2012 US Presidential Election.

[cineater]

Just curious, what does the rest of the world think of our elected officials and who are they wanting to win?

Romney is nice but not that intelligent. Obama is Obama, nothing too spectacular, but a safe option.

The main issue is the money spent on the election, 2 billion dollars?. It is quite disgusting.

Stimulates the economy.

[One.In.A.Million]

Just curious, what does the rest of the world think of our elected officials and who are they wanting to win?

Romney is nice but not that intelligent. Obama is Obama, nothing too spectacular, but a safe option.

The main issue is the money spent on the election, 2 billion dollars?. It is quite disgusting.

I like how Obama has performed during his term in office, in my view he has been a brilliant president. He represents forward thinking and represents everything current about the US, he just seems to have a wider understanding of world issues than Romney. And regarding Romney, he just seems like a typical Republican, and if anything I believe he would be a step back for America.

So I want Obama to win his second term, and I'm from the UK. 

[Sober_times]

I know its still early but I think its starting to look like Obama's got this thing. They got to be feeling pretty confident right about now.

[cineater]

Yeah he did.  Proud to say Akins is out.

[Smoking Guns]

Motherfuck!!!!!!!

[AxlsMainMan]

Motherfuck!!!!!!!

[Dr. Blutarsky]

Save your money folks even if it doesn't not hold it's value.  You can only spend it, borrow it and print it out of thin air for so long.....Gonna be a rough ride.

[WAR41]

Save your money folks even if it doesn't not hold it's value.  You can only spend it, borrow it and print it out of thin air for so long.....Gonna be a rough ride.

Screw that, you should invest in gold, silver and copper. 

[Sober_times]

Save your money folks even if it doesn't not hold it's value.  You can only spend it, borrow it and print it out of thin air for so long.....Gonna be a rough ride.

And the overreaction begins...

[pilferk]

These election results spell "problem" for the Republican party.

Here's the problem:

Demographically, they can not win a national election, going forward, with the social policies and positions they're adopting.  Reportedly, they won the White vote by 20 points and the white male vote by closer to 30+.  There were models that showed they might be able to squeak this one out, but the way the demos are changing in our country...it would likely have been the last one.  And..they didn't win it.

And they lost just about every battleground state (pending Florida's results..though it looks likely that will end up blue).  Largely, that's because of the minority vote and the women's vote.  It doesn't look like the Repubs can blame "historic" turnout this time, either.   There were roughly 20 million less votes cast this time by the looks of things (final numbers are a few days away)  Romney looks like he lost the Latino vote by near 50 points.  He lost the African American vote by near 80 points.  He lost white women by 25+.  And you see Obama winning the popular vote by 2 million-ish votes, or about 2 points.

Ponder this: The Repubs have lost the popular vote 5 of the past 6 elections....with 2004 being the only exception.  I know...Electoral College.  But it's still indicative of a larger issue for the Repubs, IMHO.

Their conundrum is how they make substantive changes that win them national elections...but continue to support their socially conservative base so they can win the Senate and House elections...especially in the stalwart Red states.

Senate stays in Dem hands too (something you would have thought impossible after the mid-terms). House stays with Repubs...not sure if the Dems picked up any seats or not.  I haven't seen a final-final tally.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

Save your money folks even if it doesn't not hold it's value.  You can only spend it, borrow it and print it out of thin air for so long.....Gonna be a rough ride.

And the overreaction begins...

It is not an overreaction.

We are printing money out of thin air and devaluing it. Not exactly sound fiscal policy.

And now it will continue since we are keeping the same administration that is not addressing the debt and the fucked up monetary policy Bernanke & the Fed is following.

[cineater]

World ends Dec. 21, 2012.

[WAR41]

At least I'll be in Hawaii on Dec 21.  Not a bad place to watch the world end. 

I don't think the Republicans need to change their stance on any social issues (though I think they should), but unfortunately they just have to hope that the economy truly tanks for the next 4 years.  At some point social issues have got to be pushed aside by those who lean to the left and the financial future of the country and their children must take priority.  And whether you agree with the Republican's stance of fiscal issues really doesn't matter, because if the Democrats continue to struggle the people will (hopefully) look elsewhere.  I just hope that by the end of his second term that he is not preaching that people who make $100K are considered 'rich' and should be taxed more than the rest.   

[pilferk]

At least I'll be in Hawaii on Dec 21.  Not a bad place to watch the world end. 

