can sap a person's creativity, says Rose, sipping on a beer, his auburn hair hanging over his shoulders pretty much the same way it did in the old days, a horseshoe-shaped red mustache complementing it. "Once I get the next things sorted out with the label, then I feel I can get to that creative place that I've been fighting to get to, and to use Guns N' Roses to do so," he says.

The problem is that while he believes that he and his GNR ? some of whom, like bassist Tommy Stinson and guitarist Richard Fortus, have been with him for more than a decade ? is hitting on all cylinders now, potential business partners are looking at other factors. "Every manager comes in and wants me to make things smaller," says Rose. Guns N' Roses, for example, requires twice as many tour trucks as the budget calls for, he says. Why no one else can understand the band's needs is an obvious frustration for Rose.

More important, he adds, most managers want the same thing that nearly every rock 'n' roll fan of the past quarter-century wants, and the one thing he stubbornly refuses to do: reunite with Slash, Izzy, Duff and the rest of the classic GNR group for a tour. The constant question is an albatross and leaves Rose not only tired but wary of anyone in the business looking to work with him. "All these managers, they all believe in one thing: sell a reunion tour and get their commission. It's just a phone call. It's a half a day's ? work, or however long they want to keep the bidding war going. They get their commission and they don't care if it falls on its face."

This mistrust is partially the reason why Rose's current management team is more family than business partner. It's headed by Beta Lebeis, a Brazilian woman Rose met when she was his ex-girlfriend Stephanie Seymour's assistant; she began working for him after his tempestuous relationship with Seymour ended in 1993. Lebeis' two adult children, Fernando and Vanessa, round out the management group. Lebeis says that this arrangement is the result of an ultimatum she gave Rose after Guns N' Roses' most recent manager, Katsis, left the fold after less than a month on the job.

"We decided, 'No more managers,'" said Lebeis a few days after the Seattle concert. "Between me and Fernando and my daughter, we're dealing with the management." Lebeis added that she characterizes Rose as "more than a son to me," and that after Katsis' departure, "I told [Rose] if he hires another manager, I quit." One of the Lebeis three is almost always at Rose's side, be it in paparazzi photos or side stage during concerts, near the little makeshift dressing room that Rose frequently races into during guitar solos, or on that rare occasion when he actually sits down with a journalist.

As the clock pushes toward 4 a.m., Rose's tone has shifted. He still has to do his regular hour-long vocal exercises before retiring for the night, and the venom of earlier in the evening he'd directed against various players in the music industry seems to have left his system.

Asked if music was still the driving factor in his life that it once was, Rose pauses. "Well, it wasn't for a long time. It was hard to make myself want to do the old songs again. It was like, I wasn't going around my house dancing to 'Jungle.' To even figure out how to even make myself move to those songs ? and how I was going to move to them ? that was a big thing to figure out in '06."

Based on the show earlier in the night, he's figured it out. Rose is proud of the big rock concert he and his band have created. Over the three hours, Rose (though a few pounds heavier than the lithe young rock star of "Appetite" days), moved quickly and deftly, sprinting from stage left to stage right, yowling with delight during "Shackler's Revenge" and "Sweet Child O' Mine," sitting at the piano for "November Rain." He offered classic cover versions of songs by AC/DC, Paul McCartney and Bob Dylan, and a solo piano rendition of "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road." And at points, he turned the stage over to his band members for solos and extended riffs. If his voice carried less grace and more heft at 49 than when he was gliding through the intro to "Civil War" two decades ago, he made up for it with sheer determination.

The enthusiasm he feels for this band is evident on his face, which lights up when talking about working with former Replacements bassist Stinson, guitarists Fortus, DJ Ashba, and Ron "Bumblefoot" Thal and the rest of the '11 Roses.

It's a far contrast to his demeanor when Slash's name comes up. Despite requests from Rose's publicist that he not be asked questions about the former GNR guitarist, Rose himself mentions his ex-bandmate's name minutes into the conversation and locks onto the subject.

Slash was a late arrival into the Guns N' Roses fold, Rose loves reminding people, and apart from a few key riffs, says Rose, the guitarist was much less involved in the songs than Rose and Stradlin.

"It was really a fight with me and Slash," says Rose of the forces that took down the band. "Izzy was doing the same thing, but the fight with me and Slash started the day I met him. He came in, popped my tape out and put his in and wanted me in his band. And I didn't want to join his band. We've had that war since Day 1."

When he's asked the inevitable question ? who will perform onstage as Guns N' Roses at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction ceremony? ? Rose is circumspect. These kinds of honors, while special to him, are also complicated. "I've got mixed emotions about what the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame actually really is, but at the same time, there's a lot of people ? the fans ? that it just means something to them, and they're happy. It's like you won the Heisman or something."

The last thing Rose wants to do, he stresses, is ruin it for others. He refers to Marlon Brando sending an American Indian activist to accept his Oscar and give a protest speech "and everybody getting ? off, or when Michael Moore got up at the Academy Awards and said whatever about George Bush. People don't want that associated with their awards shows, even if you have a big audience. In one way it might be right, but it usually backfires on whoever does it. So I really don't want to spoil it for everybody else ? or take the beating."

Then he said curtly of the induction performance: "There is no plan yet. There really is no plan. We're still busy with this lineup. We're gonna be busy ? we're gonna be busy all next year. We'll be putting out new stuff as soon as we can figure out what our deal is with labels, blah blah blah."

As to whether he feels that he bears any responsibility for the state of limbo he's in, Rose says: "You can say it's my fault, but to me it's like if you're on a plane and somebody trips you and the air marshal arrests you for falling ? like it's my fault for allowing somebody to trip me?"

randall.roberts@latimes.com

jajAJjajAJ

Axl On Fire !@

 :beer:

Beta's the head of the management team?  Finally!!!!!!!!!!   :beer:

All I can say is that if she can find a way to get new GNR music out, she'll meet my expectations.  : ok:

I am so happy he is being more candid.I for one support Axl, And GNR today and to the future! Always have , Always will!

It's good that Axl is contemplating the Hall of Fame.  I think he's right to be cautious about what the Hall of Fame is, its motives, etc, but it's good that he gives it credence based on the fans' desire to see GNR inducted.


It's obvious that the subject of Slash is much more deeply personal to Axl than he'd like us to believe, otherwise he wouldn't have had anything to say about him at all -- especially when nobody else brought Slash up.


All I can say to that is  ::)


I think it's sad that Axl looks at it that way -- that Slash's enthusiasm was an instigation of war.   Some of the greatest rock n roll music of all time was created from whatever "war" between Slash and Axl, so I thank them both for waging it.

Release it on Black Frog/Done To Death Records. :)

THE BOSS & TEAM
MANAGEMENT

(http://i41.tinypic.com/2pt1ftu.jpg)

 :beer:

I hope he does it.

Axl has built a lot of momentum and is doing awesome things right now with this lineup which i love.

If he no shows the HOF, He is gonna get absolutely destroyed in the press and will come off looking absolutely terrible.

Celebrate the past, close the chapter once and for all and then Move on with whats going on now.

Perfect plan to satisfy all.

Guns N' Roses Continue..

Whit HOF or Without HOF

 :smoking:

My 2 cents - Axl should be there at the R&R HOF but he is not obligated to perform with the AFD lineup.

Well said  :beer:

Nice article. Thanks for posting Barney Fife!

"The enthusiasm he feels for this band is evident on his face, which lights up when talking about working with former Replacements bassist Stinson, guitarists Fortus, DJ Ashba, and Ron "Bumblefoot" Thal and the rest of the '11 Roses" - Says a whole lot  :yes:

suprised about the management thing the tour has certainly run smoothly with Peter and we got the vh1 interview aswell i think he did a good job : ok:

Yeah  I am very glad too hear that too! Way too go Beta!
Nice acticle over all. It's really nice too see some positive stuff finally coming out.

Wow, I was stunned by the fact that Katsis is out already, but thrilled about this new development!

Since 2009 I already had the feeling that GN'R finally had come full circle, somehow I was wrong...
Beta, Fernando & Vanessa head of the team, now GN'R has come full circle & that is great news!

