Here Today... Gone To Hell!

We should have seen this coming.

http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=168895

This is from a Norwegian News paper.

It starts like this: " Today, March 6th, the arrival of the new Guns N Roses album, Chinese Democracy, is finaly here. Yeah Right! "
and from there is alot of bashing and attacks on Axl and the new GnR album. There are lies, and stupid speculations and twistings..? :rant:
They said Merch left the the band, because of fights..
That Axl made bandmember wait in the recordingstudio, and he never showed up.
The story about Axl drove over a bag with lots of Producers CD`s..
ETC ETC

Anyway, a plain negative article about GnR and Axl..



well, the guy who wrote this is the same man who gave Tool - Lateralus the dise 2? :hihi: So that says alot..

well, people are not happy when he's in hiding, they're not happy when he comes out of hiding, they're not happy when he releases a statement, they're not happy when the statement gets updated......wtf does everyone want from this guy????

That paper has never been known for their attention to details. It's Norway's biggest paper, but it's still a shitty paper. When I read about things I know a lot about, I've often notice that they got the details wrong or don't mention them at all. It's poor journalism. That paper has always manage to piss me off.

Isn't it obvious? People are dying to hear Chinese Democracy...  : ok:

Yeah..I mean...why would the media rip into Axl because the album wasn't released today?

Jackasses.

more free publicity for the band rather than 'dissing'.... because the record isnt out again, and the papers and media are 'dissing' AXL, then dont you think it might attract more attention and make more people want to buy this illusive record thats been in the making since the begining of time...... all the free hype and attention for a record thats not even finished, all the promoting for the record has already been done free of charge thanks to the media.........everyday we are one step closer to getting our hands on it!

I agree with you at some point, but I'll correct you: the recording is already done.? : ok:

all the free hype and attention for a record thats not even finished

yeah.......never said recording wasnt done............said it wasnt finished...ie mixing, editing etc etc..
so guess ill correct you.............!!!!  ;D, learn to read, read what it says not what you think it says

the recording is already done.  : ok:

the "free" promotion is nice at some point, but the "Axl bashing" isn't nice at all.

that's pretty clear you said recording wasn't done... and it is done. Anyway, please back on topic, if you want to talk something else you can pm me.
the "free" promotion is nice at some point, but the "Axl bashing" isn't nice at all.

sorry mate, but that has been said before....until its in your hands, don't consider it finished.

I dont think you can blame anyone for slating the band and management for yet another embarasing broken promise.

What part of...

"With that being said, this is not a promise, a lie or a guarantee, but we do wish to announce a tentative release date of March 6. This is the first time we have done this publicly for this album."

Do some of you not understand?  ::)

What part of...

"With that being said, this is not a promise, a lie or a guarantee, but we do wish to announce a tentative release date of March 6. This is the first time we have done this publicly for this album."

Do some of you not understand?? ::)

Yes, the album's not out, and its unfortunate, but he never guaranteed that we would see it today - so get off of his ass.

If we are delayed for unseen reasons, you also will be notified as soon as possible in regard to a new date, and the album will be released as shortly thereafter as is possible.

Ok...what about this part?

If we are delayed for unseen reasons, you also will be notified as soon as possible in regard to a new date, and the album will be released as shortly thereafter as is possible.

I know.  I know.  It doesn't really say that we will be notified by March 6th in regards to a new date specifically, but it sort of makes it seem that way.  It would be nice to get a REAL update today for us and for the press.

Quote from: Danny on Today at 10:42:04 AM
Ok...what about this part?

If we are delayed for unseen reasons, you also will be notified as soon as possible in regard to a new date, and the album will be released as shortly thereafter as is possible.

I know.  I know.  It doesn't really say that we will be notified by March 6th in regards to a new date specifically, but it sort of makes it seem that way.  It would be nice to get a REAL update today for us and for the press.

we were notified by Del James and confirmed by bumblefoot.

Ok...what about this part?

If we are delayed for unseen reasons, you also will be notified as soon as possible in regard to a new date, and the album will be released as shortly thereafter as is possible.

I know.  I know.  It doesn't really say that we will be notified by March 6th in regards to a new date specifically, but it sort of makes it seem that way.  It would be nice to get a REAL update today for us and for the press.

We were?  Really?  So what was the new release date that Del James and Bumblefoot gave us?

We were?? Really?? So what was the new release date that Del James and Bumblefoot gave us?

Quote from: Danny on Today at 10:42:04 AM
Ok...what about this part?

If we are delayed for unseen reasons, you also will be notified as soon as possible in regard to a new date, and the album will be released as shortly thereafter as is possible.

I know. ?I know. ?It doesn't really say that we will be notified by March 6th in regards to a new date specifically, but it sort of makes it seem that way. ?It would be nice to get a REAL update today for us and for the press.


"There is no official release date, as the band is currently mixing, but after some delays and scheduling difficulties, things appear to be moving along.

Take care,
Del James"


You were saying? We received an update, as promised. Just because you don't like what it said doesn't mean that it doesn't count.

The new release date is that there currently isn't one. Now get the fuck over yourself - alright?

Quote from: BurningHills on Today at 10:48:32 AM
The new release date is that there currently isn't one. Now get the fuck over yourself - alright?

they will never be happy... Axl said we would be notified if something wrong happen. We were notified and people still complain. Poor Axl...

no promise has been broken whatsoever.

Quote from: AL1978 on Today at 10:29:33 AM
Quote from: kriss_boy on Today at 09:50:25 AM
I dont think you can blame anyone for slating the band and management for yet another embarasing broken promise.



no promise has been broken whatsoever.


How about the fact that Axl said on numerous occasions that the album would be out in 2006?

The other night on Night's With Alice Cooper he said that the biggest prank in history on the Rock and Roll Industry would be if Axl were to come out and say that there was no Chinese Democracy.  It's funny but it's beginning to feel oh-so-real!

Exactly my point.? If Axl would have really wanted to, he could have released the album by a date that he stated in 2007...March 6th or any other date he wanted to give.? If he did that (which would have been the smartest thing to do) he would easily been able to blame the 2006 thing on Merck 100%.? But he didn't.? He gave a date and he didn't live up to it (tentative or not--new release date or not) and it just makes him look like a liar.? He was given a great chance to place the past blame on Merck...and he blew it.

The other night on Night's With Alice Cooper he said that the biggest prank in history on the Rock and Roll Industry would be if Axl were to come out and say that there was no Chinese Democracy.  It's funny but it's beginning to feel oh-so-real!

Imagine this: You work on something, everything's going great, you think you'll be finished in time for a deadline you have set for yourself, you expect others to have things done in time because that's the plan. Then one day you find out that things aren't done. The things you thought were gonna be ready in time for your deadline can't get done because of various issues.

So all this time you've felt positive, optimistic and confident that you'd be able to make the deadline. Then one day you find out it's not gonna happen and it's not because of you. You could work 20 hours per day but it wouldn't make a difference because the rest of the work won't be done in time.

Then people would blame you for the delay.


How would you feel?

/jarmo

How does Axl feel?

http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=168895

This is from a Norwegian News paper.

It starts like this: " Today, March 6th, the arrival of the new Guns N Roses album, Chinese Democracy, is finaly here. Yeah Right! "
and from there is alot of bashing and attacks on Axl and the new GnR album. There are lies, and stupid speculations and twistings..? :rant:
They said Merch left the the band, because of fights..
That Axl made bandmember wait in the recordingstudio, and he never showed up.
The story about Axl drove over a bag with lots of Producers CD`s..
ETC ETC

Anyway, a plain negative article about GnR and Axl..



well, the guy who wrote this is the same man who gave Tool - Lateralus the dise 2? :hihi: So that says alot..

Imagine this: You work on something, everything's going great, you think you'll be finished in time for a deadline you have set for yourself, you expect others to have things done in time because that's the plan. Then one day you find out that things aren't done. The things you thought were gonna be ready in time for your deadline can't get done because of various issues.

So all this time you've felt positive, optimistic and confident that you'd be able to make the deadline. Then one day you find out it's not gonna happen and it's not because of you. You could work 20 hours per day but it wouldn't make a difference because the rest of the work won't be done in time.

Then people would blame you for the delay.


How would you feel?



/jarmo

*sigh*

and people wonder why axl doesnt say much?!

Imagine this: You work on something, everything's going great, you think you'll be finished in time for a deadline you have set for yourself, you expect others to have things done in time because that's the plan. Then one day you find out that things aren't done. The things you thought were gonna be ready in time for your deadline can't get done because of various issues.

So all this time you've felt positive, optimistic and confident that you'd be able to make the deadline. Then one day you find out it's not gonna happen and it's not because of you. You could work 20 hours per day but it wouldn't make a difference because the rest of the work won't be done in time.

Then people would blame you for the delay.


How would you feel?



/jarmo

I think Axl should have said nothing.

Fuck em! Take your sweet time and release it whenever you want.

Trying to give fans some encouragement/info/etc is a waste of time.

I'll be happy whenever it comes out. No skin off my nose. Hell delay it another 6 months just to piss people off. I'd find that hilarious.

@#$%Funker

Imagine this: You work on something, everything's going great, you think you'll be finished in time for a deadline you have set for yourself, you expect others to have things done in time because that's the plan. Then one day you find out that things aren't done. The things you thought were gonna be ready in time for your deadline can't get done because of various issues.

So all this time you've felt positive, optimistic and confident that you'd be able to make the deadline. Then one day you find out it's not gonna happen and it's not because of you. You could work 20 hours per day but it wouldn't make a difference because the rest of the work won't be done in time.

Then people would blame you for the delay.


How would you feel?



/jarmo

I aggree.  I would'nt be nearly as dissappointed if he never gave us a tentative date...or a statement at all.  Let's say that he said nothing in December.  Let's say that we found out from Merck that he was no longer managing the band and that was it.  No message from Axl, and maybe even no message from Del James.  We would all have assumed (correctly) that it was Merck who screwed everything up and now it's going to take some time to get over that and release the album properly.  Then we hear about new dates being scheduled.  We would all be getting excited about that and we would all be assuming that the prior albums are probably going to be solved soon and we may know about the album soon.  That statement was a bad, bad idea and the fact that Axl isn't owning up to it doesn't say much for his character.  It makes it look like he doesn't care.

