* Hiroshima: Pictures they Didn't want us to see

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

[GeorgeSteele]

An enemy's savagery does not justify targeting innocent civilians. ?Peace motherfuckers. ?

[zman]

Its now been shown Japan offered to surrender long before the bombs fell - all this talk about the lives an invasion would have cost is nonsense, Japan was finished and would have surrendered with nothing more than a blockade

The main reason the bombs were dropped was as a negotiating ploy with the Soviet Union, and obviously to see what damage they could do - the US refused to arrange a testing for Japanese observers to convince them to give up

When u consider the bombs did less damage and killed less people than a regular bomber mission there wasnt even a tactical reason for doing it

Yeah, it saved lives.

who's?

Oh wait, there was going to be a huge invasion in 1946 - and what pray tell, would the Japanese have used against the Americans without any remaining oil? Horse drawn tanks? They didnt even have cities left by that point

and here's a fact for u

Curtis Lemay head of the USAF in the pacific was ordered in early 1945 to save two cities for ''special treatment'' - Nagaski was chosen whn the geography of the initial target was deemed as liabel to contain damage - those bombs were going down on Japan reagrdless of the military situation

Izzy, i think you need to read up on your history more - the japanese were going to fight till the last man.? they were training civilian armys to fight with sharpened bamboo sticks.? the estimated casulties on the allies side (not just the US - the brits would have suffered terribly as well) were through the room.?

Contrary to what many people think, it wasn't really the bomb that ended the pacific war, but the firebombing campaigns the US carried out (which were just as devastating as nukes).? The firebomb campaign was literally wiping out cities, killing thousands at at time.? With or without nukes, the fire bomb campaign was so devastating it would have ended the war.

showing graphic pictures is a nice way to play on peoples emotions, but it doesn't tell the whole story.? Read up on how the japanese killed/raped the chinese for years.? the same civilians in the pictures wat-ever posted celebrated the kiling and raping of the chinese.

its ugly, but its war.? we can all agree its brutal and savage - but to say "oh they shouldn't have done it" is just narrow minded and naieve.? maybe they should have thought about the repurcussions before they bombed pearl harbor.?

Got any pics of that to show wat-ever???

Well said and beat me to the punch.

[mrlee]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

Thats because there own government carried out the attack to give them reasons to go to war, and pass laws on terrorism which take away alot of public privacy.


---
However, i still do believe these muslim extremists need to be  dealt with, especially the ones in england cause they are more likely to take over here then they are in america.

[The Dog]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

i love how you tell us to calm down and not get all angry and nasty - yet you feel the need to bring up 9-11 and say things like "we got 2 planes in the head".  If you want to have a normal discussion then you should take your own advice.  maybe you should think ahead before you say such assinine things - dont act like you don't know saying certain things isn't going to piss off people.  i would THINK you are smarter then that, but i'm probably giving you to much credit.

you are thinking like someone living in 2007, not 1945.  its easy for you to say NOW that the bomb should have been a deterrent, back then nobody could even comprehend a weapon like that.  The japenese were warned that we had a very very powerful weapon, they didn't heed the warning.  the bomb is a deterrent NOW b/c we have seen the devastation it can cause.

as i've said before, the US didn't even need the bomb.  the firebomb campaigns were almost, if not MORE effective then the nuke.

[zman]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

If I am not seeing the whole picture please explain.

So us dropping the Atomic Bomb is the reason why we had 2 planes to the head?

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

If I am not seeing the whole picture please explain.

So us dropping the Atomic Bomb is the reason why we had 2 planes to the head?

Nah, nothing is tied. Don't worry. Do not wake up. Everything is all separated.
We got the Russians out of afgahnistan. That has NOTHING to do with 911.

Questions:
Does the Savagery of the ennemy explains the bomb?
Are civilians worth dying in the war?
DO you understand that al-quaida was hitting the governement when they bombe the towers?
Are there rules in war?
Are terrorists acts war acts?
The bomb, the civilian dead, Does it bother you ethically?
Would you kill 2 loved ones to save 50 other people?
Do the atrocity of japanese escuse your atrocities?

How are you going to handle the fact that a lot of countries have the bomb now?