I don't think the Republicans need to change their stance on any social issues (though I think they should), but unfortunately they just have to hope that the economy truly tanks for the next 4 years.  At some point social issues have got to be pushed aside by those who lean to the left and the financial future of the country and their children must take priority.  And whether you agree with the Republican's stance of fiscal issues really doesn't matter, because if the Democrats continue to struggle the people will (hopefully) look elsewhere.  I just hope that by the end of his second term that he is not preaching that people who make $100K are considered 'rich' and should be taxed more than the rest.   

I'm hearing this from many Repubs and Conservatives today, too.

Which means...they're not looking at the actual demographic results.  And one wonders how many times they'll continue to ignore what the data is telling them...much like they ignored the polling data going into yesterday, or, for quite awhile, the obvious call of Ohio for the president.  I watched Karl Rove RANT against the call and demand FoxNews (who, themselves, called it) recant the call.  Seriously, this is starting to become a trend..and it, too, doesn't bode well for the Repubs.  SOMEBODY in that party (Christie, maybe) needs to give everyone a reality check.

The problem is this:  The assertion that, eventually, the economy will win out (or, rather, cause the Repub candidate to win) is simply not true. That's largely the point.  And you have no further to look than this election to see it borne out.  Unemployment around 8%, slow economic growth across the board, and a fiscal cliff waiting in the wings.  The economic indicators COULD be more dire (as they were in 2008)...but not much.

And yet....while most voters said the economy was their "most important issue", and a majority of voters said they thought Romney would be good for the economy....look who got elected. Look who won the popular vote.  And Obama got elected, largely, because of the minority and women's vote.  That's not conjecture.  It's just  true.  That voting block is showing (again) that they are NOT going to vote for a party...PERIOD...who are that out of tune with the social issues those voting blocks care about.  They're just not.  Which means Repubs are going to HAVE to convince thos voting blocks to vote Repub somehow, or fade into irrelevance.  The economy, at this point, isn't enough.


At this point, if your best hope to get elected is for the country to completely tank, economically...something non-partisan economists don't think is likely to happen at this point...you are a party in trouble.  You have to find ways to win elections when the country is NOT in crisis.  The Repubs haven't been able to get elected the past 2 times when the country HAS been in crisis.  They've one ONE popular vote in 6 tries.

[WAR41]

At least I'll be in Hawaii on Dec 21.  Not a bad place to watch the world end. 

I don't think the Republicans need to change their stance on any social issues (though I think they should), but unfortunately they just have to hope that the economy truly tanks for the next 4 years.  At some point social issues have got to be pushed aside by those who lean to the left and the financial future of the country and their children must take priority.  And whether you agree with the Republican's stance of fiscal issues really doesn't matter, because if the Democrats continue to struggle the people will (hopefully) look elsewhere.  I just hope that by the end of his second term that he is not preaching that people who make $100K are considered 'rich' and should be taxed more than the rest.   

I'm hearing this from many Repubs and Conservatives today, too.

Which means...they're not looking at the actual demographic results.  And one wonders how many times they'll continue to ignore what the data is telling them...much like they ignored the polling data going into yesterday, or, for quite awhile, the obvious call of Ohio for the president.  I watched Karl Rove RANT against the call and demand FoxNews (who, themselves, called it) recant the call.  Seriously, this is starting to become a trend..and it, too, doesn't bode well for the Repubs.  SOMEBODY in that party (Christie, maybe) needs to give everyone a reality check.

The problem is this:  The assertion that, eventually, the economy will win out (or, rather, cause the Repub candidate to win) is simply not true. That's largely the point.  And you have no further to look than this election to see it borne out.  Unemployment around 8%, slow economic growth across the board, and a fiscal cliff waiting in the wings.  The economic indicators COULD be more dire (as they were in 2008)...but not much.

And yet....while most voters said the economy was their "most important issue", and a majority of voters said they thought Romney would be good for the economy....look who got elected. Look who won the popular vote.  And Obama got elected, largely, because of the minority and women's vote.  That's not conjecture.  It's just  true.  That voting block is showing (again) that they are NOT going to vote for a party...PERIOD...who are that out of tune with the social issues those voting blocks care about.  They're just not.  Which means Repubs are going to HAVE to convince thos voting blocks to vote Repub somehow, or fade into irrelevance.  The economy, at this point, isn't enough.


At this point, if your best hope to get elected is for the country to completely tank, economically...something non-partisan economists don't think is likely to happen at this point...you are a party in trouble.  You have to find ways to win elections when the country is NOT in crisis.  The Repubs haven't been able to get elected the past 2 times when the country HAS been in crisis.  They've one ONE popular vote in 6 tries.