They just don't specify what exactly they mean with scheduling conflicts and delays because that's really not important.

I'm sure people would understand if Axl popped in a gave details of delays. Mixing, mastering.....record company wants more time to plan advirtising stragedies.

*sigh*

and people wonder why axl doesnt say much?!

I aggree. ?I would'nt be nearly as dissappointed if he never gave us a tentative date...or a statement at all. ?Let's say that he said nothing in December. ?Let's say that we found out from Merck that he was no longer managing the band and that was it. ?No message from Axl, and maybe even no message from Del James. ?We would all have assumed (correctly) that it was Merck who screwed everything up and now it's going to take some time to get over that and release the album properly. ?Then we hear about new dates being scheduled. ?We would all be getting excited about that and we would all be assuming that the prior albums are probably going to be solved soon and we may know about the album soon. ?That statement was a bad, bad idea and the fact that Axl isn't owning up to it doesn't say much for his character. ?It makes it look like he doesn't care.

"today was pretty eventful. we finished finally finished mixing better (it took us a week to do it though) and then we started on IRS....however Mixing this track is going even slower ....i'll let you know next week where we stand."

Your memory is quite bad. You don't seem to remember the "demands" for an update regarding the album's 2006 release....



/jarmo

Imagine this: You work on something, everything's going great, you think you'll be finished in time for a deadline you have set for yourself, you expect others to have things done in time because that's the plan. Then one day you find out that things aren't done. The things you thought were gonna be ready in time for your deadline can't get done because of various issues.

So all this time you've felt positive, optimistic and confident that you'd be able to make the deadline. Then one day you find out it's not gonna happen and it's not because of you. You could work 20 hours per day but it wouldn't make a difference because the rest of the work won't be done in time.

Then people would blame you for the delay.


How would you feel?




/jarmo

All the answers are in Axl's letter and Del's update. All you need to do is read.

They just don't specify what exactly they mean with scheduling conflicts and delays because that's really not important.

They're only important to self-appointed judges who think it's up to them to decide is it's a valid reason for a delay or not.





Your memory is quite bad. You don't seem to remember the "demands" for an update regarding the album's 2006 release....


I knew that Axl would fucking lose anyway he handled it.

On one hand we'd have those who'd take the date as set in stone and would attack him if it didn't come out on the 6th.

If he didn't say anything, we would've had people complaining about how he can't give updates.




/jarmo

why not say something like....


just an update like that would show a bit of good faith to us fans and make us feel apreciated....at least i'd really enjoy reading updates like that and it took me about 20 seconds to type :P i think that this is what many people that complain are after too...not a exact date given...just a progress report...anyway its all well wishing...axl has never and i doubt he will ever keep us up to date in this fashion...but like i said I'd enjoy reading them emensly and i'm sure evereybody else would too.

Here's a progress report: The band is currently mixing the album. 


Your updates have one big flaw: Everything would be over-analyzed.





/jarmo

All the answers are in Axl's letter and Del's update. All you need to do is read.

They just don't specify what exactly they mean with scheduling conflicts and delays because that's really not important.

They're only important to self-appointed judges who think it's up to them to decide is it's a valid reason for a delay or not.





Your memory is quite bad. You don't seem to remember the "demands" for an update regarding the album's 2006 release....


I knew that Axl would fucking lose anyway he handled it.

On one hand we'd have those who'd take the date as set in stone and would attack him if it didn't come out on the 6th.

If he didn't say anything, we would've had people complaining about how he can't give updates.




/jarmo

Imagine this: You work on something, everything's going great, you think you'll be finished in time for a deadline you have set for yourself, you expect others to have things done in time because that's the plan. Then one day you find out that things aren't done. The things you thought were gonna be ready in time for your deadline can't get done because of various issues.

So all this time you've felt positive, optimistic and confident that you'd be able to make the deadline. Then one day you find out it's not gonna happen and it's not because of you. You could work 20 hours per day but it wouldn't make a difference because the rest of the work won't be done in time.

Then people would blame you for the delay.


How would you feel?



/jarmo

Well....
If your making real world comparisons
Well in the real world it doesn?t matter, you set a deadline you missed it. Nobody cares why its not done or who?s fault it is they are just pissed because you told them a date and you didn't hit it, you are responsible. its no ones fault but your own, you own up to the heat alot of time the reality is your peers and support lines loose confidence in you. Most likely.............your fired. That?s the real world.

How about kill all the tentitive talk and just release the damn album......is 13 years not long enough to do so ....thats long enough for a 6 year old kid to grow up learn how to play the guitar write an album release it, film a video and do a tour. But not long enough to stop all this bullshit and just release an album for a vetern rock star.....I say ...confront you fear, face your demons and stand up for yourself and put it out once and for all.

tentative ?
 ?


Main Entry: ten?ta?tive ?
Pronunciation: \ˈten-tə-tiv\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Medieval Latin tentativus, from Latin tentatus, past participle of tentare, temptare to feel, try
Date: 1626
1 : not fully worked out or developed <tentative plans>
2 : hesitant, uncertain <a tentative smile>
? tentative noun
? ten?ta?tive?ly adverb
? ten?ta?tive?ness noun

Here's a progress report: The band is currently mixing the album. :D


Your updates have one big flaw: Everything would be over-analyzed.





/jarmo

its not really a flaw though cuz each week or 2 we get a new one so we know where things stand...

We do?? That's news to me.? I've only seen two updates in the last 3 months.

How about kill all the tentitive talk and just release the damn album......is 13 years not long enough to do so ....thats long enough for a 6 year old kid to grow up learn how to play the guitar write an album release it, film a video and do a tour. But not long enough to stop all this bullshit and just release an album for a vetern rock star.....I say ...confront you fear, face your demons and stand up for yourself and put it out once and for all.

Well, you don't understand.  There are mysterious legal and scheduling issues that nobody knows anything about and probably never will.

Yeah, fans who think they are constantly being lied to by the band.

Why do they even stick around?


Everything about GN'R is so horrible: No album, the shows start late, they don't play the songs you want to hear, they don't post blogs about what they did today and everytime they say something we can be sure that it's just lies. Horrible!

 ::)

its all well wishing...axl has never and i doubt he will ever keep us up to date in this fashion...

im not to worried about it :smoking:

there so we should have known that the date was never gonna work out :P


its not really a flaw though cuz each week or 2 we get a new one so we know where things stand...besides overanalyzing real statements beats the hell outta 500 HMV dates and axl vs slash debates....or maybe its just me

Yeah, fans who think they are constantly being lied to by the band.

Why do they even stick around?


Everything about GN'R is so horrible: No album, the shows start late, they don't play the songs you want to hear, they don't post blogs about what they did today and everytime they say something we can be sure that it's just lies. Horrible!

 ::)





Maybe you got a fax with the explanation already?



The album has been recoded, mixing and mastering is left before they can set a release date and you're all crying because it's not out today (the tentative release date).

What a bunch of crybabies.





/jarmo

Yeah, fans who think they are constantly being lied to by the band.

Why do they even stick around?


Everything about GN'R is so horrible: No album, the shows start late, they don't play the songs you want to hear, they don't post blogs about what they did today and everytime they say something we can be sure that it's just lies. Horrible!

 





Quote from: Danny on Today at 12:21:19 PM
Well, you don't understand. ?There are mysterious legal and scheduling issues that nobody knows anything about and probably never will.


Maybe you got a fax with the explanation already?



The album has been recoded, mixing and mastering is left before they can set a release date and you're all crying because it's not out today (the tentative release date).

What a bunch of crybabies.





/jarmo

As for me, the only reason that March 6 is important is  because it is the anniversary of my dad's death.
Other than that, it is just another day.

When Del released that brief note, it seemed a foregone conclusion that the album wouldn't be released today, so I'm not clear on why the Axl haters are doing their war dance now.?

I would like to see more frequent updates from the GNR camp, but getting them doesn't make the album come about any quicker.

I do hope no more "tentative" dates are announced, as people want to crucify the band when there are delays.   

 I aggree.? They shouldn't have "updated" us in December or two weeks ago.

And for the record, I'm not crying that the album isn't out today.  I'm crying because it's not out today and we have no clue whatsoever as to WHY it's out today. 

Jarmo --

You shouldn't start name calling.  You may be perfectly happy to wait forever for CD and accept any excuse (or no excuse at all), but it's really not fair for you to expect every single person on the face of this Earth to mimic you're feelings on the matter.

If they want to get pissed off about it, let 'em.  It's their right.  But calling them "crybabies?"  Seriously?

It's because I see a bunch of people constantly whining about something. It might not be the same persons, but there's always something to complain about.


We all know it's being worked on. We all know it's gonna be out as soon as possible.

Still, that's not good enough....



Glad you could work in a Chris reference into this thread.? : ok:



/jarmo

what do you expect...Axl should ?have never given a release date...even though they said it was TENTATIVE everyone chooses to ignore that word and then they get pissed when the album doesnt come out....from now on Axl should treat everyone like children...when they ask "are we there yet?" he should just say "almost"

Because it's not mixed yet!

Axl said he was gonna do some minor work on it and cancelled the January shows in order to take care of that.

What some of you seem to fail to realize is that Axl did exactly what he said he was gonna do. They did the recording.


Now, in a project like this there's a bunch of people who are involved. You need to get studios booked, you need to get the right people into the studio etc etc.

All it takes is for one of the pieces to fall out and the project is halted.

It's not all about Axl.

Why can't you see that?



/jarmo

I'm not a true fan because I refuse to let other peoples' opinion about me actually affect me?

Right...


Unlike you, who only gets laughed at by your friends, I even get laughed at Internet tough guys who happen to be fellow GN'R fans.? :peace:



If Axl says the album is coming, I believe it's coming. If he says March 6th is a tentative date, I believe him.