Congratulations, my support unconditionally! Oh & Happy Holidays Gunners :peace:

fabulous article  :beer:


great line to those who overestimate Slash's input in GN'R stuff, and to those who calls him ''original''. And also to those who like to underestimate Izzy.

that line that used the words ''avoided'' and ''removed'' comes to my head right now
http://www.spinner.ca/2009/02/27/axl-rose-insists-original-guns-n-roses-lineup-is-dead-and-burie/

i'm happy Axl didn't really rule out a reunion performance at the Hall of Fame. Fingers crossed  :peace:

"A few key riffs", eh? Eh, what does it matter to a rock n' roll band, right?  :nervous:

Couldn't help but notice that the line about the riffs was not quoted.

Have a hard time believing that Axl minimizes Slash's contribution down to just a few key riffs.

Killer solos? Big part of the Gn'r sound and legacy as well

No ,He only fired four menagers when they said word "reunion"...

Awesome interview

Different timezones  :hihi:

I really don't find much positive about this interview, but oh well-the management situation is bizarre

Agree on the management situation!

Perfect !@

 : ok:
Why

???


Not !@

 8)

It's bizzare because now he thinks the tour is not marketed properly? I've seen it advertised on VH1 more than any other band currently touring, I've seen it in print, what I have seen is the lead singer give only his second interview in the last I don't know how many years. I like Axl, but everything is everyone else's fault-Slash, the label, managers, ect.

If Axl truly believes that, I don't think he's fooling anyone. Well, maybe Estebanf (just kidding, pal)
Izzy's enormous influence has always been very apparent to me. I'm not sure there is a point in ranking the importance of any one individual, but the proof is in the pudding as far as GN'R's popularity with, and without Slash.

Whether any of them want to admit it or not, they all complemented each other's talents perfectly.

Yeah I saw a commercial for the tour on TV last night. Pretty well done, too.
It's certainly no secret that they are touring. Seems like it's been a popular misconception all these years about Axl that he doesn't care what people think, and does whatever he pleases. Maybe he cares too much.

I know people don't want to hear this, but the late start times through the years has slowly eroded attendance at GNR concerts-I have been to 7 GNR concerts, and it does not bother me (I take the next day off), but a casual fan will not do this-the few keys riifs line is just silly on his part.

I kinda have to agree that Axl reducing Slash's contributions to GnR to a few key riffs is just silly.  Axl and Slash just remind me of that move Grumpy Old Men  :hihi: These guys are still going to be fighting in their 70's. 

I think every Guitar part that Slash wrote to every GnR song he ever recorded is pretty damn key in my humble opinion just as every vocal line Axl has ever recorded under the GnR banner is. I dont swing on Slash's nuts and I dont swing on Axl's either. It sucks that two people that were in a my favorite band in the world cant stand each other and they take shots at what each other did is pretty stupid.

Slash took cheap shots at Axl for years and Axl just sat back and took it and Slash spewed so much negative shit that I started to resent him, but I never take what those guys did together away. Regardless, those two on the same stage playing music was legendary and worthy of a first ballot in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and that they will have to live with that for the rest of their lives.  I'm not saying reunion and I could care less if they perform together at the induction ceremony.

Just lock the two of them in a room for a few days and walk the fuck away.  and stop taking cheap shots at each other in the press!!!! FUCK!!!!!!!

And why would Beta give Axl an ultimatum? I love my wife, but if she was doing something I didnt like or agree with, I wouldnt give her an ultimatum that if she kept doing what I didnt like I would divorce her..short of her  getting gang banged by the offensive line of the New York Giants   :hihi:

Maybe her and her kids are perfect for the job, I just dont understand her saying " If you hire someone else, I quit!"  She knows how Axl feels about her and her kids and she knows Axl would never do anything to hurt her or make her quit.. Sounds to me like she played the trump card to get the job.

@LunsJail

Newsflash for you:  before Axl became the lead in the biggest band in the world and voted into the RnR HOF, he used to stock shelves at a local grocery store in a small town in Indiana.

Peoples professions change and/or evolve over their lifetime. Go figure.


How do you know that all the 'momentum' going on isn't Beta's doing?  (I don't know that it is just as you don't know that it isn't.)

One thing that is without doubt is Beta's love, loyalty, hard work and dedication to Axl and everything GNR!!!

CONGRATULATIONS BETA!!!  WELL DESERVED!!!   :beer:

It sounds like the tour is losing money, and there are still label problems-I'm not sure where the momentum is.

No where does it say the tour is losing money. It said management wanted to make things SMALLER, so I'm guessing they could make MORE money.

If you fire a manager during a tour, make a statement about management wanting to scale back things, and complain about a tour not marketed properly, chances are they are losing money, or maybe at best breaking even.

U2's production costs for that massive stadium tour had to be huge, but they are bringing in a boat load of money-I'm sure management didn't come to Bono and ask to scale things down so they could make more money.

Yeah, it's obvious the tour isn't making money. You can't put on a show of this scale and play to 7-8k people 3 or 4 nights a week and turn a profit. And if someone wants to argue with me on that then go ahead and waste your breath. You won't change my mind.

That being said, the shows themselves seem to be going well.
My quote on momentum meant that now there doesn't appear to be any. No management, bad relationship with the record label, Axl unhappy with the way the tour was marketed. Also, there's a fine line between being loyal and being an enabler.

This is an 8 member band, along with 3 managers, according to Beta, whom I guess are all on salary- it sounds like the photographer is also traveling with them-the late shows I would imagine are costing a lot more than what a normal show would cost-the show that I went to in Detroit ended at 2 a.m.-I would imagine billing for employees (not sure how it works with arena workers), on overtime, is billed back to the band-not to mention extra hours paid to the road crew taking down the stage until 4, 5 a.m., maybe-and sometimes having to set up on a back to back night in time for soundcheck the next day-these guys are not working for free

I'm happy for Beta as well.  There is no way Axl would have put her in that position if she wasn't qualified, knew the business, etc.  She has been by his side - literally - for what, 15 years?  Plus, at least he knows that she won't push him to do things for her own selfish gain. 
Looking at what we know about Hollywood, that business, etc., that is priceless to many artists.  The list is endless of artists who get forced into stuff so that others can profit, making them glorified whores...

My fear is that she won't push him to do anything. And people on here will spend most of 2012 bitching about how there's no news, no signs of a new album, etc.

It's actually great to see someone who don't only worry about money and profit. Not used to that in In-Corporated States of America?  :hihi:

Guns getting some well deserved reputation with this tour, that's worth more than money. Hell, maybe it's even an long-term investment!

Glad to hear that Axl doesn't plan to blow off the HOF.

I just hope Beta has what it takes to make things work.  Axl seems like he's in a good place creatively with the current lineup and it would be real shame fuck things up now.  I think it would make some sense to do things a little smaller the next tour.  With consideration for the costs with late fees and modest attendance, it makes sense to scale back, and build this thing up again.  They should start there own label and just use one off the majors for distribution.

Exactly, and a bitter, insecure one at that.  If Axl were secure in his current lineup and the current state of GNR, why the need to even mention Slash at all?  Especially when you've told others not to ask about him?



Yeah, the problem is, she's been involved so personally with him for so long, she may be afraid to say "no" to Axl (as so many people have who've worked for him).  Then again, she may be the one person who Axl tolerates saying "no" to him, so it's a crapshoot.

I really hope/believe, that a new album could be released very fast with Beta as manager.

If Axl wasn't worried about turning a profit (nothing wrong with that), he would not be going through managers every 6 months, or complaining about marketing of CD, tour. Trent Reznor once put an album up online for free

haha, i really enjoy posts like this one. love to see frustrated fans being even more frustrated. you guys fall with the same stone over and over again... when are you going to understand that Axl has dignicy and integrity as a person and as an artist?

That L.A. Times article was one of the most positive and NEEDED articles of the last years.

Axl telling the whole fucking world he's focused in Guns N' Roses (and not in some bullshit tied to the past award who will be on newspapers for... 2 weeks? and that will be all), that the band is being managed by people he love from his own intimate circle, and telling the damn fucking truth about Slash (most overestimated musician EVER in rock history) and Izzy (probably a top 3 in the most underrated musicians ever) is ALL POSSITIVE to me.