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

i love how you tell us to calm down and not get all angry and nasty - yet you feel the need to bring up 9-11 and say things like "we got 2 planes in the head".  If you want to have a normal discussion then you should take your own advice.  maybe you should think ahead before you say such assinine things - dont act like you don't know saying certain things isn't going to piss off people.  i would THINK you are smarter then that, but i'm probably giving you to much credit.

you are thinking like someone living in 2007, not 1945.  its easy for you to say NOW that the bomb should have been a deterrent, back then nobody could even comprehend a weapon like that.  The japenese were warned that we had a very very powerful weapon, they didn't heed the warning.  the bomb is a deterrent NOW b/c we have seen the devastation it can cause.

as i've said before, the US didn't even need the bomb.  the firebomb campaigns were almost, if not MORE effective then the nuke.

That i agree with. 1945 was a different time.
I wanted to talk about the bomb, in relation to what is going on with Iran now.
So i agree with you.

About the harsh comments.
Dont be a fool. American patriots arent the last one to say harsh things about sub-races and the *ennemy*
Do people talk calmly about alquaida? No.

So if we can discuss cold heartly about the deads in japan, we can discuss about the deads in the towers.
If the deads in Hiroshima are just a parameter of the war, a way of ending it.
The dead in the towers are merely unamed numbers that serve the war on imperialism.
nope?

Just read the first page.
See how people go from coldhearted analysis on Hiroshima to fervish angerish comment on 911 !!

see?

[2112]

No where does it mention that the Japanese attacked the U.S. FIRST.   

I agree.

Japan played the game and payed the price.

[mrlee]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

If I am not seeing the whole picture please explain.

So us dropping the Atomic Bomb is the reason why we had 2 planes to the head?

Nah, nothing is tied. Don't worry. Do not wake up. Everything is all separated.
We got the Russians out of afgahnistan. That has NOTHING to do with 911.

Questions:
Does the Savagery of the ennemy explains the bomb?
Are civilians worth dying in the war?
DO you understand that al-quaida was hitting the governement when they bombe the towers?
Are there rules in war?
Are terrorists acts war acts?
The bomb, the civilian dead, Does it bother you ethically?
Would you kill 2 loved ones to save 50 other people?
Do the atrocity of japanese escuse your atrocities?

How are you going to handle the fact that a lot of countries have the bomb now?

Sounds like An Episode of 24, will jack kill his father and brother to save thousands from a nuclear bomb? watch the next episode of 24, sundays, sky one.

[zman]

Dude you are totally buggin.

[Where is Hassan Nasrallah ?]

I have never seen 24
zman > your participation has been grandly appreciated, you can go now

[Axlfreek]

The pictures where that persons shawdow and the ladders shadow next to him were imprinted on the wall is just amazing.

[The Dog]

Im not *using* the pics, it was just a reason for us to talk about it.

Please do not fall, like zman did, in the contest of who suffered the most. You see where it gets us in Palestine.
Or who's the nastiest.

I pretty much think you're smart enough to know that the chain of reaction did not *end with the war*.
Just like History did not stop with the the USA helping the Talibans
Just like History did not stop with the fall of saddam.

If war is ugly. Then 911 was a normal thing.

And again, you are not seeing the big picture.
The whole existence of the Bomb is that it HAS to be used as a deterrence weapon.
If not you can let some countries (iran???) think that it can be used. Although they know more than you think.
USA is, and was, the only country to do not reserve the Bomb to deterrence.
USA think that the Bomb is normal weapon.
They don't think about repercussion.
That is why you guys got 2 planes in the head
You cannot think ahead 2 days.

I mean really.

i love how you tell us to calm down and not get all angry and nasty - yet you feel the need to bring up 9-11 and say things like "we got 2 planes in the head".  If you want to have a normal discussion then you should take your own advice.  maybe you should think ahead before you say such assinine things - dont act like you don't know saying certain things isn't going to piss off people.  i would THINK you are smarter then that, but i'm probably giving you to much credit.

you are thinking like someone living in 2007, not 1945.  its easy for you to say NOW that the bomb should have been a deterrent, back then nobody could even comprehend a weapon like that.  The japenese were warned that we had a very very powerful weapon, they didn't heed the warning.  the bomb is a deterrent NOW b/c we have seen the devastation it can cause.

as i've said before, the US didn't even need the bomb.  the firebomb campaigns were almost, if not MORE effective then the nuke.

That i agree with. 1945 was a different time.
I wanted to talk about the bomb, in relation to what is going on with Iran now.
So i agree with you.