I guess that's the difference. I don't take everything so seriously and start pointing fingers if things get pushed back from a tentative release date.




GN'R fans get laughed at by other people. But who cares?

There's people who are happy to listen to crap that the record companies and MTV force feed them. That's their choice. I guess it's more important to be accepted, and listen to the right "cool" bands, instead of listening to what you actually like and believe in.




/jarmo

im just happy the recording is actually done, thats half the battle. a release date in the coming weeks is inevitable.

No one needs to speculate.

Universal are the ones who are going to set the release date. The only way they will do that is if they have a fully mixed, fully mastered, Artwork copy of Chinese Democracy sitting on their execs desks. Once they have it in that form they will open up discussions about a release date, get their people on it and release money for marketing and promo.

The track record of this project and Axl's on off relationship with the record company have got us to where we are today. Universal have had too many promised release dates come and go for them to just set Axl a target and hope he meets it, no matter how optimistic it is. They know that Axl is a wildcard and they arent about to play another round of the game they have been playing since 96. When they cut him off financially that was the end of Universal having any confidence in Axl's ability to deliver. They are not going to do ANYTHING until they know that it is COMPLETLY done!

That is why you dont have a release date, and why we wont have a release date until everything is finished. Its being mixed, we know that, when Mixing is done we will probably get another update informing us that it is now in the hands of the record company and when they set a date Guns n Roses will tell us.

That is how it will happen

Jonx

Well...here's what I worry about now.  I can complete see a scenario where the album is turned over to the record copmany and we still don't get a date.  I can see a miscommunication with Axl and the label.  I can see one side saying "you never gave it to us" and the other side saying "yeah I did" and some big weird legal battle delaying the album's release once again.  I don't know.  I'm probably just being paranoid.

It's because I see a bunch of people constantly whining about something. It might not be the same persons, but there's always something to complain about.


We all know it's being worked on. We all know it's gonna be out as soon as possible.

Still, that's not good enough....



Glad you could work in a Chris reference into this thread.? : ok:



/jarmo

People can be frustrated if they want to.

That doesn't mean I have to put up with reading the same complaints week after week.


You're right, if being a GN'R fan is so frustrating, maybe you need something else to occupy your time for a while?

Like Chris Pitman's solo career......




/jarmo

People can be frustrated if they want to.

That doesn't mean I have to put up with reading the same complaints week after week.


You're right, if being a GN'R fan is so frustrating, maybe you need something else to occupy your time for a while?

Like Chris Pitman's solo career......




/jarmo

why not say something like....


just an update like that would show a bit of good faith to us fans and make us feel apreciated....at least i'd really enjoy reading updates like that and it took me about 20 seconds to type :P i think that this is what many people that complain are after too...not a exact date given...just a progress report...anyway its all well wishing...axl has never and i doubt he will ever keep us up to date in this fashion...but like i said I'd enjoy reading them emensly and i'm sure evereybody else would too.

You can read a lot of crap on the Internet.

Anybody can post a blog claiming they know something.

Then it ends up in a printed paper and people think it's the truth.

/jarmo

It's perfectly normal for people to be upset. ?But, I don't see the point in coming here to bitch about things. ?Do you find it cathartic?
 

Only thing about believing Axl when he says it's coming is, he has been saying it's coming for years and years. ? I guess it will come sometime while we are alive...LOL

I understand your point Freedom78, as it was never stated as THE date, but then it again it wasn't "anybody can post a blog claiming they know something" unless you consider Axl anybody?

Fair enough. I wasn't referring to the source (Axl) as much as to the basic idea that certain things get twisted very easily, and it went from a "tentative" date, which Axl said wasn't a promise, to "THE" date, according to over-excitable news outlets (at first) and GNR hating news outlets, who want to bash the band for not living up to the release date (more recently).

For example, look at that story from the Houston Chronicle, talked about on here the other day:

http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?topic=43912.0

It doesn't note that the band was shooting for that date, or that it was tentative...only that it was a release date. It also neglects to mention any news, such as recording being finished. I don't know the author's work, nor his biases, but I DO know that he quickly discards the word "tentative" or the idea that the tentative date was not a promise, for his own purposes, which appear to be the presentation of a bunch of other new music, being released on March 6th.

If Axl came out tomorrow and announced a new release date, "plus or minus a week," some would latch onto the date, and ignore the "plus or minus" part, because it suits their purposes to:

a) report the news, despite possible inaccuracies, as quickly as possible
b) to have an excuse to criticize those on whom they report

After this long, another month or two means little, really, except to those who make their living off of others' perceived failures. They're fucking vultures looking for a carcass, and the fact that they haven't found one doesn't prevent them from acting as if they have.

Fair enough.  I wasn't referring to the source (Axl) as much as to the basic idea that certain things get twisted very easily, and it went from a "tentative" date, which Axl said wasn't a promise, to "THE" date, according to over-excitable news outlets (at first) and GNR hating news outlets, who want to bash the band for not living up to the release date (more recently). 

For example, look at that story from the Houston Chronicle, talked about on here the other day:

http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?topic=43912.0

It doesn't note that the band was shooting for that date, or that it was tentative...only that it was a release date.  It also neglects to mention any news, such as recording being finished.  I don't know the author's work, nor his biases, but I DO know that he quickly discards the word "tentative" or the idea that the tentative date was not a promise, for his own purposes, which appear to be the presentation of a bunch of other new music, being released on March 6th.

If Axl came out tomorrow and announced a new release date, "plus or minus a week," some would latch onto the date, and ignore the "plus or minus" part, because it suits their purposes to:

a) report the news, despite possible inaccuracies, as quickly as possible
b) to have an excuse to criticize those on whom they report

After this long, another month or two means little, really, except to those who make their living off of others' perceived failures.  They're fucking vultures looking for a carcass, and the fact that they haven't found one doesn't prevent them from acting as if they have.     

Can anybody say the boy who cried wolf? :hihi:

Just because Axl used the word "tentative" doesn't make it excusable that the cd was delayed AGAIN.

Why? Its not like they didnt tell us it wasnt coming out today. If they just let March 6th come without an update or the album coming out, then maybe. But we were fully aware of the fact that the record was not going to be out today.

Just because Axl used the word "tentative" doesn't make it excusable that the cd was delayed AGAIN.

this thread is going in circles :hihi:

Sure it does...that's what tentative means!

haha technically an oval is a circle..sorta..its just squished a bit...

Soooo..... WHAT'S THE MOANING ABOUT?

Because he's a redneck from Indiana?

When was the album ever delayed. They had never set a date for the record before, this was the first time. Just because you believed in dates and shit that were made up doesnt mean that it was delayed. The album has never been delayed until now, it just hasnt been finished.

And for the record, Axl said that it wasnt a promise, a lie, or a guarantee. Maybe you should look up the word tentative.

Blabbermouth.net reports that Axl Rose has issued a new date for the release of Chinese Democracy, the long awaited followup album to Use Your Illisions I & II. ?The new release date is apparently September 17, 2007, mark it on your calenders. Insert own laughter here

Seriously.....do these people not know the meaning of "tentative" or did they just not see it ::)

Seriously.....do these people not know the meaning of "tentative" or did they just not see it ::)

You all give axl too much slack really. This album has been over due since 2000 , its been 7 years since then.  Velvet Revolver just finished mixing in less then a month , and been recording for about 6. Came off a 1 1/2 year tour and a hit single. It really shows who the hard working ones in the band where , Axl is still struggling to give us a track.

You all give axl too much slack really. This album has been over due since 2000 , its been 7 years since then.  Velvet Revolver just finished mixing in less then a month , and been recording for about 6. Came off a 1 1/2 year tour and a hit single. It really shows who the hard working ones in the band where , Axl is still struggling to give us a track.

Who needs Guns N' Roses when there's Korn, the Arcade Fire and even Notorious B.I.G. to fry up the record racks?

Axl and his motley crew were set to deliver their Chinese Democracy Tuesday (March 6), but if you actually bought that notion, shame on you for believing him for the umpteenth time. In lieu of Rose's failed Democracy, we're building a new one that endorses a set of new leaders ? well, for this week, at least ? and designing a newfangled Bill of Rights to boot. Care to vote in this new democracy? Just kindly hand over your ballot ? i.e., money ? to your favorite local record store cashier or online retail outlet.

I wish we here something directly from Axl so we can quite seeing these type of responses.  I still say it has to come out before the tour but I doubt that is possible.

cmon. I dont mind the album being late...
they can work for all eternity on it and not release it. it's their right.

but purposely lying to us is something I'm not encuraging.
everybody knew the album wasnt coming out as soon as we read the word "tentative".
and the "not a promise, guarantee or lie" part is ridicules.
if it aint a promise or a lie, than what the fuck is it?! Its nothing. might as well said june 19.2052...
it's as probably as march 6th was.

Seriously.....do these people not know the meaning of "tentative" or did they just not see it ::)

Some members in NewGnR have been in gnr for going on 10 years....is it safe to say they should know each other musically, personally and professionally?

cmon. I dont mind the album being late...
they can work for all eternity on it and not release it. it's their right.

but purposely lying to us is something I'm not encuraging.
everybody knew the album wasnt coming out as soon as we read the word "tentative".
and the "not a promise, guarantee or lie" part is ridicules.
if it aint a promise or a lie, than what the fuck is it?! Its nothing. might as well said june 19.2052...
it's as probably as march 6th was.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: Neemo on Today at 04:28:37 PM
Some members in NewGnR have been in gnr for going on 10 years....is it safe to say they should know each other musically, personally and professionally?


That's another reason I'm optimistic about CD.  If it weren't likely to ever happen, I can't imagine these great musicians sticking around, just for the Hell of it. 

I have no idea how having no album out affects ticket sales. I mean most fans are going to guns n roses to hear the classics anyways .. on top of that , the band plays 6 or more songs from democracy at almost every show.

Bleh!