That L.A. Times article made me wanna  :beer:  I can already smell a new album in the air. Fuck Adler, Sorum and Slash. Nobody need them.

When did I ever question Axl's dignity or integrity as an artist? I merely mentioned that the management situation seemed kind of fucked up. Some of you act like any non-glowing, non-super positive observation is some kind of affront to the Lord and savior himself.

Beta's job as babysitter was over 20 years ago.  Her job for the last 20+ years has been right here with GNR, right next to the manager.  And at times when there was no manager, it was Beta.  "Proper management" got us no where for a long time and it was all fucked up when we got there.  (Although Merck was a lot of fun.)  Beta is the right person for the job.

Think about this though. In the past 7 or so years he's worked with Goldstein, Merck, Azoff, Doc Mcghee, and this Peter Katsis. Why would Axl keep hiring these industry guys if he thought the right person for the job was working for him all along? And now she has threatened to quit if there is another manager (an idle threat I would assume).

Yeah, I dont get it. I'm not saying Beta is going to be horrible, Why has she not been the manager all along? Why all of a sudden now did she pull the trump card and say either I'm the manager or I quit? How in the hell is Axl ok with that kind of an ultimatum?  As a manager in my day to day life.. If an employee comes to me with an ultimatum of any kind with the words following " Or I quit" I can tell you right now that  employee is gone. I dont care what the ultimatum is. 

That said, I dont know if Beta is going to be good or bad as the verdict is still obviously out on that one. Let's see how things look this time next year.  I hope things go great as this tour has just been amazing.

this is axl's band and his vision is and apparently always was the driving force behind it

if he believes the lebeis family can get things done then that works for me

no matter what happens at least he's got plans for 2012


you can't blame him for wanting 'beta' management... screw those other sleazeballs

I don't understand how these managers keep screwing themselves out of jobs.  My first meeting with Axl would be to ask him what his non-negotiables are.

If things were this easy, why wasn't Beta managing the band years ago?

Bingo-is Axl interviewing these managers, telling them what he wants?

I don?t have an excitement to work with people that joined in the "Illusion" time. There?s behind the scenes that was really, really difficult there with different ones. So it?s not really even a full reunion. And these guys have been here a long time, whether the public knows it or not because we haven?t done the media like that. Tommy?s been on 14 years, Richard?s going on 11. That?s as long as Duff was in the band. Chris has been in going on 11, Dizzy?s on since "Illusion," Frank?s going on six, and so?s Bumble. These guys have been here. And DJ?s going on three.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_blog/2011/12/axl-rose-talks-playing-los-angeles-rock-hall-reunion.html

God bless W. Axl fuckin' Rose.

Its fantastic to know Axl thinks exactly the same than me and the real GNR fans that dont suffer amnesia.

I think, Axl did the right thing! He is seeing the band as a real band, and don't care about the past.

Well, It appears that he's gone through literally everyone else and still has yet to choose Beta to be his manager. She gave him an " Either me or I quit" ultimatum to get the position.  So, its not like he has been at her ankles begging for the Lebeis Family to be his management. And I would guess that there is a reason for that.

Throughout that entire interview I never read anything  about him supporting the new management. I really hope things workout, but being backed up against the wall and being forced into doing something that you may not want to do for the sake of keeping the ones you love close to you only sets up resentment. Axl has said on more than one occasion that he views them as his family and Beta as his mother, so why in the hell would she say something like " Or I Quit". Quit what? Being his Assistant? His friend? His mother? Cleaning his house? Washing his clothes? What does " Or I Quit" even mean... I dont get it

I understand wanting to distance himself from people in the "Illusion" era, but before he slams them, he should realize the biggest news coming from this tour might be the song Estranged, from the guy who helped out with a few riffs back then.

Exactly. And I believe that's the real reason Azoff came into the fold. Interscope wasn't releasing CD without a big retailer exclusive and the personal assistant wasn't negotiating that shit.

you have to be fucking kidding me  :rofl:

Estranged is a song written 100% by Axl Rose. It's his baby. First grade fact, not a newsflash at all... in fact, it even exist in full form without guitar solos and it's still a masterpiece.

Sorry, but Slash, the guy that did ''come on come in'', ''spectacle'', and butchered November Rain with a couple of rappers dont have what it takes to create a gem of the dimension of Estranged.

I think you are judging Beta withouth even knowing her as a profesional, or even worse, as a person.
Just give them a chance and then see if it was a good or bad choice, for god's sake

It would help your case if it were a fact that Axl wrote 100% as you say, but unfortunately that's more revisionist history.

Someone's drunk on kool-aid.
Estranged is an epic song, and most would agree that Slash's solos have just as much to do with it as Axl's lyrics, melodies.
Axl himself agreed back before he started rewriting history. He thanked Slash in the liner notes for his contributions.

Not sure what Axl means here:

"Because, really, you can get guys from the "Illusion" thing, but the only thing that would make it would be Duff and Slash, really. It?s nothing against Izzy and it?s nothing against Steven, or anything like that. Steven may want it, but these guys I?m working with right now, they work really hard and it?s hard work. I?ve toured with the other guys and I?ve also seen what they?ve done since, and I just know the difficulties."

Is he saying that it's unrealistic to expect Steve and Izzy to do the hard work required if they're going to do a full-blown reunion tour?

thats the way I interpreted it.  Izzy is known as being unreliable, and we all know Steven's issues.  

plus that Slash/Duff have been the longest old Guns with a 3-man-partnership back then. plus...the media would consider it only some form of a re-union if those 2 jump in, media could live without Izzy and Steven.

"I don?t have an excitement to work with people that joined in the "Illusion" time."   <--- whats up there? Matt and Dizzy joined there, huh??

I believe he is referring to Gilby and Matt.

Yeah, this was an interesting statement. He explained why a reunion won't happen in more detailed terms rather than the "one of us will be dead" crap. Basically he doubts Izzy and Steven could pull it off and he wouldn't be all that interested in a Gilby/Matt version.

Yeah, I'm not sure what he meant by that either.  Does that mean he's open to possibly touring with Slash & Duff, along with members of the current lineup?  Obviously he's not interested in touring with Matt & Gilby, and doesn't believe Izzy & Steven would be able to handle the pressures of a full blown tour.  But the comment about Slash & Duff is interesting.

I don't think he's saying he's interested in touring with Slash and Duff. Those 2 and the current lineup wouldn't really be a reunion. And if that's the case, what's the point?

It sounds like he's talking about touring

i don't know axl or beta, but it seems unlikely that he would tolerate a forceful takeover  from anyone

i sensed humor in the ultimatum story... surely she means well and isn't power tripping

It'd be close enough for most people.  Most of your average rock fans equate Axl + Slash = Guns N' Roses.  Duff being in the mix too would only make it that much sweeter.  The highly successful Illusion tour showed that most people feel that way since Izzy & Steven weren't in the mix, and very few seemed to mind.   But my guess is that Axl was just thinking out loud about what members would be necessary for a hypothetical reunion tour.

yeah, i think "Bodhi" and "LunsJail" nailed it:

it wouldnt be a AFD full re-union tour because he
- doesnt think Izzy and Adler would have the full energy for doing it (remember Izzy said that he needed 2 (4?) weeks for recovering from the 2006 european tour - a tour he partly filled in for a couple of songs only! and everyone knows about Adler's issues)
- Matt and Gilby arent AFD members - and he doesnt have much interest in doing a UYI-line up tour

I think the 'Axl+Slash = GNR' mentality was what Axl was railing against when he made the 'just a few riffs' comment.  That may have been going overboard on his part, but let's face it, it wasn't exactly Jagger/Richards either.  

Right, and all you have to do is look on the Illusion sleeve to see that Izzy was much more of a writing partner to Axl than Slash.  Unfortunately, mass public perception begs to differ.  The fact that Slash was by all means the lead guitar, and that Izzy was much less of a dynamic figure live and was missing missing for the majority of the Illusion tour when GNR was the biggest band in the world, didn't exactly help.

So while Axl may view Slash's input to be minimal, only complimenting his and Izzy's work, the whole world remembers that badass dude with the top hat standing on top of the piano in November Rain or plugging into the Marshall amp and riffing at the beginning of SCOM.  Hard images to shake, just because of a personal fallout.

i wonder why for fucks sake some of you are so worried about what media thinks, what media ''would consider'' or not.