About the harsh comments.
Dont be a fool. American patriots arent the last one to say harsh things about sub-races and the *ennemy*
Do people talk calmly about alquaida? No.

So if we can discuss cold heartly about the deads in japan, we can discuss about the deads in the towers.
If the deads in Hiroshima are just a parameter of the war, a way of ending it.
The dead in the towers are merely unamed numbers that serve the war on imperialism.
nope?

Just read the first page.
See how people go from coldhearted analysis on Hiroshima to fervish angerish comment on 911 !!

see?

your last post is so full of hypocrisy, its just laughable.  you say you want to talk about the bomb and Iran, so whats that got to do with 9-11?!?!?!?
Who has said anything cold hearted about japanese civilians?  I didn't read anything like "those jap bastards got two nukes to the head".  YOU are the only one calling people a "fool", the one making emotionally triggering statements and then you have the nerve to tell them not to get angry.  Get off your high horse.

you want an intelligent discussion but you are incapable of doing so.  your rambling rant is all over the place with no coherent meaning, just a lot of american bashing and 9-11 talk.  If I need to tell you that 9-11 was about 5 years ago, and hiroshima/nagasaki were over 50 years ago (when none of us were even alive i'd imagine) and you can't see the difference between discussing the two in terms of emotion, then you're a bigger idiot then I ever thought possible!!!  sheesh! 

show some common sense and some respect for gods sake.  i dont mind you talking about 9-11 or other recent events, but you can do so with some respect.

[sjgotnitro]

Dropping the bomb saved US and Allied lives.

Have you seen the pictures of Pearl Harbor. How about the thousands of sailors that drowned in there docked boats.

Well I had a uncle who was there in the service and it was not a pleasent site. Ask a WWII veteren that served in the pacific theater what they think about the bomb or a inland invasion of japan.

The japanese solders were a feirce force to mess with, becuase they had no fear of dying. (modern day terorist took a page out of the history book and know the kamakasi was a major blow to the minds of people)

Did you ever read up on the torture the japanese did to tens of thousands of innocent civilians.

Also it has been recently stated that there were thousands of jet planes and rockets being manufactured underground in japan. If the war would not of ended when it did the end result might have been much diffrent.


War is not pretty, but when you are at war you need to do what is needed to WIN or come to a conclusion.

We are not capable of ever having a war with a desired result again.

It is not a football game with time out, the media, the politics, PC have turned war into a soap opera, where real lives still die and more will continue to die
I'm not a pro war, but I feel if your going to put troops and innocent people in harms way, do what you have to do and get it done. (no this does not mean drop a nuclear bomb ever time or ever again)

I have multiple relatives or freinds how have been in afganastan and iraq and there biggest complaint is there is no real objective. You can not have troops just standing around like pollice men becasue they are not. And the real enemy does not wear a uniform he can be anybody and he is a guy one second with a kid walking with him and the next shooting Ak at you or your partner. More solders have died to a kamkasi type explosion or assualt or road side bombs then actual fighting.

And no I do not think the iraq war was justified nor do I think it will ever end they way it was intended. I did vote for bush and at the time I bought the story of WMD but not anymore, BUT if we are there now let our guys get it DONE. The only thing we achecived was creating another unstable country in the middle east, that in the long run could mean bigger problems years from now.

Ok a rambled in many directions sorry.

[meanmachine73]

The pictures show a harsh warning for the future should the current political climate not change. The Hiroshima bomb whilst being absolutely devestating is tiny compared to Nuclear warheads from within the UK, USA, Russia, China, Korea etc.

On a side note, to the American posters, (USA being a country I love, visit 3/4 times a yr) The USA didn't win WW2 on it's own. The British soldiers and other allies played a huge part. Go forward 60 years to Iraq, you hear the American posters, "we kicked Iraq's ass" etc..? ?It's the British soldiers that are in the shit storm there, stationed in the worst area's. Give your Allies the respect they deserve...PLEASE

[The Dog]

The pictures show a harsh warning for the future should the current political climate not change. The Hiroshima bomb whilst being absolutely devestating is tiny compared to Nuclear warheads from within the UK, USA, Russia, China, Korea etc.