I don?t think we?ve been lied on purpose. What I think is that maybe Axl gave us the March 6 date because he/the band thought that it could be released in that date and used the word "Tentative" just in case something could happen that could provoke a delay

If it was called the Chinese Democracy Tour.

It's not like GN'R is the only band touring before their new album is in the shops.

It is pretty safe to say that GNR's situation is drastically different from that of other bands doing the same thing.

Quote from: Danny on Today at 05:09:25 PM
Quote
I have no idea how having no album out affects ticket sales. I mean most fans are going to guns n roses to hear the classics anyways .. on top of that , the band plays 6 or more songs from democracy at almost every show.

Bleh!


If it was called the Chinese Democracy Tour.


Hello? They could've called it the "Escape From The Studio - part two" tour and people would've bought tickets based on the fact that it's GN'R.

It's not like GN'R is the only band touring before their new album is in the shops.

Metallica seems to do it every summer.




/jarmo

I don?t think we?ve been lied on purpose. What I think is that maybe Axl gave us the March 6 date because he/the band thought that it could be released in that date and used the word "Tentative" just in case something could happen that could provoke a delay.

how can it be different from doing the same thing?

When was the album ever delayed. They had never set a date for the record before, this was the first time. Just because you believed in dates and shit that were made up doesnt mean that it was delayed. The album has never been delayed until now, it just hasnt been finished.

And for the record, Axl said that it wasnt a promise, a lie, or a guarantee. Maybe you should look up the word tentative.

You hit the nail 100% on the head. He gets the poor press he does because he does nothing to stop it. It's like the litte kid who keeps putting his hand on the stove and complaing about getting burned when you've told him repeatedly that he wouldn't get burned anymore if he stopped putting his hand on the stove. There comes a certain point that you no longer feel bad for someone who seems to purposely sabatoge their life when there is a clear alternative that would alleviate all the stress and suffering.

I don't remember Axl complaining about bad press

Oh, I thought the conversation was about the situation now, or even the past ten years when Axl has had very little to do with the press.

Now I realise we were talking about 16 years ago when he was mad at journalists he thought abused the press coverage GNR allowed them to have, after which he stopped dealing with the press for many years.

Must be my bad.... somewhere.... 

@#$%Funker

And it's been delayed about 2 times a year, every year, since then.

 ::)

And Use Your Illusion was delayed about ten years because the first songs were started on then.....? ::)


Some people are obviously not playing attention. Have you ever heard about how artists can write songs for an album and even record them, only to decide it's not what they want to do and start all over again?

Just because the album's title was Chinese Democracy in 1999 doesn't automatically mean the tracks that appear on the album are the same ones they wrote and have been recording since 1999.




/jarmo

Wouldnt that have been a big waste?  If they recorded all that stuff, never released it and just scrapped an album or two worth of songs?

 ::)

And Use Your Illusion was delayed about ten years because the first songs were started on then.....  ::)

No?


Did you see the latest Def Leppard thing where the singer says they'll write three songs that would be played on the radio and fill the rest of the album with something that's not as good?

Just because it doesn't matter how good the rest is since it won't get played on the radio anyway and nobody cares......? ::)



/jarmo

So you dont think the stuff that they wrote during that period was strong and thats the reason for the delay?   

Why does CD have to be so great when you plan on releasing more after it?

Bud doesn't Metallica actually release albums??

Sorry, easy come back.? But I think here Jarmo you and I are starting to disagree on certain matters.? Your first analogy of working on something only for it not to be done at a desired date/time due to the obstacles put forth by others doesn't quite mesh well with this situation.? First and foremost, Axl's letter stated that there were minor complications left to be finished.? Perhaps it's a difference of perception, but recording or re-recording is not a minor complication.? When you go back to recording, that now takes you back to square one with mixing and mastering.? Axl acknowledges that it takes 8 weeks once an album is finished for it to receive a proper launch.? I can't see how it's anyone other than Axl or the band's fault for not getting this thing out close to March 6th if another month or two of recording was still required back in mid December (exceptions are given if legal or contractual negotiations were the main culprit, thus giving the band further time to record).? I'll believe Axl thought March 6th was plausible at the time he wrote his letter if he assumed that all recording and mixing (or mixing of possible singles) was to be completed by the first week of January.? If he knew that recording was still needed well into February, then Axl's letter is rendered fraudulent.? And to suggest that studio scheduling conflicts resulted in unexpected delays is reaching a tad.? Between New York City and LA, there are numerous studios the band could have used.? If you own a reputable studio and Axl asks to rent it out to put the finishing touches on one of the most anticipated albums in the last thirty years, are you really going to tell him to get in line and wait his turn?

I'm also getting a little sick of the damned if he do, damned if he don't excuse:


Here's how the band can actually gain overall fan approval: say something and actually do it.? Now a lot of people on here have dissected Axl's letter like crazy, saying he said this, he didn't say this.? Alright, fine.? But let's look at the facts.? There's now been three "Chinese Democracy World Tours" and soon a forth for an album that is still not finished and has no firm release date.? ?There have been countless instances of insinuation or direct claims about the pending release of Chinese Democracy from way back in 2001 from Axl to other band members to management.? To suggest that GNR's fan base hasn't been strung along for quite some time is without merit.? Then finally Axl gives his fans a real communication in the form of his open letter.? Some chose not to believe it from the get go, others were skeptical, and other's put their faith in Axl's words and believed despite many years of disappointment.? I was skeptical, but it was great to hear Axl at least acknowledge the album and that every effort was going to be made to get this thing out as soon as possible.? Sure we could have damned him for not giving a tentative release date just as many are damning him now for not meeting it.? But in the end, he did give a release date and it seems like we're still at the very least three months away from a plausible release date.? Having recently been exposed to the recording process and the music industry myself, I know that minor complications do not push an album's release date back by three to four months.? If you're going to live by the sword, you die by the sword.? You can't excuse yourself by saying "we can't win either way" for something that was instigated by yourself.

In the end, it's hard being a loyal fan of a group, team, or organization when, in your mind, they keep fucking you over.? As a Maple Leafs fan, I know that better than anyone.? All that said, as much grumble and crying exists here today and will continue until the album is finally out, I will never doubt the love for the band and our braid-headed hero by anyone here.? If everyone here hated the band so much, they wouldn't keep coming back and would have given up on the band a long time ago.? Like it or not Jarmo, you're providing a service that's very valuable to the band itself.? Bitching, whinning and overall complaining has served for many (and myself) as a release outlet that has allowed many of us to stay on this wild ride.? One wonders if the hardcore of us would still remain so loyal without the internet and its mechanisms for open dialogue.?

The band, this site, and certain individuals associate with the band have done some great things for us fans (most notably, the pre-sales for the New York warm up shows).? It would be unfortunate that we do not acknowledge the great things that this band has done for us.? Even though I'm not listening to Chinese Democracy today, that doesn't mean I won't be waiting at opening hours to get my hands on a copy (well, I'll probably be buying more than one).? As I write this I look up at my wall and see seven sealed Guns N' Roses LPs, two Use your Illusion Posters, and one RIAA Gold Album Award for Appetite.? I then look over to my three keyboard/synths/pianos and remember that if it was for Axl Rose sitting down and writing November Rain, my life would be very different.? So yeah I'm disappointed at Axl and the band for not living up to what they were trying to do because I too, along with many here, have a lot invested in Chinese Democracy.? But at the end of the day, I don't forget that I'm indebted to this band and will always support all efforts made by this band.

Cheers,

Andrew

dude, i didnt even read all that, but i cant fucking wait ot see what jarmo replies!? :rofl:

Bud doesn't Metallica actually release albums? 

Sorry, easy come back.  But I think here Jarmo you and I are starting to disagree on certain matters.  Your first analogy of working on something only for it not to be done at a desired date/time due to the obstacles put forth by others doesn't quite mesh well with this situation.  First and foremost, Axl's letter stated that there were minor complications left to be finished.  Perhaps it's a difference of perception, but recording or re-recording is not a minor complication.  When you go back to recording, that now takes you back to square one with mixing and mastering.  Axl acknowledges that it takes 8 weeks once an album is finished for it to receive a proper launch.  I can't see how it's anyone other than Axl or the band's fault for not getting this thing out close to March 6th if another month or two of recording was still required back in mid December (exceptions are given if legal or contractual negotiations were the main culprit, thus giving the band further time to record).  I'll believe Axl thought March 6th was plausible at the time he wrote his letter if he assumed that all recording and mixing (or mixing of possible singles) was to be completed by the first week of January.  If he knew that recording was still needed well into February, then Axl's letter is rendered fraudulent.  And to suggest that studio scheduling conflicts resulted in unexpected delays is reaching a tad.  Between New York City and LA, there are numerous studios the band could have used.  If you own a reputable studio and Axl asks to rent it out to put the finishing touches on one of the most anticipated albums in the last thirty years, are you really going to tell him to get in line and wait his turn?

I'm also getting a little sick of the damned if he do, damned if he don't excuse:


Quote from: jarmo on Today at 05:18:02 PM
On one hand we'd have those who'd take the date as set in stone and would attack him if it didn't come out on the 6th.

If he didn't say anything, we would've had people complaining about how he can't give updates.


Here's how the band can actually gain overall fan approval: say something and actually do it.  Now a lot of people on here have dissected Axl's letter like crazy, saying he said this, he didn't say this.  Alright, fine.  But let's look at the facts.  There's now been three "Chinese Democracy World Tours" and soon a forth for an album that is still not finished and has no firm release date.   There have been countless instances of insinuation or direct claims about the pending release of Chinese Democracy from way back in 2001 from Axl to other band members to management.  To suggest that GNR's fan base hasn't been strung along for quite some time is without merit.  Then finally Axl gives his fans a real communication in the form of his open letter.  Some chose not to believe it from the get go, others were skeptical, and other's put their faith in Axl's words and believed despite many years of disappointment.  I was skeptical, but it was great to hear Axl at least acknowledge the album and that every effort was going to be made to get this thing out as soon as possible.  Sure we could have damned him for not giving a tentative release date just as many are damning him now for not meeting it.  But in the end, he did give a release date and it seems like we're still at the very least three months away from a plausible release date.  Having recently been exposed to the recording process and the music industry myself, I know that minor complications do not push an album's release date back by three to four months.  If you're going to live by the sword, you die by the sword.  You can't excuse yourself by saying "we can't win either way" for something that was instigated by yourself.