We should not care if media dont estimate enough the job and hard work (axl's words) of the current members of the band: we should care about OUR opinion, and THE BAND'S opinion. Fuck the media. They're crows looking for fresh meat, it doesnt matter if its GNR, Britney Spear, Eminem... the only thing they want is good news to sell and some drama to sell.

I think it was pretty damn close.

Similar to the misconception that Jagger and Richards were, or are the Stones, a lot of people would put the Axl/Slash partnership in the same ball park.
The 1969-74 Stones were the greatest rock r roll band of all time in my book, and while they were already an established powerhouse before that period, Mick Taylor opened new doors for them because they never before or since had such a fluid player. Watts and Wyman were no slouches either.
Same can be said with Izzy, Duff and Steven in Guns. Take one of them away, and who knows what happens.

In most bands, the lead singer and guitarist are going to get most of the attention/credit because they are at the forefront, and maybe rightfully so, but there's obviously more that goes into it.

The fact that Slash is the person responsible for creating that November Rain solo, and Sweet Child riff, and solo, and WTTJ riff, and Don't Cry solo etc doesn't hurt.
You finally said something I agree with. Hard to shake that from your head. He made an undeniable impact. Strange, it hasn't stopped you from trying.

To all the people who seem to think that that Beta, Fernando and Vanessa aren't equipped for this job;

Haven't you stopped to ponder that maybe being in the business for 20 years, being around GN'R for 20 years and knowing the entire history, each member of the band, and more to the point having from all this time and energy spent a great understanding of the industry, would make them the perfect people for the job?

Surely much better than a bunch of people pushing for some sort of cash grab awful reunion.

I never tried to shake them, since I love the old lineup and also dig the music on Chinese Democracy.  It doesn't have to be one or the other, though some would try to tell you differently.

I'd be just as happy if they announced a reunion tour tomorrow as I would if they announced Chinese Democracy II.

might be the case, hope it works out, we'll see.
but if something goes wrong he cant blame it on or fire managers anymore but his inner circle.

Here's my concern.  Axl and Beta clash (just like Axl has with every manager) and it destroys their relationship.  He ends up firing her and killing the one constant good thing in his life.  That would mark the end of GNR.  Hiring a close friend is never NEVER a good idea.

PC

My only concern with Beta at the helm is whether it will impact the band putting out new music in 2012.  Irving Azoff was able to get Chinese Democracy out, but he's Irving Azoff.  What type of negotiating will Beta be able to do with the label(s) to get new music to the fans sooner than later?

The still jury's out....

What will they clash about? She'll do everything he tells her without question.


I agree. And I'd bet just about any amount of money there won't be new music in 2012.

As far as a new, as in newly recorded album, you could safely bet any amount of money that it ain't happening in 2012.  However, if Axl decides he wants to put out the rest of the CD Era tracks (The General, Atlas, Soul Monster, etc.) he could conceivably put that out as soon as he straightens out his issues with the label, whatever they may be.

I didn't realise you knew Beta.

Oh wait.

Hey-in the end, it's his band, he gan go with whom he chooses, but someday, the game of blaming Slash, Steven, the label, managers, execs., in interviews for all of his problems is going to get old-Slash has been out of the band for over 15 years.

That's the spirit Axl, so he's going to call Slash and work out it? 

As far as I'm concerned, it's all of them or I'm going to be disappointed.  Those two in particular and they better not try to fake it because we're going to see right through that.  Not expecting them to be partners but mutual respect for each other, two guys that made it through a very tough time and produced a winner.  They're in a very elite class.

Or you know I'm willing to administer the beating.  ;D

Man, Axl really hates Steven. :hihi:  Guy would love to just erase him from GNR history if he could.  :no:  Sad thing is Duff and Slash will pretty much bow down to whatever Axl wants...and would throw Steven under real quick.   

I personally think Axl should give Steven 50,000 or something just to not play ;D

Interesting. Was it bitter and insecure for Slash to mention Axl like he did for so many years?

Ali

Agreed. I think Axl and Izzy's partnership was the cornerstone of GN'R.

Also, I think people are looking at what Axl said about Slash in global terms when my impression was that Axl was specially speaking of AFD. I think that record was defined musically more by Izzy, with Axl adding lyrics and melodies, along with key riffs and, of course, solos by Slash.

Ali

As far as Beta being GNR's manager, where exactly is the downside?  Axl has someone who he obviously trusts in a powerful position to help deal with the parasites that exist in the music business.  Sounds like a good plan to me, and is something I would do if I were in a powerful position like Axl.

on a side note, can anyone explain to me why the fuck Guns N Roses are still dealing with major labels?  Its almost 2012!  A band as powerful as GN'R could go the independent route so easily, and have complete control over EVERYTHING they do without answering to anyone.

Tom Delonge from Blink182/Angels and Airwaves fought to get Angels taken off of Geffen and created this website called modlife.com to distribute music, and has completely rewritten the business model for a professional band as far as how they release music, videos, albums, pay per views etc...it would be great if GNR would do something like this>>>   http://modlife.com/angelsandairwaves   THAT is what a music website should look like!

Both sound bitter and insecure, sure

Fair enough.

Ali

Couldn't be any worse than Merck.

Give her a chance. : ok:

I agree, and I think the difference between now and other periods in which Beta was "acting" manager is that Axl has tons of confidence in the current lineup and seems to be in a frame of mind to push this band into new territory.  Axl's got his swag back and thats all I need.

I hope it works out well...business can be brutal. 
Families can be strained. 
They have been through some tough shit over the last decade and a half, so I am optimistic they can weather future storms together.

 :peace:

Just an idea here:  My 1st action as GNR's manager would be to lock the band behind closed doors.  Nobody's comin' out until we've got a new record!   :hihi:
...because everyone knows Axl responds well to power-plays.  NOT!   :hihi:

Just release another album next year Axl and fuck these clowns. Shut them right the fuck up!

But that could be the problem.  A manager is supposed to challenge the artist too, not just be a "yes" person.



Bitter, definitely.  Slash himself has admitted several times that his post-GNR negativity towards Axl was brought on by pent-up bitterness that ate him up.  However, he was generally being asked his opinion on Axl (as opposed to bringing him up for no reason), and he'd been pretty quiet from 1996-2001 about Axl, so it had been building for five years within him.  I don't think insecurity really had anything to do with it.

When AXL made the recent comments about Slash, you're talking about a guy who left Guns N Roses 15 years ago.  Axl has since recorded and toured with lineups that he claims make him happy, which is cool.  So why the need to bring Slash up at all?  Especially when NOBODY asked about Slash.  In fact, Axl always makes it a point that he is NOT to be asked about Slash, but then brought him up anyway and spoke a good bit about him.

My thoughts are that -- regardless of who joins his "Guns N Roses" lineup -- Axl realizes that the specter of Slash will haunt him forever and a day.  Since Axl doesn't care for Slash, that must really eat him up, so he says these sorts of things to attempt to minimize Slash's contributions to Guns N Roses.

Maybe 4 or 5 people on this particular website will be duped into believing that Slash had little to do with the musicianship and success of Guns N Roses, but the millions who supported the band from 1987-1993 remember differently.

I will again state that if Axl were truly secure in his current lineup and their place in Guns N Roses, he wouldn't need to tear down any former member of the band, or even think of them.  He would just acknowledge their place in GNR history and continue on with his new band.  Slash, Steven, Duff, and Izzy have all been critical of Axl's demeanor in various ways, but they've never discredited Axl in terms of GNR's musical success.  Why can't he do the same for them, rather than foolishly trying to revise history?

Slash and Axl haven't spoken or been in a band together for 15 years, so what is Axl gaining by slandering him at this point?  Slash hasn't spoken negatively about Axl in years, so it's not like Axl has anything to retaliate over.


I don't necessarily disagree, but Steven's rhythm contributions cannot be denied.  People don't typically credit drummers in any band, but Slash and Izzy have both made it a point to say that Steven deserves a huge amount of credit for the spark and the (to use Izzy's words) push-and-pull that gave those songs their feel, and they're 100% correct.  Steven's drumming is incredibly rhythmic and drives the record forward.  At the end of the day, it was all about chemistry between five guys.  Songwriting credits don't mean everything.  The fusions of styles and ideas are equally important, and the five original members just had it.

