So For All The Talk About Not Being Owed Something From Axl...

[Buddha_Master]

He owed us the album and didn't deliver the goods.

Read this quote:

"Geffen decided to go ahead with the greatest hits album because Rose did not deliver on promises to complete a new record, tentatively titled "Chinese Democracy," a source familiar with the deal said on condition of anonymity.

Geffen has paid $13.5 million into the "Chinese Democracy" project, which has been more than seven years in the making, the source said."

Its taken from CNN (http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/03/17/music.axl.rose.ap/index.html)

There was a deal, and Axl didn't follow through with his end of it. We were, as I now understand it, owed the album by this time. Axl basically, and I am sure happily, took the reported $13.5 million from Geffen and has nothing to show for it.

I remember MYsteron (I think) reporting that there was a deal that the ablum had to be delivered by a certain date and if was not they would release a GH album. Axl called Geffen out (calling their bluff), and got fucked for it.

As a business, how should Geffen feel about all these stories of Axl partying in Vegas, buying a Neon Pegasus with their money, and hitting strip cubs and shit.

And for all the times we said Axl didn't owe us shit. In reality, he did.

If he was to stick to his word, and his end of the bargain, we would have Chinese Democracy in our hands. A man's word is sometimes all that he really has.

[SLCPUNK]

Technically he only owed Geffen the record. Not us.

[McGann]

I can see your point, but I believe it's quite a stretch.  Axl had no contract to deliver me or anyone else on this board anything, unless  there are Geffen/Universal execs here.
Your use of the word "us" in this post is in error, I believe.


If you are David Geffen, my humble apologies.
/Mike

[TyRod Tulip]

He owed us the album and didn't deliver the goods.

Read this quote:

"Geffen decided to go ahead with the greatest hits album because Rose did not deliver on promises to complete a new record, tentatively titled "Chinese Democracy," a source familiar with the deal said on condition of anonymity.

Geffen has paid $13.5 million into the "Chinese Democracy" project, which has been more than seven years in the making, the source said."

Its taken from CNN (http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/03/17/music.axl.rose.ap/index.html)

There was a deal, and Axl didn't follow through with his end of it. We were, as I now understand it, owed the album by this time. Axl basically, and I am sure happily, took the reported $13.5 million from Geffen and has nothing to show for it.

I remember MYsteron (I think) reporting that there was a deal that the ablum had to be delivered by a certain date and if was not they would release a GH album. Axl called Geffen out (calling their bluff), and got fucked for it.

As a business, how should Geffen feel about all these stories of Axl partying in Vegas, buying a Neon Pegasus with their money, and hitting strip cubs and shit.

And for all the times we said Axl didn't owe us shit. In reality, he did.

If he was to stick to his word, and his end of the bargain, we would have Chinese Democracy in our hands. A man's word is sometimes all that he really has.

Good point.  I agree 100%.  Axl's word isn't worth shit.  His legacy and place in history is dying before our eyes.  It's just fucking sad.

/Tulip

[SLCPUNK]

If you are David Geffen, my humble apologies.
/Mike

LOL

[Buddha_Master]

I am not so much talking figuratively, but more from a certain point of view.

Geffen wanted to sell the album to us by X time. Axl owed Geffen the album ( by making an agreement) by X time that was to be sold to us.

It may not be figuratively but, Axl owed us the album.

The interesting point for me, is that there was an agreement. And Axl broke it.

[chineseblues]

I am not so much talking figuratively, but more from a certain point of view.

Geffen wanted to sell the album to us by X time. Axl owed Geffen the album ( by making an agreement) by X time that was to be sold to us.

It may not be figuratively but, Axl owed us the album.

The interesting point for me, is that there was an agreement. And Axl broke it.

Axl don't owe anyone anything.

www.gnrstrip.tk

[Buddha_Master]

Axl don't owe anyone anything.

www.gnrstrip.tk

Dude, you can read right?

Axl did owe something. He owed Chinese Democracy to Geffen, and he didnt deliver.

Here, I'll repost this quote for you because you obviously can't keep up with all these posts in this thread

"Geffen decided to go ahead with the greatest hits album because Rose did not deliver on promises to complete a new record, tentatively titled "Chinese Democracy," a source familiar with the deal said on condition of anonymity.

Geffen has paid $13.5 million into the "Chinese Democracy" project, which has been more than seven years in the making, the source said."

Axl didn't deliver the album he owed to Geffen. You got all that? Good chineseblues.

[alwaysoutparading]

www.gnrstrip.tk[/url]

umm did you read the thread? yeah he does. he owes Geffen a CD or more

[Mysteron]

He owed us the album and didn't deliver the goods.