In the end, it's hard being a loyal fan of a group, team, or organization when, in your mind, they keep fucking you over.  As a Maple Leafs fan, I know that better than anyone.  All that said, as much grumble and crying exists here today and will continue until the album is finally out, I will never doubt the love for the band and our braid-headed hero by anyone here.  If everyone here hated the band so much, they wouldn't keep coming back and would have given up on the band a long time ago.  Like it or not Jarmo, you're providing a service that's very valuable to the band itself.  Bitching, whinning and overall complaining has served for many (and myself) as a release outlet that has allowed many of us to stay on this wild ride.  One wonders if the hardcore of us would still remain so loyal without the internet and its mechanisms for open dialogue. 

The band, this site, and certain individuals associate with the band have done some great things for us fans (most notably, the pre-sales for the New York warm up shows).  It would be unfortunate that we do not acknowledge the great things that this band has done for us.  Even though I'm not listening to Chinese Democracy today, that doesn't mean I won't be waiting at opening hours to get my hands on a copy (well, I'll probably be buying more than one).  As I write this I look up at my wall and see seven sealed Guns N' Roses LPs, two Use your Illusion Posters, and one RIAA Gold Album Award for Appetite.  I then look over to my three keyboard/synths/pianos and remember that if it was for Axl Rose sitting down and writing November Rain, my life would be very different.  So yeah I'm disappointed at Axl and the band for not living up to what they were trying to do because I too, along with many here, have a lot invested in Chinese Democracy.  But at the end of the day, I don't forget that I'm indebted to this band and will always support all efforts made by this band.

Cheers,

Andrew

They seriously need to wrap the dam thing up and hand it in beofre they go on these tours.

People like Beta and others can pm me and say im dead wrong but enough is enough already. If you have any intention of releasing this album then do it. Otherwise just come out and say that your not. If he still wants to tour people will still go. But let the myth of CD and us the blind get off the wagon with some dignity....

As great as the past yr or 2 has been, no1 can defend Axl. He always shoots himself in the foot by opening his mouth. You cant defend someone when they say on more than one occasion that the album will no doubt be out and then not deliver. And then claim only minor details need to be worked out...instead of partying with societys elite go in the studio and bang out whatever the fuck needs to be done. Societys elite will always be there.....

Here's the problem...I'm going to make it real simple.  The band said recording is done.  Alot of people don't believe it.


It's that simple.

Here's the problem...I'm going to make it real simple.  The band said recording is done.  Alot of people don't believe it.


It's that simple.

Quote from: Danny on Today at 07:47:57 PM
Here's the problem...I'm going to make it real simple. ?The band said recording is done. ?Alot of people don't believe it.


It's that simple.



As I said, some think they're constantly being lied to by the band.

The same people who complain about the lack of updates.....



/jarmo

Here's the problem...I'm going to make it real simple.? The band said recording is done.? Alot of people don't believe it.


It's that simple.

As I'm reading this, I'm listening to Help!, Rubber Soul, Sgt Pepper, The White Album, Yellow Submarine, Abby Road, and Let It Be.? All of these albums came out within 5 years of each other.


Axl...if you're reading this...dude, it's been too long, man.

As I'm reading this, I'm listening to Help!, Rubber Soul, Sgt Pepper, The White Album, Yellow Submarine, Abby Road, and Let It Be.

As I'm reading this, I'm listening to Help!, Rubber Soul, Sgt Pepper, The White Album, Yellow Submarine, Abby Road, and Let It Be.  All of these albums came out within 5 years of each other.

But if they go on tour without any further news or a single on the radio or maybe an ad campaign started, then I think we'll have real reason to worry and bitch. Just my 2 cents.

Are they all 80 minute cds?

Did they make multiple videos for each album and tour?



Just saying, times change..... A bit!




/jarmo

Yea, times change. With todays technology its actually a lot easier to make an album, videos, and set up a tour.

Yea, times change. With todays technology its actually a lot easier to make an album, videos, and set up a tour.

Actually its very simple.? YOU choose to be a fan of this band, and if you respect Axl and the band, allow him whatever time he wishes to release this album.? ?No one is making you go to any shows on any tour.? ?No one is making you wait for an album.? ?No one is making you do anything.? Likewise,? no one can make Axl do anything.? ?Axl is an artist and I've always loved and respected him as such, and that will never change regardless of when/if the album even ever comes out.? ? We do not have the authority to make Axl's management decisions, we aren't music industry marketing professionals, and the bitching is absolutely pointless.? Like you can change anything?

I've been a fan as long as I can remember, and I stick by my band in the good times and the bad.? And frankly, seeing them 4 times in 2006 was not bad at all!? ?Being a fan of this band does take patience, but surely if you've been here this long, you know this already, right?

oh man! you are the kind of person politicians love. You get shit on repeatedly and still follow blindly. The truth is that the artist-fan relationship is a two way street, and for gnr it has been one way for over a decade.

I guess quality doesn't mean anything for you, as long as you have an album to download.

Technology doesn't create the art itself.



/jarmo

 ::)

And Use Your Illusion was delayed about ten years because the first songs were started on then.....? ::)


Some people are obviously not playing attention. Have you ever heard about how artists can write songs for an album and even record them, only to decide it's not what they want to do and start all over again?

Just because the album's title was Chinese Democracy in 1999 doesn't automatically mean the tracks that appear on the album are the same ones they wrote and have been recording since 1999.




/jarmo

And you're the kind of person who loves to point out how others are fools and you're the enlightened one?

/jarmo

jarmo, aren't you slightly off-topic?

why do you have to contribute absolutely nothing to these conversations but off-topic snarky remarks about this person/that person?

 ?i'm sorry, but for the past two weeks, this site has become nothing more than a battle ground for the most tiresome debates of who's a fan/non-fan, and whether any of us have a right to complain...and instead of helping you just antagonize and fuel the fire...

quality means a lot,but don't go saying thath the beatles didn't have to do the things that bands today have to do so they had it easier somehow to make an album, the beatles had it much harder and did it much better than most of todays bands, and in less time.

Bullshit... they got to ride on their fame from being the biggest band in the world in their early days - promotion didn't even need to happen, they had the name. They stopped TOURING - man, that's so hard to do, NOT. If you want to point out someone who did it well and quickly, look at Creedence - 3 brilliant albums in the one year.

But not everyone works that way.

well, I guess it's just getting more and more difficult for jarmo and others to defend the lack of a CD release date by now.

they ????

this is a band made up of new members in 2007 with the old members of 1985, this band hasnt did shit compared to " THEY"

oh man! you are the kind of person politicians love. You get shit on repeatedly and still follow blindly. The truth is that the artist-fan relationship is a two way street, and for gnr it has been one way for over a decade.

I dont feel shortchanged in any way.? ?I saw the band 4 times last yaer, I am happy as fuck.? ?I love all the music Axl has already given us over the years, and while I look forward to more, it in no way changes the great things he's already done and for that he has my respect.? ?

 ? ?it's not up to him to do it...he's provided a forum for people to discuss GNR-related issues...he's not the punching bag of GNR. Let Del James handle that role since he strives for the PR role so much...

 ? ?MotherGoose said it perfectly earlier on, that GNR has the worst communication with the fans...nobody would bitch and complain as much as they do now if there would be some sharing of information...
 ? ?what, GNR is mysterious? leave that adjective to discuss Buckethead, not Axl who's been parading the public scene for the past year in broad daylight.

 ? ?Has anybody woken up to the reality of the situation? I've stopped posting here mainly because there's NOTHING to talk about, except pointless and childish speculations, only to get into the most innane internet arguments that lead nowhere
...soon enough we'll discuss what BBF has for breakfast right?

 ? ?Most of the people who had something to say have either left the forum, or have stopped posting...does anyone wonder why that is? Look at the number of people who visit the forum at least...it has dropped significantly.

 ? ?I've kept quiet for a while in regards to arguing about what GNR needs to do, why it's absurd that you can't say anything negative about GNR and have 50 newbies jump on you for attacking their newfound love for the band...

 ? ?So let's not place blames on US anymore and look at the general situation...no album...no updates (because they're either too busy, it's a cool marketing strategy to keep us in suspense, etc)...no sign of Axl being that open-hearted romantic who posted that letter back in december...

and some of us get upset when the MEDIA (of all 'people') make cracks about his/GNR's credibility? this whole situation's laughable

Well put. These mother fuckers feel Axl Rose owes them something, that's all. :smoking:

Gn'R has become a very fan un-friendly band...I mean if you look at VR's website they put updates on there all the time and even show video of the rehearsing....VR fans aren't kept in the dark...and that's the attitude of alot of musicians these days is to keep in touch with the fans via the internet...we put food on their table, it's the least they can do.  Now when I say that GN'R is fan un-friendly I don't mean the individual members...I mean the organization as a whole...let Bumblefoot handle PR...then we'd feel "in-touch"  Axl needs to lose the mystery mystique of the 80's Rock Star...it doesn't exist anymore!

Exactly. The only people from what I can see that Axl owes anything to, is Universal. The folks there can bitch all they want as its their money that is wrapped up in it, I haven't paid a dime for CD and the money I paid for the shows was money well spent and worth every penny. :smoking:



Ugh. Gn'R is not fucking Velvet Revolver (and thank god). I'm glad VR is your ideal band that does things just the way you like it. Actually no I don't fucking care, try the VR section.

That is a great post.

Ileave for weeks at a time, come back and there is still nothing to talk about.

And the newbs part of your post is right on.