Yeah I mentioned that I think they should change their stance on social issues.  To me its incredibly frustrating that this race may have been lost because of the right's stance on issues like abortion.  Those laws will never change and the fact that abortion is still a huge social issue (on both sides) is baffling to me. 

I think the problem is that so many people are turned off when they hear numbers.  When you talk about a country that is trillions of dollars in debt, nobody really understands what exactly that means because we have not seen the consequences of it.  The debt has to stop at some point, right?  It HAS to stop.  I am not saying we'll ever have a balanced budget or a surplus anytime soon, but fiscal conservatism has to take over soon.  The silver lining in this is that it really does set up Chris Christie for a run in 2016. 

And you mention that Obama won because of women and minorities.  The minority vote does not surprise me one bit.  If you looked at his Gallup Poll approval ratings among minorities throughout his first term I don't think they ever fell below 88% among African Americans, where among other groups it was notably lower.  I glanced at past presidents minority approval ratings and it was nowhere near those heights.  Minorities predominantly voted based on skin color and nothing more which is very sad. 

Anyways, I am curious to see what happens.  I am not as annoyed as I was in 2008, but I am much more interested in the next 4 years than I was in 2008. 

Oh and I am very disappointed that Gary Johnson only got 1% of the vote.  He deserved more than that. 

[pilferk]

Yeah I mentioned that I think they should change their stance on social issues.  To me its incredibly frustrating that this race may have been lost because of the right's stance on issues like abortion.  Those laws will never change and the fact that abortion is still a huge social issue (on both sides) is baffling to me. 

Because the right makes it an issue.  Or, rather, they make extreme comments (Aiken, Murdouch) that bring it to the forefront...and you have a presidential candidate who says he would prefer to appoint SC Justices that would overturn Roe v Wade.  You SAY that those laws will never be overturned...but I'm not sure that's the case right now.  Whoever won last night would likely get to appoint 1 to 3 SCJ's to lifetime terms.  Romney made it a point to say that he'd use RvW as a litmus test for appointees.  Not smart, all things considered.

Their are other issues, too.  Immigration, for example.   Equal pay for women in the workplace.  There are others that cause those demographic voting blocks effected by the Repubs stances to get pushed away.

They can not win by catering to the 1800's electorate (white male landowners).  They're going to have to shift to positions that cater to the 2012 electorate.  Or they're going to continue to lose national elections.

I think the problem is that so many people are turned off when they hear numbers.  When you talk about a country that is trillions of dollars in debt, nobody really understands what exactly that means because we have not seen the consequences of it.  The debt has to stop at some point, right?  It HAS to stop.  I am not saying we'll ever have a balanced budget or a surplus anytime soon, but fiscal conservatism has to take over soon.  The silver lining in this is that it really does set up Chris Christie for a run in 2016. 

The problem is this: The Repubs, for their last 3 presidencies, have spent just as much (if not more) than the Dems, recently.  There really is NO TRUE fiscal conservative (except, maybe, Christie) at the forefront of the Repub party.  Neocon econ is NOT true fiscal conservativism.  Cutting taxes for big business and hoping they pass it down is NOT true fiscal conservativism.  If the Repubs would return to Regan era economic philosophy...and not the experimental stuff he and Bush I abandoned because it didn't work...they might make some sense

Remember...CLINTON balanced the budget.  A democrat did what the Repubs had been screaming about since the 50's.  So...the Repubs abandoned the cause because it hurt them, politically.  It was also on the Repubs watch where a budget surplus (not a debt surplus, obviously) turned into another budget deficit.   THAT'S the problem, in a nutshell.  Both sides spend like drunken sailors.

And you mention that Obama won because of women and minorities.  The minority vote does not surprise me one bit.  If you looked at his Gallup Poll approval ratings among minorities throughout his first term I don't think they ever fell below 88% among African Americans, where among other groups it was notably lower.  I glanced at past presidents minority approval ratings and it was nowhere near those heights.  Minorities predominantly voted based on skin color and nothing more which is very sad. 

I disagree.  They voted for the guy who supports policies on things like immigration and social safety net that are in line with their own best interests. If you look at Obama's policy through the first term..you have the dream act,  extension of unemployment benefits, an end to 2 wars (take a look at the demos of those serving on the front lines in our armed services), and a huge healthcare initiative that will ensure those living in poverty, or near poverty, will have insurance.  Those are ALL issues that effect the minority community in larger numbers than the rest of the electorate. It WASN'T, IMHO, about skin color.  That's my point.  The Repubs don't need to simply run a minority with the same platform they run now.  They have to adopt a platform that is more minority friendly.  Or lose national elections.