On a side note, to the American posters, (USA being a country I love, visit 3/4 times a yr) The USA didn't win WW2 on it's own. The British soldiers and other allies played a huge part. Go forward 60 years to Iraq, you hear the American posters, "we kicked Iraq's ass" etc..   It's the British soldiers that are in the shit storm there, stationed in the worst area's. Give your Allies the respect they deserve...PLEASE

who wasn't giving them respect?  i mentioned in a previous post how casulties for both US AND british troops would have been high if the war in the pacific had continued.  The war in the pacific was largely fought by the US though...

60 years from now i doubt ANYONE will be saying the US kicked any ass at all in Iraq.  we'll probably not want to talk about it at all to be honest.  it'll be a black mark on our history for decades to come.  its a disgrace.

[sjgotnitro]

The pictures show a harsh warning for the future should the current political climate not change. The Hiroshima bomb whilst being absolutely devestating is tiny compared to Nuclear warheads from within the UK, USA, Russia, China, Korea etc.

On a side note, to the American posters, (USA being a country I love, visit 3/4 times a yr) The USA didn't win WW2 on it's own. The British soldiers and other allies played a huge part. Go forward 60 years to Iraq, you hear the American posters, "we kicked Iraq's ass" etc..? ?It's the British soldiers that are in the shit storm there, stationed in the worst area's. Give your Allies the respect they deserve...PLEASE

who wasn't giving them respect?? i mentioned in a previous post how casulties for both US AND british troops would have been high if the war in the pacific had continued.? The war in the pacific was largely fought by the US though...

60 years from now i doubt ANYONE will be saying the US kicked any ass at all in Iraq.? we'll probably not want to talk about it at all to be honest.? it'll be a black mark on our history for decades to come.? its a disgrace.

I agree 100% with your 60 year comment.  It will be looked at along the lines of veitnam.

[meanmachine73]

The pictures show a harsh warning for the future should the current political climate not change. The Hiroshima bomb whilst being absolutely devestating is tiny compared to Nuclear warheads from within the UK, USA, Russia, China, Korea etc.

On a side note, to the American posters, (USA being a country I love, visit 3/4 times a yr) The USA didn't win WW2 on it's own. The British soldiers and other allies played a huge part. Go forward 60 years to Iraq, you hear the American posters, "we kicked Iraq's ass" etc..? ?It's the British soldiers that are in the shit storm there, stationed in the worst area's. Give your Allies the respect they deserve...PLEASE

who wasn't giving them respect?? i mentioned in a previous post how casulties for both US AND british troops would have been high if the war in the pacific had continued.? The war in the pacific was largely fought by the US though...

60 years from now i doubt ANYONE will be saying the US kicked any ass at all in Iraq.? we'll probably not want to talk about it at all to be honest.? it'll be a black mark on our history for decades to come.? its a disgrace.

I respect your reply 100%. However as I am sure you can appreciate your views on the coalition both past and present are not held as the majority of other somewhat naive Americans. Again no offence meant, it's simply my opinion for what it's worth.

If you read the posts on the forum where the Pics are hosted, who will read some of the posts and be as ashamed as I am.

I think that anyone reading this topic and veiwed the hosted pictures will have no doubt that unless the world's leaders can focus their minds for the immediate future, there are some serious problems around the corner.

[The Dog]

The pictures show a harsh warning for the future should the current political climate not change. The Hiroshima bomb whilst being absolutely devestating is tiny compared to Nuclear warheads from within the UK, USA, Russia, China, Korea etc.

On a side note, to the American posters, (USA being a country I love, visit 3/4 times a yr) The USA didn't win WW2 on it's own. The British soldiers and other allies played a huge part. Go forward 60 years to Iraq, you hear the American posters, "we kicked Iraq's ass" etc..   It's the British soldiers that are in the shit storm there, stationed in the worst area's. Give your Allies the respect they deserve...PLEASE

who wasn't giving them respect?  i mentioned in a previous post how casulties for both US AND british troops would have been high if the war in the pacific had continued.  The war in the pacific was largely fought by the US though...

60 years from now i doubt ANYONE will be saying the US kicked any ass at all in Iraq.  we'll probably not want to talk about it at all to be honest.  it'll be a black mark on our history for decades to come.  its a disgrace.

I respect your reply 100%. However as I am sure you can appreciate your views on the coalition both past and present are not held as the majority of other somewhat naive Americans. Again no offence meant, it's simply my opinion for what it's worth.

No offence taken, there are ignorant people in every country/society.  I know one Parisian in particular who falls under that category 

Agreed, the world is heading for one major shit storm