I'm not gonna get into an argument with Jarmo, I've been down that road before and it's a no-win. But, I can see why people want to question things. Blindly following something or someone without thinking for yourself is basically a cult, but GNR communicated to us what's going on this time. Sure, you may think it should be out by now, but it's supposedly being finished. And that's progress, people.

To bring it back to the point of this thread, it's very difficult to be objective when it comes to a band like Guns N' Roses. So many of us have been following this band for so long that it's tough to retain any perspective. Journalists, on the other hand, have nothing invested in this band, and hence you'll get articles that provoked this thread. It's an easy story, a band that has produced no studio material in over 15 years has once again delayed its album. If you were a journalist and your editor asked you to write about the new album from the Bangles that's delayed once again, is anyone on here going to give it the proper respect its due? You might say, well, the Bangles aren't Guns N' Roses and you wouldn't get an argument from me on that. But to many part-time journalists, that's not the case.

As this applies to this forum and the GNR community, the lesson is this: It's great being a fan, but a little objectivity never hurt anyone. If Axl or the band fucks up, I'll objectively say so, but my disapproval does not reflect my fondness for the band and its music. I choose to be a fan of this band, but I also choose to express my skepticism or disappointment when I feel the band has not acted in a fair manner to me as a fan. You may disagree or you might agree. And isn't that the purpose of a place like this?

Cheers,

Andrew

Blindly following something or someone without thinking for yourself is basically a cult, but GNR communicated to us what's going on this time.

Sure, you may think it should be out by now, but it's supposedly being finished. And that's progress, people.

I agree, but I dont see any of that here.? ?I wouldn't blindly follow anything Axl did.? ?If I dont like something, I'll say it.? ?

Actually its very simple.  YOU choose to be a fan of this band, and if you respect Axl and the band, allow him whatever time he wishes to release this album.   No one is making you go to any shows on any tour.   No one is making you wait for an album.   No one is making you do anything.  Likewise,  no one can make Axl do anything.   Axl is an artist and I've always loved and respected him as such, and that will never change regardless of when/if the album even ever comes out.    We do not have the authority to make Axl's management decisions, we aren't music industry marketing professionals, and the bitching is absolutely pointless.  Like you can change anything?

I've been a fan as long as I can remember, and I stick by my band in the good times and the bad.  And frankly, seeing them 4 times in 2006 was not bad at all!   Being a fan of this band does take patience, but surely if you've been here this long, you know this already, right?

jarmo, aren't you slightly off-topic?

why do you have to contribute absolutely nothing to these conversations but off-topic snarky remarks about this person/that person?

  i'm sorry, but for the past two weeks, this site has become nothing more than a battle ground for the most tiresome debates of who's a fan/non-fan, and whether any of us have a right to complain...and instead of helping you just antagonize and fuel the fire...

Off topic? The guy was attacking somebody because he had a different opinion.

How lame is that?


And where the hell do you people get the "no updates" crap from?

I'll repeat it again:

December: Axl says they need to do some minor work on album.
January: That work is being done
February: It's announced on the band's official site that the recording is done and mixing is under way, but that since the album isn't ready for release there's no release date for it.


Until the album is mixed and mastered, there's no way they're gonna set a release date to keep you guys happy. It would make no sense.

 What is the real problem? I'm confused.

Seriously, you can't be upset because the album wasn't released on its tentative release date.

Even the UYI albums were pushed back a while. Remember? One guy mixed it and they weren't happy with the result so Bill Price was hired to mix it.



Lack of communication? There's no news on the album, it's being mixed. Do you need to be re-assured every other week that the mixing is still going on?

Question: What kind of fucking updates do you want at this point?




/jarmo

Yeah, it's the straw that broke the camels back for me. Everyone has a breaking point where blind faith takes a backseat to clarity and reality and sees people/ a situation for who/what they really are.

Been a big fan since the beginning but shall no longer visit in protest.

I doubt that Axl can pull it off, writing good music without the old boys, that is why album is constantly delayed.
If he wasn't a petulant angry little bottle thrower and a real man who can see the world from other peoples point of view they might still be around and the greatest rock band would still exist today.

The greatest band with the greatest music led by the greatest washed up has-been who lost the passion to write
'great' rock music well over a decade ago.

I'll just play Appetite and Illusions and reminisce about the good old days...

Off topic? The guy was attacking somebody because he had a different opinion.

How lame is that?


And where the hell do you people get the "no updates" crap from?

I'll repeat it again:

December: Axl says they need to do some minor work on album.
January: That work is being done
February: It's announced on the band's official site that the recording is done and mixing is under way, but that since the album isn't ready for release there's no release date for it.


Until the album is mixed and mastered, there's no way they're gonna set a release date to keep you guys happy. It would make no sense.

 What is the real problem? I'm confused.

Seriously, you can't be upset because the album wasn't released on its tentative release date.

Even the UYI albums were pushed back a while. Remember? One guy mixed it and they weren't happy with the result so Bill Price was hired to mix it.



Lack of communication? There's no news on the album, it's being mixed. Do you need to be re-assured every other week that the mixing is still going on?

Question: What kind of fucking updates do you want at this point?




/jarmo

How is so much emotion being poured out on a date we knew was a no-go weeks ago?

Yeah, it's the straw that broke the camels back for me. Everyone has a breaking point where blind faith takes a backseat to clarity and reality and sees people/ a situation for who/what they really are.

Been a big fan since the beginning but shall no longer visit in protest.

I doubt that Axl can pull it off, writing good music without the old boys, that is why album is constantly delayed.
If he wasn't a petulant angry little bottle thrower and a real man who can see the world from other peoples point of view they might still be around and the greatest rock band would still exist today.

The greatest band with the greatest music led by the greatest washed up has-been who lost the passion to write
'great' rock music well over a decade ago.

I'll just play Appetite and Illusions and reminisce about the good old days...

Jarmo, it's laughable that you would compare the Chinese Democracy situation with any album that came out in a reasonably timely fashion (UYI did, especially considering it was 2 albums).

Yeah, I know. Trying to explain something and asking a simple question is laughable but comparing GN'R to Beatles by saying they released multiple albums, in a whole different era, in just a few years is quite all right....

I see.




/jarmo

Question: What kind of fucking updates do you want at this point?

/jarmo

EFISH, you talking to me? Cuz I'm not complaining at all. I'm merely pointing out the other side of things in a logical fashion. I personally don't really care one way or another at this point. When it comes out, it comes out. End of story.

Not at all. I was just talking to everyone in this thread in general who was complaining about the record not being out, Axl being scared to release it, etc...

  quick question: what would've happened (by March 6th) if you or Mysteron (or whoever sent that request) didn't ask Del/Beta/Axl for an update? 

I didn't. Thanks for putting words in my mouth. I'm just saying that Chinese Democracy is far different than UYI or most of the albums out there in terms of the timeline. It's just an observation. It's to the point where a lot of people EXPECT delays rather than an actual release. That's different than most albums.

quick question: what would've happened (by March 6th) if you or Mysteron (or whoever sent that request) didn't ask Del/Beta/Axl for an update? 

 If you're just here to complain, then go get a hobby or something and come back when the album is gonna come out.

    *sigh*...aaand we're back to our regularly scheduled program... : ok:

If people expected the tentative release date to be tentative and not final, we wouldn't have all these upset fan posting in this thread would we?

But the fact is, people do love to compare it to other albums and compare GN'R to other bands.




Judging by the letter, I think they would've given an update as soon as they had a firm release date or maybe when March 6th wasn't a possibility.

As it was pointed out in this thread, I had nothing to do with Del's update.


/jarmo

Given the volatile mindset of many GN'R fans, it probably would have been best if Axl hadn't even said anything about a tentative release date because like you said, most either didn't comprehend the meaning of "tentative" or simply got too excited over the March 6th date.

Given the volatile mindset of many GN'R fans, it probably would have been best if Axl hadn't even said anything about a tentative release date because like you said, most either didn't comprehend the meaning of "tentative" or simply got too excited over the March 6th date.

Question: What kind of fucking updates do you want at this point?

/jarmo

He didn't have much of a choice at the time. Giving an early 07 date was as good a way to get fans to forget about the disappointment of the 06 guarantee as possible. Had his statement in December said that not only was the album not coming out in 06 as promised, but that there was no timeline in sight for release there would have been a bloodbath of anger/frustration on this board. At least giving some semblance of a date (even if we knew it was not going to happen) gave some sort of hope we could be near the end of the line with this, and in turn picked up the morale of the board temporarily.

Gotta agree with Jarmo on this. GNR is not gonna hold your fucking hand as you wait, consoling you with reassuring words every time you get upset. They have better things to worry about than react to the whims and concerns of a relatively few number of fans on an Internet fan site. The fact that they even consider to visit here occasionally should be considered an incredible gesture.

You got your update, now wait for the next one.

Gotta agree with Jarmo on this. GNR is not gonna hold your fucking hand as you wait, consoling you with reassuring words every time you get upset. They have better things to worry about than react to the whims and concerns of a relatively few number of fans on an Internet fan site. The fact that they even consider to visit here occasionally should be considered an incredible gesture.

You got your update, now wait for the next one.

he shouldntve issued that date, tentative or not. But to be fair he was gonna lose either way, as at that time, people were crying out for an update and he responded. best thing now would be no updates or just brief but factual updates such as del's recent comments. If it all goes well i believe we could be told a release date before the tour starts. IF ALL GOES WELL, THAT IS.

Off topic? The guy was attacking somebody because he had a different opinion.

How lame is that?


And where the hell do you people get the "no updates" crap from?

I'll repeat it again:

December: Axl says they need to do some minor work on album.
January: That work is being done
February: It's announced on the band's official site that the recording is done and mixing is under way, but that since the album isn't ready for release there's no release date for it.


Until the album is mixed and mastered, there's no way they're gonna set a release date to keep you guys happy. It would make no sense.

 What is the real problem? I'm confused.

Seriously, you can't be upset because the album wasn't released on its tentative release date.

Even the UYI albums were pushed back a while. Remember? One guy mixed it and they weren't happy with the result so Bill Price was hired to mix it.