The problem with "paper" interviews is that you can't hear the inflection in his voice.

Any of you consider he was 'joking' about the riff stuff?

Just like on that trunk interview when he was talking about Frank wanting the band to play certain songs and Axl replied something to the affect of "Nobody asked you!"  You could see/hear he was obviously joking but put that same quote on paper and the haters could easily turn that into the whole dictator shit and that the guys have zero input.

As duff starts his book, he's writing from his truth, others might not see the same story in the same way. Slash, Axl and all the others will see and say things as they saw it, but the key here is that its Axl's band and regardless of what other people say. What happens in future is gonna come from the Axl camp, who else is on that ride will be decided on what the final product needs to be, and by those who can do it, and Axl says he's happy with the way things are, and knows they are capable of the next project, they all have that work ethic.

On HOF, I've concluded that Axl will share the stage, but not play, saying that was then, we've all moved on and thx for the award, bringing closure, and an anti-climax for the demander's expecting a reunion/live show.

he would prefer to reunite with Duff and Slash rather than Izzy and Steven?  WTF ??? ??? ??? ??? ???


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_blog/2011/12/axl-rose-talks-playing-los-angeles-rock-hall-reunion.html

pretty sure he's just theoretically speaking  :P

Yeh i read that, i just want the current line up to stay together . Although would be cool to see all the old boys share the stage at HOF but that would open a can of worms in the press about reunions at shit

So probably they will go all....

I don't understand why someone who is not in the band is giving the lead singer ultimatums-is anyone else in the band asked about these changes? If this isn't Spinal Tap, not sure what is

What I'm missing in all of these interview are few simple questions;

1st...what are your near/long term goals...
since CD's sales have been relatively low compared to bands of similar calibre, like metallica or RHCP, do you plan on taking steps that doesnt happen again, and do you even care about album sales.

2nd same applies for tours. Ticket sales are lagging behind metallica, rhcp, and bon jovi... and GNR is above those bands.

I dont know how they view these questions, but they are important factor in any busines situation. If they dont care for big audiences... then ok, but if they wanna have sold out shows, or do arena tours... then they need to have more popular aproach... from magazines to tv shows, to vids...

Asking Axl why his album and ticket sales are shitty may not be your best route as a journalist. No wonder he's picky about giving interviews  ???

Asking Axl why his album and ticket sales are shitty may not be your best route as a journalist. No wonder he's picky about giving interviews  ???
[/quote]

LOL Couldn't agree more!  "Why do you suck so bad compare to your competition?" is a terrible question for an artist, who clearly doesn't give a f-ck about what others do!

LOL Couldn't agree more!  "Why do you suck so bad compare to your competition?" is a terrible question for an artist, who clearly doesn't give a f-ck about what others do!


[/quote]


The answers are right there for you though, RHCP and Metallica have a label that promotes them, web sites , etc etc and are a lot more press friendly than GnR. Axl and other band members have said themselves a hundred times that their label does not support them at all and they constantly have managers that just want a reunion for the big pay day. Axl just isnt the guy to whore himself out for publicity. 

I think this tour has been a huge success for the lack of promotion that it had and the same for CD, it sold a lot of copies for having zero promotion. I really think GnR is alive and well.

I just dont understand anyone that would even consider the idea of a reunion. This band live is absolutely incredible.

No, you misunderstood Axl.  Granted, he wasn't really clear, but I'm sure what Axl meant was that only Duff and Slash would be capable of withstanding all the work that goes into touring.  He's saying that he believes Izzy and Steven couldn't, so the cries for a full blown original lineup reunion are for naught even if they were on good terms.  That's Axl's belief, and I'll grant him that there may be merit to it.  Izzy has proven that he's random about doing shows, and Steven -- much as I love the guy -- hasn't proven that he can tour for extended periods of time.

On the point of bitterness, I will point one thing out: when Duff first played with the current GN'R lineup in London, Slash was asked about it. He brought up, unprompted, a remark about that show starting late. So, to sit here and say Slash has no lingering bitterness is misleading. Both men still have lingering anger and bitterness.

Ali

This thread is driving me nuts ! none of us know what goes on behind the scenes, who are we to stay that Beta can't manage GnR.  Already we have had a live stream of one show and another coming on the 30th ! that's pretty damn cool for us Guns fans.  As far as Slash goes... Axl is right, Slash was a late edition to the band.  Past interviews have proven that statement, plus coming in after the Illusions album and demanding that the Snakepit record be the next GnR album that tell's you alot right there.  Give it up... there will be NO reunion.

Having Duff McKagan's band open for you twice in the past week or so, and mentioning Slash in your 2nd major interview (does he remember that Robin Fink and Buckethead were in this band? And played on the album??) does not help the cause.

I don't see the point your trying to make ? Duff and Axl are friends.  He mentioned Slash in a interview...  ok ?

First of all, my statement was that Slash hasn't made any negative remarks about Axl lately, not that he doesn't haven't any residual bitterness.  I wouldn't really know if Slash is still bitter or not, but if he is, he hasn't made it publicly known.  And just how do you know Slash's comment wasn't made with a smirk on his face?  You just read it on the internet, you didn't see his face.  A subtle quip about the show starting late isn't necessarily indicative of lingering bitterness, and it's nowhere near the explicitly scathing diatribe that Axl espoused at Slash in his recent remarks, in which you don't even have to see Axl's expression to hear the bitterness in his voice.


First off, it's "addition" not "edition".  Secondly, you and Axl are both arguing bullshit semantics that no one cares about.  Appetite for Destruction was the first record released by Guns N Roses, and the band's lineup was Slash, Izzy, Axl, Steven, and Duff.  All five were credited with songwriting and playing.  All five were original members.  Nothing else matters, and no one gives a damn about anything else.

For Axl to bray on and on about who joined the band at what time is nothing more than a desperate, asinine attempt to discredit Slash, and -- with the exception of 5 or 6 of Axl's disciples on this website -- the world does not buy it or even care.  To the entire world, Slash will ALWAYS be the guitar god from Guns N Roses, and nothing Axl says will change that, no matter how much it kills him (which it obviously does).

Slash being a late addition is bullshit. Would Axl - or anyone on this board - have preferred to have been stuck with Tracii Guns instead???

I think you guys are really taking this way too personal. I've been a die hard GNR fan from the beginning, saw every line up, experienced great pleasure with the music that came with. Truth is we aren't these guys head, we have no damn clue . for myself following this band with such passion since 87, and yes I think the line up is as deserving and is indeed GUNS N ROSES today.
  That being said, I personally think that of course Slash , Duff, Izzy, Steven, played a HUGE part, for if not I don't think anyone who has loved the songs and the music can say they would if not for that magic moment.

But face it people can change life goes on and as my part as a fan, cause that is what I am , I assume people here posting are likewise. Debating this crap amongst our         selves is getting boring.lol.

So either you are a fan of GNR or you aren't! And that means every damn thing every recorded!. I was listening to Nov rain back in 87, along with don't cry etc. I was avid to know all about them at 17 yrs of age, they blew me away. I love the piano version of dont cry so much !!!. But I grew with the band as they grew, I had separations, and reconciliations, some people I just cant and refuse to, I get that, Im ok with that, and I assume those guys Axl, and Slash have to decide , its not up to us. Anyway ROCK ON ! GNR FOREVER!

Sorry for the typo.  Just look to the 1987-88 interview for proof Slash was a late edition.  They put a ad in the paper for a blues guitarist and they weren't quite sure but he kept popping up.  I don't care what the world thinks, or what the media has spinned against Axl.  I believe him because he was in the band...  This tour has been amazing and I appreciate Axl and the band for their hard work.  

I think its simple, Axl and Slash were big in Guns, both had a strong character and so they colide and didnt like each other that much. Happens all the time, each one wanted to get things done their way. They had to suck it up and work together, thats done and they wouldnt be able to do it again.