Anyways, I am curious to see what happens.  I am not as annoyed as I was in 2008, but I am much more interested in the next 4 years than I was in 2008. 

Oh and I am very disappointed that Gary Johnson only got 1% of the vote.  He deserved more than that. 

I voted for Johnson, and...I agree.  I would like to have seen him get more than 1%.  Given how the 2 parties lock out the other, "independant" parties...I'm not shocked.  Disappointed, but not shocked.

[Sober_times]

Yeah I mentioned that I think they should change their stance on social issues.  To me its incredibly frustrating that this race may have been lost because of the right's stance on issues like abortion.  Those laws will never change and the fact that abortion is still a huge social issue (on both sides) is baffling to me. 

I think the problem is that so many people are turned off when they hear numbers.  When you talk about a country that is trillions of dollars in debt, nobody really understands what exactly that means because we have not seen the consequences of it.  The debt has to stop at some point, right?  It HAS to stop.  I am not saying we'll ever have a balanced budget or a surplus anytime soon, but fiscal conservatism has to take over soon.  The silver lining in this is that it really does set up Chris Christie for a run in 2016. 

And you mention that Obama won because of women and minorities.  The minority vote does not surprise me one bit.  If you looked at his Gallup Poll approval ratings among minorities throughout his first term I don't think they ever fell below 88% among African Americans, where among other groups it was notably lower.  I glanced at past presidents minority approval ratings and it was nowhere near those heights.  Minorities predominantly voted based on skin color and nothing more which is very sad. 

Anyways, I am curious to see what happens.  I am not as annoyed as I was in 2008, but I am much more interested in the next 4 years than I was in 2008. 

Oh and I am very disappointed that Gary Johnson only got 1% of the vote.  He deserved more than that. 

I take offense that you infer people voted for Obama because they don't understand trillion dollar debts. Or that social issues only is what cost the Republicans the election.

People believed Obama when he says were moving in the right direction and evidence backs him up and points to the economy being on the rise.

You infer that minorities voted because of the color of their skin. Maybe they voted because of so many national candidates saying thats why they vote. Maybe they voted because they don't like seeing a black guy called a racist by white people on fox news. Maybe they voted because their sick tired of being called illegals who need to go back to mexico. Maybe they are sick of people telling them all they want to do is suck on the government tit.

Or Maybe they voted because they worked in Ohio and kept their job when Obama bailed out the auto industry. Maybe they like his health care reform. Maybe they actually look at Europe and realize massive austerity isn't having a positive effect. Maybe they voted because they blame republicans for this massive financial breakdown in 08 and don't believe 4 years is long enough to fix this mess.

Republicans continue to believe that Obama got the minority vote this time and last time but they still don't think the democrats will pick up next time. They don't think minorities or women are smart enough to follow issues.. They continue to dumb down both groups and don't believe these groups will respond.

4 years ago we elected a president. The next day wacked out republicans said the world is going to end and the country is going to shit. We are better off than we were four years ago and we'll be better off 4 years from now.

[cineater]

And the stock market nose dives.  Saw that one coming, give it a week.

So I'm voting for the New Jersey Governor next time.  When asked why Romney lost, "he didn't get enough votes".  I love that guy. 

Think we need a GNR concert at Red Rocks in Colorado. 

[westcoast_junkie]

Congrats!

Let's hope it turns out good, now that Obama don't have any re-elections to worry about.

Since this thread probably soon comes to an end, I have to say it's been interesting to read much of the stuff you've put out out here. Both from democrats and anti-democrats.

And I have to say it's weird that the economy have overshadowed many other things in this election (how many serving in jail, weapon-laws etc).

[LunsJail]

  Minorities predominantly voted based on skin color and nothing more which is very sad. 

What is your definition of minorities? You do realize that caucasian births in the U.S. have now been surpassed by everything else. Some people may think this is an abomination but it's a fact.

It annoys me when I hear that blacks just voted for Obama based on skin color. I live in a more rural area and can tell you just as many whites voted against him because of skin color. The covert (and overt) racism that still exists in our country is pretty amazing, but I think it is changing.

Look at some numbers (ballpark) on how people voted:
African Americans - about 85-15 Obama
Latinos - about 75-25 Obama
Women - about 67-33 Obama

So Romney basically got pummeled in every category besides white males. Republicans won the popular vote in 1 out of the last 6 presidential elections. As long as the Republican base continues to believe that the above groups are uniformed voters who don't care about trillion dollar debts, etc. they will continue to lose national elections. Simple as that.