Lack of communication? There's no news on the album, it's being mixed. Do you need to be re-assured every other week that the mixing is still going on?

Question: What kind of fucking updates do you want at this point?




/jarmo

Gotta agree with Jarmo on this. GNR is not gonna hold your fucking hand as you wait, consoling you with reassuring words every time you get upset. They have better things to worry about than react to the whims and concerns of a relatively few number of fans on an Internet fan site. The fact that they even consider to visit here occasionally should be considered an incredible gesture.

You got your update, now wait for the next one.

If people expected the tentative release date to be tentative and not final, we wouldn't have all these upset fan posting in this thread would we?


/jarmo

I can not understand why people in this forum attack Jarmo. Please a fan site is a place where people express your admiration for someone. But some people want to use this forum to critizice Axl and I agree with Jarmo in not allowing this behavior. I visit this site because I love GNR, I would never waste my time visiting a band site for bitching about the band. ?I would like to read here post of people who support Axl.

Some seem to think March 6th was impossible.

I think if things had gone Axl's way, the album would've been out on the 6th.


As others have pointed out, people would've been pissed if he didn't say anything about a possible release date.




/jarmo

Please a fan site is a place where people express your admiration for someone.

Not at all. It is a place to talk about the group/team you are a fan of, not "admire" them. I am a life long Cleveland Browns fan, but because I am frustrated that they are awful every single year does not preclude me from being a fan. Go to any Browns huddle forum and you will see talk of why the team blows and how to make them better among fans. When you win 5 games every year, there is very little "admiring" to be done.

It is no different than the GNR situation. They could be considered a losing franchise right now, and the fans congregate to commiserate with eachother always hopeful that better days lay ahead. This idea that one must be myopic at all times in order to be considered a fan is not healthy.

I think that's a fair enough comparison though, to carry your analogy further, the debate here is between a few groups:

a) those who believe the Browns will pull off a miracle in the upcoming draft
b) those who believe that the Browns should have pulled off the miracle in a previous draft, and are upset because they didn't do so
c) those who believe the Browns should have pulled off the miracle in a previous draft and want to punish them for not doing so
d) those who believe that the Browns will suddenly decide to skip this and all future drafts.
e) those who are more concerned with how to get Jim Brown back on the team

The first two strike me as good fans, with varying levels of patience, and I have no problem with them expressing their hopes and frustrations.? The third annoys me to no end, with all the bitching and moaning and ultimatum after ultimatum.? The fourth just like to stir up trouble.? The fifth are probably on the wrong board.

Ok, look.  I don't think that Axl HAS to do anything.  I'm just saying it would be nice if we knew a little more than we knew now.  There are alot of opinions going on in this thread.  I've made a few, many others have made a few.  What it all boils down to is this: we have been told by someone associated with the band that the album is being mixed because all of the recording is done.  You know what?  Yes.  That is a good thing.  I'm excited about that.  I think that means that the album is probably really going to come out soon.

But then I realize something.  There are a helluva lot of scenarios that could transpire that could screw things up at even this phase.  There seems to be a black cloud hovering over this album's potential release.  I don't think I am stretching when I say that any of the following are completely possible to happen in the next year or two:

-Axl is not happy with the final mix.
-Axl is not happy with the record company's marketing strategy
-Axl is not happy with the drummer situation...whatever the hell that is
-Axl is not happy with his new management (whoever that ends up being)
-Axl is not happy with the competeting albums coming out on possible release dates
-Axl is not happy with the press he is getting prior to the albums release
-Axl is not happy with the reaction a released single is getting

Any one of these are very real scenarios.  I normally don't like being a pescamist like this and thinking ahead towards negative scenarios, but at this point...after this much time of not being able to go into a record store to buy a new GNR CD, it's really hard not to.  Couple that with the fact that these are the only scenarios that could be construed as optimistic:

-The album is released in the next couple of months

Well, there just seems to be a bigger chance at one (or possibly more than one) of the negative scenarios playing through.


I don't know.  I'm just frustrated.  I'm not getting any younger.  None of us are.  The closer I get to death, the less time I'll have on this earth spending time enjoying Chinese Democracy.

Some of those things you list could happen (the happiness with the mix striking me as most likely).  Others don't seem as likely.    For example, the marketing strategy, competing release dates, reaction to a single, and general press reaction to the album are all things that occur AFTER he has handed it over, mixed and mastered, and at that point I don't know that Hell or high water could keep it from coming out.         

Well...Axl's got lawyers, right?

Responding to all of the Axl Rose is Axl Rose and he'll do whatver he wants talks.   People admire him (myself included) because he has a certain edge to him and seems to do what ever he feels like doing.  But at the same time this current situation (the wait for cd), for whatever reason, has gone on way too long.  The question I pose to all of those people who respond in the aforementioned way in sentence one is:  If Axl Rose was a fan of Guns N Roses (or anything he liked for that matter) Do you think he would just sit around having blind admiration for the situation OR do you think that he would get a little impatient and say what is on his mind and not give a fuck?  I'm just curious.

What proof do you have of them doing the opposite?

Please tell me what information you have regarding the upcoming shows that we don't have....

Oh boy....


You don't seem to listen when you're being told something important.

Why is that?

You're wasting all your energy on the complaining and fail to see what's actually happening.

#1 - The recording is done. 100%. Not 90%....
#2 - Mixing is going on now. That's often done after the recording but before the actual release. You don't want to skip this step just to please a younggunner on a GN'R board who's feeling unhappy.
#3 - Axl will always "shoot himself in the foot" because there's people who will always twist his words to fit their needs. It doesn't matter what he says. Either he's lying or it's not even his

anyone who has read the letter knows that axl covered his ass concerning this date.

Seriously, this sounds crazy but I think its gonna be a little sad once the wait is over.

Take my approach and u will never be disappointed.


My approach is


"Ill believe it when I see it on the shelves;buy it, and then pop it into my CD player and the fuckin thing actually works."


Till then, I don't believe anything said by the GNR camp.

Sometimes Murphys law is in full function, have you EVER considered that it is not totally the band's fault for the delay?????

Seriously, this sounds crazy but I think its gonna be a little sad once the wait is over.

I think half the fun has been all the years of rumor, speculation, anticipation etc etc.

What do you mean? Then we can go on with our lifes again :hihi:

Take my approach and u will never be disappointed.


My approach is


"Ill believe it when I see it on the shelves;buy it, and then pop it into my CD player and the fuckin thing actually works."


Till then, I don't believe anything said by the GNR camp.

What do you mean? Then we can go on with our lifes again :hihi:

Your post made me think of a hilarious Murphyish scenario. Immagine that CD is finally released. You buy the damn thing, you put it in a CD player press play and nothing happens - it doesn`t work!

Not after 10 years, no.

Your post made me think of a hilarious Murphyish scenario. Immagine that CD is finally released. You buy the damn thing, you put it in a CD player press play and nothing happens - it doesn`t work!

just reading all these dissings in the press shows how lazy journalism truly has become. once uppon a time, you acutally had to try to be accurate, call sources directly as much as possible, etc. now it's simply read the newswire (or messagboards!), take the quotes you want, disregard what doesnt fit into your definition of the story, and viola- you are a journalist!

as for DJs and their speil- most get where they are thru being gohpers and asskissers to upper management in the companies-not because they have any real talent

but, if gnr want it all to stop, there's only one thing the guns guys can do and we have yet to see it.

Your post made me think of a hilarious Murphyish scenario. Immagine that CD is finally released. You buy the damn thing, you put it in a CD player press play and nothing happens - it doesn`t work!

My thoughts are this: ?Axl Rose is Axl Rose. ?The man doesn't have to say anything to anybody. He doesn't have to "keep the fans posted". ?The bottom line is this: People can say what they will, but when the record is released, anyone who ever said anything negative towards Axl will come crawling back begging him to let them kiss his ass. ?
 
 Do i want the record to release? ?yes. ? Do i think it will be worth the wait? no. ?Do i think it will be one of the greatest records of all time? ?Shit yeah, the man is Axl Rose. ?

2) How can it be one of the greatest albums ever and not worth the wait?

As I said, some think they're constantly being lied to by the band.

The same people who complain about the lack of updates.....



/jarmo

Not after 10 years, no.

In case anyone's interested, an online petition has been set up by a GNR fan addressing the current situation:


http://axlrose.epetitions.net/

Quote from: Danny on Today at 11:44:28 PM
In case anyone's interested, an online petition has been set up by a GNR fan addressing the current situation:


http://axlrose.epetitions.net/


hahahaha   

do you know how many pertitions there have been in the past 5 years ?

it wont help anything

No, I don't.? Links?

look them up yourself if you dont believe me. but i have seen people like you come and go over the years with these worthless pertitions that always fail.

my my there does seem to be a lot of red-head hating out there... on this board. in the press. in the world.

how very curious...

dont expect anything better from the critics... (a bunch of bitter failed artists if you ask me)... but the supposive 'fans' er fanatics of this band? acting like axl rosie signed a personal contract with you himself... are you truely being ripped off?

this band is damned if they don't and damnedandtreblefucked if they do put anything out there as way of an update...
there is no musician in his right mind (or out of it) who would want this process to take as long as this... therefore... just maybe a lot of interfering shit we're not privy to smelling is going on behind the scenes...

as for petitions? the only one im interested in signing is the axl in little shorts campaign...  :)

THIS FUCKING ALBUM WILL NEVER COME OUT..... I had hopes, but all of this has just proved to me that my friends are right and Axl is a burnt out rockstar........? ? ?PLEASE AXL!!! DONT LET GNR BECOME EVEN MORE OF A LAUGHING STOCK!!!! Or ill be shouting VR forever

"just reading all these dissings in the press shows how lazy journalism truly has become"

Well to be fair, It could be considered LAZY to take over 10 years to finish an album. Just a thought.