Read this quote:

"Geffen decided to go ahead with the greatest hits album because Rose did not deliver on promises to complete a new record, tentatively titled "Chinese Democracy," a source familiar with the deal said on condition of anonymity.

Geffen has paid $13.5 million into the "Chinese Democracy" project, which has been more than seven years in the making, the source said."

Its taken from CNN (http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/03/17/music.axl.rose.ap/index.html)

There was a deal, and Axl didn't follow through with his end of it. We were, as I now understand it, owed the album by this time. Axl basically, and I am sure happily, took the reported $13.5 million from Geffen and has nothing to show for it.

I remember MYsteron (I think) reporting that there was a deal that the ablum had to be delivered by a certain date and if was not they would release a GH album. Axl called Geffen out (calling their bluff), and got fucked for it.

As a business, how should Geffen feel about all these stories of Axl partying in Vegas, buying a Neon Pegasus with their money, and hitting strip cubs and shit.

And for all the times we said Axl didn't owe us shit. In reality, he did.

If he was to stick to his word, and his end of the bargain, we would have Chinese Democracy in our hands. A man's word is sometimes all that he really has.

I did not say the part which you thought I said  

And I also do not feel sorry for Universal because, as I have said before, income from 80 million albums - all expenses  = a big profit.

Universal (imo) = the bank which charges you, which then puts you overdrawn, so they charge you for that as well. Then two direct debits bounce as a result of this, so they charge for you both of those too. etc.....  That is how I think of UM

[Buddha_Master]

Oh, my bad Mysteron. One of our more "insightful" members here said that. Maybe someone can refresh my memory. Darknemus or pilferik (sp?) maybe.

...nonetheless.

[Mysteron]

Don't worry about it

It sounds like an Informer3 statement, our Velvet Rope friend who dwelt here late last year. I may be wrong though

[Dizzy]

I can certainly believe Axl didn't deliver for them as he agreed to do.

And as far as the fans go, people say Axl doesn't owe them an album.  I've said it before and I'll say it again, yes he does.  Because he's teased and tantalized audiences for three years promising to deliver an album that'll be "out of the ballpark" (his words).  He repeatedly got everyone's hopes up, and he knows it.  So on that basis, he does owe the fans an album.

You can't hold a bone above a dog's nose for three years and then pull it away and say you owe him nothing.

[Doc Emmett Brown]

You know who Axl owes something to?

Not us (the fans), but the original Gunners: Slash, Izzy, Steven and Duff.  I think he owes them an apology.

Why?  Cuz he ruined the band's legendary image with all his idiocy in 2002.  Until then, there was a certain mystique about Axl Rose and the most dangerous band in the world.

As a business, how should Geffen feel about all these stories of Axl partying in Vegas, buying a Neon Pegasus with their money, and hitting strip cubs and shit.

Honestly, I dont know why Geffen and Axl have such a fucked up relationship.

[Izzy]

This is getting worse all the time......Buckethead gone, Geffen demanding some progress....its falling apart.

[Dizzy]

This is getting worse all the time...its falling apart.

Yeah, and I am beginning to feel the strong urge to say "I told you so" to all the people who called me an idiot for prognosticating that something this would happen sooner or later.


Izzy, have you noticed your signature since this situation began?  

[erose]

to me all this shit just proves how Axl just does what the fuck he thinks is best! he doesn't let anyone tell him what to do and he doesn't let the preasure make him release something he is not ready to release..

and to all thos who bitch, huh well... you'll buy the record when it comes anyway..

the only way this can be death and not victory is if chinese democracy never sees the light of day...

[Dizzy]

to me all this shit just proves how Axl just does what the fuck he thinks is best!

Yeah that's right, even if it means spitting in the face of the people who gave him the money and the opportunity to "do what he thinks is best".

[erose]

to me all this shit just proves how Axl just does what the fuck he thinks is best!

Yeah that's right, even if it means spitting in the face of the people who gave him the money and the opportunity to "do what he thinks is best".

wtf, how much money did you give him dude? what like 6 cd packs and maybe a gig which equals $150 in a 20 year period.. i think you got your money well worth.. get real... and if you mean geffen or universal, how much money do you think gn'r brought to their table...

[Dizzy]

and if you mean geffen or universal

Yes I did.

how much money do you think gn'r brought to their table...

Don't know, but that's irrelevant.  They gave him 13 million and he's blown it.

[SLCPUNK]

You know who Axl owes something to?

Not us (the fans), but the original Gunners: Slash, Izzy, Steven and Duff.  I think he owes them an apology.

Why?  Cuz he ruined the band's legendary image with all his idiocy in 2002.  Until then, there was a certain mystique about Axl Rose and the most dangerous band in the world.