The manager thing its on the same route i guess, Axl is an amazing artist, but he is a rockstar and has a difficult character, when he was young he was forced to do things he didnt wanted to, he signed contracts etc. He had to tour and promote and shut up. Now he is older and he wont put himself on the same position, he wants to do things his way, but this causes problems on the buissnes side,  managers know he can produce much more millions but he wont do it the way they want. In my opinion its cool that Axl wont give up to the presure, but that comes with the territory of GNR not having as much succes as in the past. Its ok, he once had the biggest band in the world, he has the luxury know to just take it easy and create amazing songs.

It's the fact people base there own assumptions that they know what's going on with GnR... When they have no clue.  Whatever Axl says gets twisted and they think oh.... There's a chance of a reunion.  They forget to mention that the article states his face lights up when the names Ron, DJ, Richard, Tommy and the rest of the band are brought up.  For some people that's not what they wanna hear.

I completely agree with the last post, I have been a GNR fan since the beginning and for many years wished for a reunion. I went to see Velvet Revolver several times and GNR several times. The truth is I no longer care about a reunion because Axl and the current GNR band is fantastic what a great show they put on!!

Which you are still making...   :hihi:


You really didn't read what I said, did you?!  The FIRST album that Guns N Roses released featured Slash.  The FIRST album credits Slash (and all the original members) with writing and performing on all the songs.  Slash was touring with them by late 1985, and recording all the original songs in 1986.  FACT.

NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!

NO ONE CARES WHAT MONTH ANYONE JOINED THE BAND.

The fact is, Slash, Duff, Izzy, and Steven were all there when they were making the original music.  To yack and yack incessantly about who joined the band when is trivial to an extreme degree and nothing more than a fruitless ploy on Axl's part to discredit Slash. 

Based on the books by them I think its safe to say that "late addition" is a bit exagerated. the original classic lineup played as guns n roses after 4 or 5 shows with the other guys. Duff booked a tour and the drummer and traci didnt make it so they replaced them with Slash and Adler. Those were the only 5 musicians that could be GNR.

also keep in mind that the first live performance with Slash, Adler and Axl was under the name "Hollywood Rose" on June 16, 1984(!!).
it never was that Slash "accidently" was added to the group for June 06, 1985 (= 1st AFD line-up show). they knew and played with eachother about 1 year before already! pics from there are in Marc Canter's book on page 38-39.

i got the feeling Axl likes the HOF honor, exspecially from the fans, but doesnt really need/want to be there with old Guns, but he also doesnt want to get the bashing if he doesnt attend there. problem, huh?

+ 1 !
[/quote]I agree this is probably the best lineup, but playing well does not necessarily mean everything will work out-a lot of people will te3ll you Eddie Van Halen was playing his best while on tour with Gary Cherene, but the tour didn't sell well, and the album didn't do well-we seen what happened with that.

I am a little surprised by what this article says, foremost that Axl would only consider getting onstage with Slash (and Duff), but also that he has fired yet another manager - over reunion bullshit.  Something is NOT in context in this article...or I am completely missing something.  He fired Katsis because he (katsis) wanted a reunion and its quick $$$, and in the same interview states he is willing to have a reunion only with Slash and Duff, while affirming his dedication to the current lineup?  The day this came out, google was loaded with headlines about a reunion AGAIN "GnR Reunion Possible Says Axl"...at a time when the current GnR were finally starting to get some real positive press momentum.  Bad play by Axl or newsie trickster manufacturing a story?

I think he means Slash and Duff are only ones capable of doing a tour, while the others wouldn't be and that's why it would never work.  Not that he wants to do it.  Then the media takes it and spins it to their liking.

I've already read articles on other sites with the headline "Axl would consider GNR reunion with Slash and Duff." That isn't what he said at all.

Jesus fuck merry Christmas to all. That reunion will not happen as Beta is now in charge and nobody wants it anyway. When does this discussion end? What needs to be done, I'm ready to help.

Man you guys are completely missing what he said. You have to read the entire section about a reunion. He was talking about how the managers wanted to make millions off it and that the only people they needed for that is Duff and Slash because as with the Illusion tour people still came out in droves to see the band without Izzy and Steven.


That's what he is saying. Not that he would rather reunite with this one or that one.

And you missed what he said yourself.  What Axl was saying was that Izzy and Steven weren't (in his mind) capable of it, hence the statement about touring with them was difficult, and mentioning that the new guys all worked hard.  In other words, he feels the new lineup works in a touring capacity, whilst the original members wouldn't, because Steven and Izzy (in Axl's mind) aren't reliable enough to tour extensively.


Thanks for pointing that out.  I couldn't remember the dates.

Read what he said again, he is not talking about who he would rather tour with like some are saying.

I agree, he isn't saying he'd prefer to tour with one over the other, but you still need to read what he said again.... focus on the highlighted parts and you'll understand that he's NOT saying that a reunion would succeed with only Duff and Slash, without Izzy and Steven.



What he is saying is that touring is hard work, and he's toured with all of those guys (meaning the original lineup), and he's seen what they've done since (meaning the kind of touring record they have), and Axl feels that the only two that could withstand the touring would be Duff and Slash.

David and fucking Nigel. Does anything else really need to be said? I just finished watching the
movie... again and I kept thinking about Axl and Slash. The parrellels are hilarious.

I really hope everyone inducted into the hall of fame will show up. I dont really care if they do a one off performance at the show. In reality, I really hope they dont.  I have been a fan since I was 8 years old and now I'm 31 and I just feel like that that time is over and better left in the past. I will never take away what Steven,Izzy,Duff, Slash and Matt meant to to the older version of Guns and even if Axl thinks Slash didnt do much besides come up with a few key riffs.. In my mind, every Guitar part  Slash ever recorded was as much a key part as every vocal line Axl recorded and the two of them on stage together was something legendary.  But that was then


Axl and this current lineup have worked hard and they are amazing in a live setting. What they can do in a studio as a band in making a record is something I really want to hear. Richard,Ron,Dizzy,DJ,Frank,Chris & Tommy are a much more modernized version and they just kill all the material, theres just so much more going on now with the sound and having 2 guys on keys and 3 guitar players, like Civil War at the LA show was just so bad ass, sounded so much fuller and the guys just attack it. Some people hate the solo spots , but I absolutely love them. It's awesome to see Richard,Ron and DJ show off their skills. I like the fact that they have incorporated  the reest of the band in their solos. It's really a tremendous show from start to finish. I cant say enough good things about this current lineup.

With New Guns Axl has the freedom to do the kind of material he wants when he wants it, so i wouldn't expect other kind of answer from him at this point

I'll raise the practical question at this point; do you think they'll do Stonehenge?

LoL look its DEFINITELY confusing - but I'm pretty sure he's saying BOTH. Let me deconstruct:

He's saying firstly, EXPLICITLY "The only thing that would make it would be Duff and Slash" - that the only way you could have a proper reunion tour is if those two were there. Then he's (implicitly) saying its not JUST because their the most famous, or their all that's needed to pull crowds for a tour  ("its nothing against Izzy or Steven") but the main reason you need Duff n Slash is because he doesn't think Izzy and Steven could handle touring - ("Its hard work...I've seen what they've done since") - ie Izzy doesn't like arenas and can barely handle 10 guns shows, and Steven is a drug freak who has relapsed a billion times.

saying that, do you think guys it was some tests with Izzy on stage, to see if he can handle it?

I think maybe it's the right time for a reunion tour, in fact.
some sort of two shows, one with the old line up (Axl, Slash, Duff, Izzy, Steven) and another one with the actual guys.

you please every type of fan, you make a large amount of money and you close the old line up reunion shit thing with the Rock N'Roll Hall of Fame.


and after that, the goddam new album!

It really needs Duff and in particular Slash to say that they wouldn't do a show for all the money in the world, not Axl to squash this fantasy that some people have. Or at best, to play one song as their final swansong, at the HOF, " For all you mother fuckers who can't accept we've all moved on to where the grass is green and the girls are pretty. We've decided to close this rumour for good, so for the last time ever here's DDM...."