In case anyone's interested, an online petition has been set up by a GNR fan addressing the current situation:


http://axlrose.epetitions.net/

Quote from: Danny on Yesterday at 11:44:28 PM
In case anyone's interested, an online petition has been set up by a GNR fan addressing the current situation:


http://axlrose.epetitions.net/

nice petition. Server not found.

THIS FUCKING ALBUM WILL NEVER COME OUT..... I had hopes, but all of this has just proved to me that my friends are right and Axl is a burnt out rockstar........? ? ?PLEASE AXL!!! DONT LET GNR BECOME EVEN MORE OF A LAUGHING STOCK!!!! Or ill be shouting VR forever

Yeah.  The whole e-petion site has been down all day, ironically.  Maybe Axl bought it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: Danny on Today at 11:45:08 PM
Quote
Quote from: Danny on Yesterday at 11:44:28 PM
In case anyone's interested, an online petition has been set up by a GNR fan addressing the current situation:


http://axlrose.epetitions.net/

nice petition. Server not found.


Yeah.  The whole e-petion site has been down all day, ironically.  Maybe Axl bought it.


Ah maybe papers were served. The thing was stupid anyho.

Actually, it's the whole site that's been down...not just the Axl letter.  And I happen to disaggree about it being stupid...but that's just my opinion.


VR FOREVER!!!!

Just kidding.

Actually it is, because no petition is going to alter Axl. Axl is going to do what he wants.

Actually it is, because no petition is going to alter Axl. Axl is going to do what he wants.

 ?I can't believe this guy just said this. ? Is there a way to kick him off of anything that has to do with G'n'R forever? ?And more importantly, who is the one who decided to give him an opinion? ? ? ?

 What a fag.

don't worry, he will come crawling back when CD is released, like the pathetic hypocrit that he is.
"axl promised me the record, boo-hoo, i hate you axl, i will stop supporting you now! fuck you!"
the true sign of a loser. thankfully gnr doesn't need fans like that, even beta said it. so long loser, don't bother ever coming back.

Axl himself said that you should take a break if all this waiting is too much for you.

Lack of communication?

I'd say it's more about lack of understanding from certain people. Take, for example, the word "tentative". Suddenly it means "final".




/jarmo

Yea, but c'mon Jarmo... Axl could take a dump in your milk and you'd call it cereal.     ;D

Axl can do no wrong in your eyes.  Which is fine.

But what would Pitman say about that?

But what would Pitman say about that?




I can't see the connection here.


People complain about the lack of information when Axl wrote a letter explaining the situation only a few months ago and since then the official site has been updated with a CD update.

Bumblefoot also has given small updates on the progress in recent radio interviews.

In addition to that, there's a bunch of shows happening pretty soon around the world.

If you choose to ignore all these updates, then I guess there's a serious lack of information.


This so called lack of information is nothing more than certain people wanting certain information. The information supplied isn't what they wanted to hear. So, what do they do? They claim there's no information at all from the band. That's a fucking lie and anybody with half a brain can see that.

If you've missed it, go read it on www.gunsnroses.com

What they fail to realize is that maybe the information they crave, can't be shared at this point because it's not confirmed or anything final.

Last time Axl gave us a (tentative) release date, he got crucified for lying!? ::)

You think he'll do that again seeing how his words got twisted and people got pissed off?



/jarmo

i was listening to Kerrang! radio in the uk earlier, they mentioned that gn'r site that has shut down, then said the album is now scheduled for a september release.

where do they get these dates?

i think it will be this year, although i dont think axl should have said even a tentaive date, because people get their hopes up and who can blame them?

fact is this album is long over due, people can argue all they want but at the end of the day, thats a fact.

axl has said in the past that it would be out this yaer, and "soon" and all that stuff and nothing was delivered, i undertand the guy is human, but he's has done this on a few occasions.

the sheer fact that i think we've had 3 chinese democracy world tours shows a lack of organisation ?or cohesion in the GnR camp, world tour to me should equal album or no world tour should begin untio the album is 80-90% done.


all the floks defending axl and pointong to the word tentative and over analysing what the guy said are, in my mind, just as sad as those who spit the dummy out and say they wont wait any longer.


may be you'll do better next time........punk!

But what would Pitman say about that?




I can't see the connection here.


People complain about the lack of information when Axl wrote a letter explaining the situation only a few months ago and since then the official site has been updated with a CD update.

Bumblefoot also has given small updates on the progress in recent radio interviews.

In addition to that, there's a bunch of shows happening pretty soon around the world.

If you choose to ignore all these updates, then I guess there's a serious lack of information.


This so called lack of information is nothing more than certain people wanting certain information. The information supplied isn't what they wanted to hear. So, what do they do? They claim there's no information at all from the band. That's a fucking lie and anybody with half a brain can see that.

If you've missed it, go read it on www.gunsnroses.com

What they fail to realize is that maybe the information they crave, can't be shared at this point because it's not confirmed or anything final.

Last time Axl gave us a (tentative) release date, he got crucified for lying!? ::)

You think he'll do that again seeing how his words got twisted and people got pissed off?



/jarmo

Sure, but what I'm saying is that there are details that you know, Talking Metal knows, and EMS knows about the process of CD that the average fan doesn't get to hear.

who the fuck are you to compare those of us who defend axl with the bullshitters?
stop using gnr quotes to attack people, it's lame as hell.
beta has already said the band doesn't need "fans" who refuse to believe the truth and who insist on being negative and who wants to blame everything on axl and i couldn't agree with her more. the band will do just fine without you. what the fuck do you know about how the band/management is organized? do you know axl or anyone associated with the band?

Quote from: MotherGooseLuvR on Today at 01:50:05 PM
Sure, but what I'm saying is that there are details that you know, Talking Metal knows, and EMS knows about the process of CD that the average fan doesn't get to hear.


What details?

I read that it's being mixed.

Unlike some, I don't need GN'R to give me a daily schedule of the mixing process. It'll be finished when it's finished.




/jarmo

i think it will be this year, although i dont think axl should have said even a tentaive date, because people get their hopes up and who can blame them?

fact is this album is long over due, people can argue all they want but at the end of the day, thats a fact.

axl has said in the past that it would be out this yaer, and "soon" and all that stuff and nothing was delivered, i undertand the guy is human, but he's has done this on a few occasions.

the sheer fact that i think we've had 3 chinese democracy world tours shows a lack of organisation ?or cohesion in the GnR camp, world tour to me should equal album or no world tour should begin untio the album is 80-90% done.


all the floks defending axl and pointong to the word tentative and over analysing what the guy said are, in my mind, just as sad as those who spit the dummy out and say they wont wait any longer.


may be you'll do better next time........punk!

what the fuck are you going on about you fucking pyscho! IS IT YOUR FUCKING BAD WEEK!!!
my post wasn't aimed at anyone, im not negative, i said axl's human, when we get it we get it!

its people like you who jump on the defensive and attack people for having opinion that you dont share that drives other fans to frustration, you fuckin stupid bitch, open your eyes, your ears fuckling wake up! i didnt say anything to anyone, i just staed my opinion you fuck!

do your fuckin research before coming on and spewing you shit all over the keyboard with you misinformed/ misguided, head in the sand, bullshit!

Sorry, but their communication level is astonishingly bad for a major band, and all you have to do is look to NIN for an example of the right way to do it. Axl said he'd try as hard as possible to have it out by March 6th, and that if "unforeseen difficulties" delayed it, we would be kept up to date constantly.

Honestly, if GNR's publicity was the slighest bit compotent, you wouldn't see this much bitching on a fan board. ?There are perfectly good, human explanations for what's happening in Axl's world. ?

For some reason, he's decided not to share that. ?All the bitching we see on the forums is the consequences of that choice, in my opinion.

Axl said he'd try as hard as possible to have it out by March 6th, and that if "unforeseen difficulties" delayed it, we would be kept up to date constantly.

Well, throughout all the negative shit goin around the crew still have my support and I'd rather hear about new leaks than nothing.? I've been into GNR longer than most people on this board and feel that Axl doesn't give a shit about what we think. The reason I feel this is because I am in my thirties and understand that music is a? living and a? business.? He does what he does because he has to. I run my own company and know that he would love to get this shit out but when it comes down to it he answers to more people than many of you give credit to.? Axl Rose is not the GOD you all think he is.? He is a bloke trying to make a living like you and I.? If your a kid who still relies on your parents you won't understand this post at all but if your an adult you will.
The album will materialise when the people that be, let it.

Good luck Axl and give em shit!!!

Its pretty sick, Whatever Axl does people will be disagree and complain about his decision, always! That cant be easy for him.

Jarmo,

I think you're trying to distort the content of my post.

I never said daily updates.  Nobody has.  You're saying that to weaken our arguments about GNR's bad PR.

Honestly, if GNR's publicity was the slighest bit compotent, you wouldn't see this much bitching on a fan board.  There are perfectly good, human explanations for what's happening in Axl's world. 

For some reason, he's decided not to share that.  All the bitching we see on the forums is the consequences of that choice, in my opinion.

Del James' post was hardly an "update" of any sort.

Correct me if I?m wrong but this has always been this way,even in the UYI days. Gnr have never been this kind of bands that give updates very frequently. Some years ago, internet was not so handy as it is today, and the updates were done through MTV or something like that.And they only gave updates when they had something important to say and people were not complaining all the time like you do right now.

All this bashing is useless, you are not going to get CD sooner just because you complain more. Also, if I was Axl I would tell even less,because no matter what he does or says it all is twisted,overanalyzed and taken out of its context. You are never happy unless you have something to bitch and moan. ::)

Im not saying Axl owes anyone anything nor am I telling him what to do.  Im just saying that in my opinion it is nothing but beneficial for the band members to talk to the fans.  I think that if every 2 weeks a different band member did a q&a or posted something on the message board it would do many positives and no negatives.  It would keep fans interested, give the masses another reason to embrace the new GNR, it would provide a lot to discuss, it would shut up one topic of argument, it would stop some false reporting, and it would make everything seem like a band.  I dont see any downsides, and I dont see why suggesting something like that is wrong.