Best darn post yet. Axl could have rocked us all. Kicked ass, given fantastic concerts all around the country (and world). Dropped a great CD, made a video..you name it. But he has managed to fuck it up pretty good here. He has to redeem himself now. Based on his prior actions, I don't see that happening.

So he does owe those guys an apology. After I saw him in LV, I figured that the past was the past and he was going to regroup and kick ass. What a letdown.

[slashnbuckethead]

I can understand how people can say Axl doesn't owe anyone anything. I think Guns N Roses is as much the fans as it is Axl's. I have nothing against Axl using the name to make good music and continue a legacy. But he has dragged guns n roses through the mud and not in a rock n roll manner, he has lost all respect anyone had for the band and turned it into the biggest joke in rock n roll. I am only talking about his actions and not the musical quality. I think all of the new songs are phenomenal, but its unprofessional and disrespectfull to all fans when he lets a whole tour get canceled and does not follow through on his promises. I remmeber after the japan shows in 2002 he said somethnig about proving people wrong, well since then he's only proven the critics right, he is irresponsible, unreliable, disrespectful and unprofessional. He owes us all an appology or an explanation or an album good enough to justify his stupidity.
GnR is still my #1, but damn, it gets old when people laugh at you for just mentioning a name.

rock n roll

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

will geffen get money from CD and the next tours  ?

i mean, if axl really hates geffen now, and vice versa, how will they work together ?
how axl will accept to tour and release a CD knowing that geffen is making money out of it ?

i mean, an artist hating his record company,it is really not helpful ...

[Lineker10]

I can understand how people can say Axl doesn't owe anyone anything. I think Guns N Roses is as much the fans as it is Axl's. I have nothing against Axl using the name to make good music and continue a legacy. But he has dragged guns n roses through the mud and not in a rock n roll manner, he has lost all respect anyone had for the band and turned it into the biggest joke in rock n roll. I am only talking about his actions and not the musical quality. I think all of the new songs are phenomenal, but its unprofessional and disrespectfull to all fans when he lets a whole tour get canceled and does not follow through on his promises. I remmeber after the japan shows in 2002 he said somethnig about proving people wrong, well since then he's only proven the critics right, he is irresponsible, unreliable, disrespectful and unprofessional. He owes us all an appology or an explanation or an album good enough to justify his stupidity.
GnR is still my #1, but damn, it gets old when people laugh at you for just mentioning a name.

rock n roll

I agree - good post!

[noonespecial]

"its unprofessional and disrespectfull to all fans when he lets a whole tour get canceled and does not follow through on his promises. I remmeber after the japan shows in 2002 he said somethnig about proving people wrong, well since then he's only proven the critics right, he is irresponsible, unreliable, disrespectful and unprofessional. He owes us all an appology or an explanation or an album good enough to justify his stupidity."

not to mention it's unprofessional and disrespectful to your band I hope Mr. Braids apoligized to Herbie as Buckethead left out the door.  

[Buddha_Master]

What's strange is, where are the GNR spin teams? Where is the damage control? In my opinion, this is the worst place GNR has ever been in.

The last tangible thing GNR did was the 2002 tour which was canceled. A year of Silence. THe bare boned dvd's. The greatest hits disk which resulted in lawsuits between the band and the label. And Buckethead leaving because apparently, he is sick of the stupid shit too.

What else needs to happen before an official statement is made?  Is the situation so grimm that not even an adequate?spin story can be made? GN'R Lies...what a fucking irony that album name  is. That name which once represented the bullshit the media painted GNR as being, has now evolved to being a proficy.

Common GN'R. Lie to me. Tell me everything is cool. What happened? You suddenly now have some dignity? You so easily lied to us in the past. You lied to Geffen about when you were going to deliver your project.

You were paid for a job. You agreed to a timeline. There was a contract that YOU agreed to. But you lied. So common, why stop there? Come on out and tell us that the label is a bunch of faggots, and you got fucked with again. Lie to us. Stop being a bunch of pussies. Say something.


Shit dude, you OWE it to yourself and your legacy. There is no 2005 for you, unless the bullshit stops here.
 

[Doc Emmett Brown]

Is the situation so grimm that not even an adequate?spin story can be made?

Interesting question... what would you do if you were hired to be in GNR's spin team?  

Would you blame it on the Bucket?  And paint Axl as the victim? Or would you come clean about Axl and the silence of the past year?

If I was hired (as in I am contractually obligated to do this), I would play up the "Axl is one crazy mofo" theme - what else to do?   Any thoughts?