Axl is totaly right.Only Slash and Duff are totally ready and prepared for long tour.Main reason why Izzy left the band is that.I like Steven,but who can trust him.Why not Matt,because Axl want it. Reunion thing is "big money" thing and if it will happen noone will risk with Izzy and Steven...On the other hand,new band is fuckin rnr machine,which to be honest old band never been.I think these guys deserve fully suport and one album with full promotion.And they can sell big tour.

band have a priceg,and they got a money before the show...for example gnr got 500000 dolars for Belgrade show,and organizators had a risk for atendance and other stuf.

The trouble with going with just slash, matt and duff is that this would get spun as Axl is the new VR front man.....

its seems everything he says gets twisted, taken out of context and blown out of proportion... no wonder he doesn't give many interviews :hihi:

What???!! Come on....

The old band toured the Illusion albums for 2+ years around the world.

Technically by that time is was a version of GNR not the original....

Right, Izzy only performed live in 1991.  1992-1993 featured Gilby Clarke on rhythm guitar, and Sorum performed the entire UYI tour.  So it wasn't the original members.


Well, one reason is because Axl isn't often clear on what he means, as in this case.

Totally.  The  way that Axl answers some questions enables the interviewer to interpret it anyway they want and then they run with it!  It is amazing some of the headlines I have seen for articles regarding this interview, I saw one that says "Axl will only reunite with Slash and Duff"  as in he will only do it if they want to.  How in the world do you come away with that after reading the interview!!

I mean even the board members here have been dissecting the interview for days now.  I came away with 3 things from this interview,

1. Axl is dedicated to the current  GNR of 2011.

2. Axl has no interest in working with anyone from the Illusion era.

3. Axl thinks that only Slash and Duff have the chops/work ethic to pull off the live show that GNR demands.(I'm assuming their VR/Loaded/Solo albums and tours over the past 20 years are the basis for this)  Izzy and Steven are both completely unreliable in their own ways, and have shown as much over the past 2 decades.  And since they wouldn't be able to pull it off it wouldn't really be a reunion with the Illusion guys, so what is the point?  As in the media/fans keep talking about a reunion but it is not even possible even if all 5 wanted to do it because 2 band members couldn't pull it off even if they wanted to.

I could be completely wrong, but that is exactly as I interpret the interview.

Couldn't have said it better, old chap.  Well done.

Definitely the right interpretation in point 3 bohdi. But don't you think it's kind of an out-of-character Slash compliment?

And also why the hell is he even talking about the possibility of a reunion tour? I mean if that (the touring) is thr only problem, then one rrhof show would be no problem?  In the past Axl would be way more scathing..

Slash just said "I'm trying to put [axl feud] to rest" in an interview. I wonder if theyre talking...

I take it at face value, Axl said he didn't want to be "that guy" more or less to ruin it. And is willing to set aside his convictions, for the sake of the fans.
As far as Him talking about it would only work with Slash And DUff, I think he his speaking to thier worth ethos, as far as touring etc. But that doesn't mean Axl wants to go on the journey again with them. I dunno, as a fan since the beginning, all I really think of all this is that Axl is willing to take the stage again with the original line up, accept it graciously, but in the interview, also saying a reunion tour would never work as he is completely committed to his band mates today, and wanting to put out new music.

But again for the fans sake he is going to set aside whatever his feelings are, I have no doubt that Axl respects Slash and the rest . Obviously Duff and Izzy, but for sure if there was any reunion tour, it wouldn't work.
 

someone posted the whole interview on another site it makes a much better read than just the small part we`re discussing he also talks about radio stations and music and mentions he likes some of the music from the film drive maybe someone could post all of it on here : ok:

Axl Rose's appetite is for today's Guns N' Roses (http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/music/la-et-12-20-axl-rose-interview-20111221,0,691973.story)

Axl Rose talks playing the Forum, Hall of Fame gig, reunion (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_blog/2011/12/axl-rose-talks-playing-los-angeles-rock-hall-reunion.html)

Axl Rose bemoans the state of L.A. radio (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_blog/2011/12/axl-rose-bemoans-the-state-of-la-radio.html)

Drive is an awesome movie with an awesome soundtrack, indeed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV_3Dpw-BRY

Yep! Sadly, that's how I interpret it too... but here's still hoping for a one night reunion at the induction ceremony!

As was pointed out by jazjme, this was only a comment on their touring work ethics.  Slash and Duff has proven time and time again that they can sustain themselves on lengthy tours.


Because the world keeps asking about it.  What Axl is saying is that a full blown reunion wouldn't work even if they all wanted it to.  He isn't saying that HE wants it to work, he's just speaking hypothetically about the notion.


I highly doubt it.

Axl needs to channel his Tommy "The Nightmare" Smith character and do a guest dj spot on one of these radio stations....or even a remote from his house or something where he can play whatever he wants from his iPod or iTunes. 

he needs to create his own radio on http://www.radionomy.com/en and share it with us  : ok:

First off, "We take for granted that we know the whole story, We judge a book by it's cover, And read what we want, Between selected lines", still more than valid words 20 years down the road, just look at the length of this discussion, all the twisting and turning.

Surely Axl is talking about the reunion because the topic keeps popping up and is kept alive by people who smell money (in addition to those who simply want to sniff some nostalgia). He is pretty clear that easy cash is not his motivation. In addition to being quite dedicated to the current line up, he is also clear that 40% of the original line up could not cope with the demands of a tour and simply that fact is enough to rule out a reunion tour even if all involved had the will to do it.

Would I attend a reunion concert? No. I would not mind hearing a song or two at HOF just as a one time nostalgia thing if all parties would have a motivation to do it, but why would I pay money to hear the old songs (surely none from CD could be included) played worse than the current band does them (yes, you can dream of the past but it was never that great alive, in all honesty, despite all charisma and perceived chemistry). I can't see the old line up being creative together again, I just don't see them sharing a vision of what kind of music they'd like to create together and I have no interest to hear old songs played by some tribute band that is dead creatively. I know many will disagree on this and that is their prerogative, but i also know quite a few will agree. 

Wow, tribute band?
One of the more off base terms I've read.

Guns N' Roses have always had the reputation of being a great live act. I understand it's of some peoples opinions that the new lineup plays other peoples music better, and that's all well and great. I disagree. Pop in Live at the Ritz, or even the Illusion DVDs if you need a refresher. GN'R was every bit, and in my opinion more of a powerhouse live back then. Axl gets around pretty damn well for his age, but not like he used to. It doesn't make sense to me how he could run around the stage like he did and still manage to sing in tune(most of the time). Slash was as entertaining on stage as he was in the studio.

Not so sure they are dead creatively. Their last album of original material, however long ago it was, clearly states otherwise. There is no evidence to support they still couldn't create quality music together.

Do I expect them to reunite, pump out great albums and tour the world like it's 1992 again? No, but let's not get carried away. Guns N' Roses is a house hold name today because of the amazing records and tours they produced on the backs of Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, Steven and Matt. Not the other way around, as your "tribute band" comment seems to suggest.

Quite honestly, I cannot perceive any other reason for a reunion tour save for money. It has been 20 years (25 if we are strict) since the original line up created anything at all together. After the UYI tour ended they had quite a few years to come up with something. You really think they could work together now and agree on the directions of the music when they barely were able to do so earlier? Seriously? People have moved on and I doubt it's in the same direction.

The band certainly had some special energy and appeal in their old live performances (although they did not always hit it by the note), no one is denying that, but you really think they could still find in themselves the motivation and the chemistry to match up? Really? No, I see no magic in playing old songs for money.

Axl is the only one I've heard that has said anything remotely negative about playing "old" songs.
Slash, Duff, Steven clearly enjoy playing them, as they continue to do so in their projects since leaving GN'R.
You really think it's that far fetched to think that the guys who actually created those songs could enjoy playing them for fans who have never had a chance to hear them live? But on the other hand, you have no such reservations about guys that had no hand in creating or have any emotional attachment play them?

I'm just like everyone else in the world, I have absolutely no idea if any chemistry is left, or if there is any magic left to be captured between the alumni.
I don't believe it's as far fetched as you suggest, but I could very well be wrong. All I know is, plenty of bands have had problems, worked them out, and carried on doing what they do best. I can't think of many bands worth a damn where everything was roses at all times.