[erose]

They gave him 13 million and he's blown it.

do you really think he has blown it for good? do think there is no hope for cd ever? or atleast in the near future meaning the next three to four months?

[Buddha_Master]

do you really think he has blown it for good? do think there is no hope for cd ever? or atleast in the near future meaning the next three to four months?

Just asked this same question to my magic 8 ball

....hmm nope. It says "Not likely"

I mean really. Do you really see Chinese Democracy comin g out in the next 3 months. With everything that has gone down. Its just going to be poof, there it is. I can see it coming out in three months if a statement has been issued saying such, but they arent saying a damn thing.

So no. Not likely.


You know my bro paid this fool a couple thousand dollars to build  him this piece of furniture. The dude never delivered. Always had these excuses for why it wasn't done when he said it was going to be. Months and months went by, and it wasn't till legal action was threatened until the fool just said that he was dealing with too much shit and he couldnt finish the piece. So my bro got the money back, but is shit out of luck on the furniture.

Axl is worse. He is like this same asshole my brother had to deal with except he isn't going to give the money back. If you say you are going to do something, be a man and fucking do it. Thats why Axl gets paid the big bucks. Its his job. He made an agreement, and he isnt delivering his end of the bargain.

[MCT]

Axl is worse. He is like this same asshole my brother had to deal with except he isn't going to give the money back. If you say you are going to do something, be a man and fucking do it. Thats why Axl gets paid the big bucks. Its his job. He made an agreement, and he isnt delivering his end of the bargain.

You forget something...........Axl is a tortured soul.....with many regrettable tattoos........and red hair.........

Plus...the poor bastard is lactose intolerant........

[marcos]

i forgot until earlier that GNR canceled an entire tour of england in 2002 or was it 2001?  so many shady, poorly planned things have gone down with this band that i think it was almost better that it ends this way...the songs will come out at some point in some form but without axl's support and then only the people on boards like this will buy it.  no matter how great the album was going to be it was going to get trashed by the critics just because of a bias against axl.  this way the music will come out via a lawsuit, axl will say "its not finished" and that will be his excuse however the music is received.  it may take a couple years but the music will come out (unless axl burns the tapes) and I bet we will all love it and say "wow, wouldn't it have been great to hear "Prostitute" live or some song, at this point i am thinking at least an end to this maddness is in sight

[MadmanDan]

Stop being so fuckin negative. I don't know about you,but Axl doesn't owe me anything. I could even say that I owe Axl the best three albums that I ever heard.


None of you know shit!! Not even Misteron! About the original band breaking up,about the cancelled tour and about CD. If Axl has done anything wrong,it's that he has given us too little information,making way for roumors and interpretations.

I suggest to you all to live your life,read a book,go out,listen to appetite and illusions and see what happens in lisabon.Don't be so fuckin dramatic

[DEAD HORSE]

First of all, i dont think Axl owes an apology to anyone.nor the old memeber . Axl does what the fuck he wants since day one, what surprises us afterall?

At least i can say Axl is the one who has never let me down with music like any other bands like Metallica, Iron Maiden, Marilyn Manson and the list goes fucking on!  

What i dont like about Axl is cancelling tours. because i know a lot of people drives miles to get to the concert, so its not fair .But i dont know man! Its has been told that Axl needed a psquiatric to get to teh fuckin stage......so there you know Axl is not that well..

[Buddha_Master]

To Dead Horse and Madmandan:

Don't lose sight on what the facts are.

From the first thing stated in this thread:

Read this quote:

"Geffen decided to go ahead with the greatest hits album because Rose did not deliver on promises to complete a new record, tentatively titled "Chinese Democracy," a source familiar with the deal said on condition of anonymity.

Geffen has paid $13.5 million into the "Chinese Democracy" project, which has been more than seven years in the making, the source said."

Axl may not directly owe any of you motherfuckers a thing. But he does owe Geffen an album, that indirectly effects us all. You dig?

[kockstar99]

At least i can say Axl is the one who has never let me down with music like any other bands like Metallica, Iron Maiden, Marilyn Manson and the list goes fucking on!  

The artists you mention may have let you down with some of their music they released but at least they try and keep making music... I dont think any of Axl Roses music will ever let me down as i havent hated anything hes done yet...

[kockstar99]

What's strange is, where are the GNR spin teams? Where is the damage control?

hasnt he said he doesnt use the press unless he "has something to promote"   right now he doesnt have a god damn thing to promote...

and since he hates the internet im not going to hold my breath waiting on something to leak over the internet...

If May comes and goes and there is no RIR concert thats it for this guy... im out like slash... Ill put the 2002 bootlegs away and get excited about the 2005 Motley Crue reunion ..