Money talks, but these guys aren't starving, save for maybe Steven. I don't think they would do it solely for cash. I think if they chose to reunite even for one night, it would be on their terms. They would have to feel like the bullshit was behind them. Can I envision them putting on a killer show if they shared the same stage at the RRHOF induction? Yes, that is not hard for me to envision at all, really. I've seen todays GN'R. I've Velvet Revolver and Slash with Myles. They all rank in my favorite live acts of today. I have a harder time envisioning them putting on a lackluster show to be honest.

Do you remember why we are discussing this in the first place? That's right, the interview Axl recently gave. In which he said quite explicitly that he has recently fired a manager who was advocating a reunion for money. Axl also made clear that even if all differences were put aside, he does not think the original 5 would be capable to manage a tour - even if all wanted, it could not happen. Is there really much more to discuss?

I was responding to the comments you made that made very little sense to me.
First referring to the original lineup as a tribute band. Second, inferring that the original lineup were not capable of playing their own songs well.
Third, trying to pass your opinion that old Guns was not very good live as fact, when in reality, they have received far more praise then any incarnation since.
Hence the undying interest from fans all over the globe for a reunion, 18 years later and going strong.

I'm not sure why Axl is talking about a tour anyway. The RRHOF isn't a world tour, it's one night.
I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen.

Also, what Axl thinks, and what is reality are not necessarily one and the same.

So, what Axl thinks is not necessarily reality, but you think Izzy and Steven could handle it and that's closer to reality than what Axl thinks ???

I presume Axl is talking about a tour because that - once again - was proposed by the previous management that was fired over it, and Axl perhaps wanted to make a point about it for those who urge for a reunion, as in it is not happening and why, from his point of view.

Like I said before, a one off nostalgia thing of playing a few songs at HOF would be nice if all involved were to agree. I also cannot see where have I ever said that the Old Guns were never good live? I believe I expressed my opinion to be quite the contrary. Surely the old guys can still play their old songs, but based on what I've seen both live and on YouTube it is rather doubtful they could do it better than the current line up. I also dare to maintain that it would be a sad thing indeed to have the old guys go around and play the old songs (20-25 years old!) just because it pays well. In my mind Guns has moved forward, there is new music out there that in my opinion exceed even UYI songs in maturity and depth and I would love to see the band grow, something which I cannot see would happen with the old guys, as sad as that may be.

I never said Izzy and Steven could handle it. Just like Axl, I don't know.
Only Izzy and Steven know what their bodies can physically handle.

I'm not sure why it matters to you that time has passed since they played together? or how that would make it a sad affair.
I see it as the opposite.

I appreciate that your of the opinion the Chinese Democracy songs show more depth/maturity than UYI.
Many people, including myself would strongly disagree. I'm of the opinion that Axl's lyrics in particular sorely regressed from UYI to CD.
Musically, it's apples and oranges, because you can't evolve, or mature from something you were never involved with from the beginning.

I'm holding out hope that Axl will feel more inspired with new guys like Ashba and BF involved in the songwriting process this time around.
If we were to play the reunion scenario, I could see there being a chance that he would feel inspired by the alumni, as he was when they were a band all those years ago. It's not unprecedented. Stranger things have happened.

You keep bringing up the money issue. I'm not sure you could make the argument that Richard Fortus and Tommy Stinson playing songs they have admitted to not being fans of before being hired is somehow more credible than the very people who wrote them. For the record, Richard and Tommy are getting paid too.

If this is not saying that you think the guys could handle it, then I don't know what is. Rather confusing to me that you claim otherwise.

All the original guys went their separate ways years ago and have each done their own thing since. Axl made a point in the interview to acknowledge how committed he is to the current line up. Also many of the guys have given signals that they are approaching creative stage. Axl fired a manager because he suggested abandoning the current band and going on a reunion tour. According to Axl the suggestion was motivated by the manager's urge to make more money. Does this sound like Axl is going on a reunion tour any time soon? Why would the old guys want it either? Have you heard anyone saying they'd like to (maybe Steven...)? Most likely motivation would be money as most people believe there would be loads of it to be made were a reunion tour a reality. Really, have you even read the interview?

If you don't pick and choose pieces of what I write, and instead read it all in the context it's given, I think I've been pretty clear.
Here it is again.

"I'm not sure why Axl is talking about a tour anyway. The RRHOF isn't a world tour, it's one night.
I think Izzy and Steven could handle that if it were to happen."

In summary, I think Izzy and Steven could handle playing one night, the RRHOF induction ceremony. As far as an entire tour? No, I don't know. Neither does Axl.

Entertaining banter between you two.  I get what Stardust Girl is saying though.  While I'd LOVE to see the original lineup, or even the UYI lineup go on a massive tour and try to recapture what once was, because I never got to experience it the first time around.  I wouldn't want that to happen solely for money, and I think that's the only way it would happen.  Axl is clearly committed to GNR in the present day.  Slash is having a blast doing his own thing with Myles and his band.  Duff is doing his thing with Loaded.  Steven is the only one who has been pining away for a reunion incessantly.  The rest of them, their hearts don't seem into it at this point.  So why go there?  So I, and countless others, can selfishly get to re-live the past?  As long as Axl wants to carry on with GNR in terms of touring and creating/releasing new music with the current lineup, I'll take that.  And that's just the way it is, so all this reunion talk seems to be all for naught.

With that being said, I'll be in Cleveland for the ceremony and I hope to hell I get to see something special for that ONE night.  Then, things can return to normal.

But it would be a MUCH bigger deal, when the whole Afd-Line Up would be included. And i think, he is not interested because Dizzy never was in a same line up with steven (ok, maybe a few weeks...). so when there is a reunion, i think, there would be this line up

axl
slash
richard
duff
frank
dizzy
(chris maybe)

I wouldn't want to see them mail it in solely for money, either. I totally get that.
I don't see a reunion happening, and really, I'm okay with that. I've had 18 years to get used to the fact that I'm probably not catching that lineup again live.
That's life.

Just for shits and giggles, to kill time, which is what forums are good for in my opinion...if we are to visit the land of make believe, and discuss the reunion, I don't see them doing it solely for cash, because if that was the only motivation, that offer was always on the table. I don't think they need the money much more today than they would have in years past. Most of the alumni seem to be enjoying the most success they have had in their post GNR careers.

Anyways, good talk StardustGirl.
Gonna switch gears here, and actually try and get some work done.

Maybe we can pick this up later.
The good thing about these types of debates is that they never really get resolved, or end (unless a moderator ends them for us).

Maybe it would be cool at the HOF for the old Appetite lineup to just perform one song together. Axl could get that monkey off his back and say he did for the fans and put that motherfucker to rest. If he doesn't do that I would personally just say right the fuck on Axl 'cause I have his back and understand what having your bros backs mean. These guys (the cool motherfuckers in GNR today) are his bros.

Either way fuck it. I am seeing GNR New Years motherfuckers HAHAHAHAHA!

There was a time and place for this band.  1987-1993 Guns N' Roses was if not the biggest band in the world.  Times change, people change. The alumni was known for their raw, sloppy playing ability that was big during that era of music.  Today we have a band that is note by note kick ass, group of guys that can play old and new material.  What Guns is about today isn't about the past... It's about touring and writing new material.  For those wanting a reunion... wouldn't you want  to  hold that moment in time as something special ?  Axl is probably right in when he says that he doesn't think Izzy or Steven could handle it.  Izzy seems to do what he wants, Steven all you gotta do is turn on the  TV to figure that one out.  All I'm saying is if you get the alumni back, would it tarnish their legacy if things didn't work out ? I for one would like to remember them for what they did for music during that time.  Guns N' Roses today is something special too and its now their turn to shine. 

Agreed.  I'm hoping for that one night - and only one night - when the AFD-era members can share the stage and celebrate what they accomplished, as well as the legacy that they left behind.  It's not about invalidating the current era Guns, but about paying tribune to the journey the original members made together and how they truly changed the face of rock and roll.  They owe it to themselves to share in that moment, and - as a fan who lived through that time and saw them live - it would mean a lot to see that happen. 

As for a reunion, there's just no need.  The UYI-era members were unwilling or unable to embrace the musical directions Axl envisioned for the band and choices were made.   It's the current lineup who has realized those visions and will carry them into the future.  But on that one night in Cleveland, I hope to see something amazing happen.