The reason we're waiting....

[Rockin' Rose]

When watching the '01-'02 line-up on dvd the chemistry seems to be pretty good except for Bucket, Robins look was.. different but he was rockin' and playing the songs with his own style, adding solos and stuff. When listening the '02 bootlegs you hear great chemistry and out standing instrumental playing while Axl being the weak link on some of the old songs, I still prefer the '02 version of Maddy and The Blues.

When I saw the '06 line-up live with Bumble the chemistry was great, probably the best I've ever seen. I was thinking about this on monday after talking about the new line-up to a friend of mine and one of the reasons I think why this new band works ('01-'02 included) is that all the band members know what the old songs mean to Axl, when they were made Axl gave all he got, they know and honor this. Also when the new band was formed Axl probably didn't dictate them on how to play the songs, kinda like, "Play them the way you wan't as long as they sound right and have feeling" and this is more audible on the '02 bootlegs, Axl gave them freedom to play the songs they felt was right, they weren't just some hired musicians to duplicate the former band members playing and sound, they created their own sound.

These are some of the main reasons I feel made the new band has been a success

[Lesty]

This is silly.
You think it takes 12 years to reconstuct a band?
Maybe the chemistry is off because when the band is recording or rehearsing, Axl is never around?
It's well noted he didn't show up for rehearsals or recording for months.
You think he hires and fires producers and group members because of "team chemistry"?
It had more to do with uncertaintly and insecurity more than anything...
Tommy has been with the band for over 8 years. You think he's still working on his chemistry with Axl?
Give me a break.......
I'm an aXl and GnR supporter, but it's silly when people who don't know anything make up these excuses as to why things take so long. We're talking about a decade. You've got to get serious.

[acompleteunknown]

This is silly.
You think it takes 12 years to reconstuct a band?

A band that is as iconic as GNR?  Yes.  No one has ever attempted that task.  So we really don't know how long it will take.  And 12 years ago, Slash and Duff were still in the band.

This is silly.

Tommy has been with the band for over 8 years. You think he's still working on his chemistry with Axl?

No, he fits.  That's why he's still in the band.  That's why he was able to leave go to the Replacements reunion and still come back and record. 

Linkin Park has all their same members and it's taken them 4 years to put out a new album.

Tool's taken 5 years between their last two albums.  Nine Inch Nails took 5 years between Downward Spiral and The Fragile.

Changing band members complicates things.  Especially when you're trying to make something of quality.

[wells]

... Nine Inch Nails took 5 years between Downward Spiral and The Fragile ...

well if Trent needed 5 years to find chemistry between himself and ... uhm ... himself  all is clear   

[jarmo]

And please explain to me how things have changed? They're still in the studio, they're still not releasing anything, nor music or specific info. The recording process moving forward isn't new, just an addition to the old.

There was a tentative release date issued by Axl himself, Axl saying they were gonna finish the album, a successful tour, an update saying the recording is done, it's being mixed.


Did you see any of those in 2001?


Just by sticking to the facts, you can see that it's not the same as in 2001.




/jarmo

[ppbebe]

nowhere those say that he didn't sing between 94 and 98. isn't it just your speculation?

The songs didn't have any vocals, what else do you need? Moby even described him as getting 'testy' for just bringing up the subject. If that isn't indication of some sort of temporary inability I don't know what it is. What he does in the shower doesn't concern me.

The daily voical exercises and such singers do are already singing.

How can you decide that axl didn't sing at all from 94 to 98  just because moby didn't hear him sing on the songs?

The fact that he didn't even sing between 94 and 98 is evidence enough (source Moby).

an assumptive remark. now you call it  indication but it was the source of a fact . 

maybe that where the root of your negativity is.

[polluxlm]

nowhere those say that he didn't sing between 94 and 98. isn't it just your speculation?

The songs didn't have any vocals, what else do you need? Moby even described him as getting 'testy' for just bringing up the subject. If that isn't indication of some sort of temporary inability I don't know what it is. What he does in the shower doesn't concern me.

The daily voical exercises and such singers do are already singing.

How can you decide that axl didn't sing at all from 94 to 98? just because moby didn't hear him sing on the songs?

The fact that he didn't even sing between 94 and 98 is evidence enough (source Moby).

an assumptive remark. now you call it? indication but it was the source of a fact .?

maybe that where the root of your negativity is.

We're not debating wether or not he sung at all, but rather if there are indications that there are psychological reasons for him not being able to finish. I'll say that quote is a pretty strong indication of that.

[Lethalis]

Axl not singing kinda makes sense.

He probably fucked up his vocal chords pretty bad during the massive UYI tours and wanted them to recover. If he ever got upset with people asking about vocals, he probably had trouble singing at that point. His voice is the most important thing he's got.. if he can't sing his career is over.

If I scream for an hour or so I lose my voice completely for 3 days 

[polluxlm]

And please explain to me how things have changed? They're still in the studio, they're still not releasing anything, nor music or specific info. The recording process moving forward isn't new, just an addition to the old.

There was a tentative release date issued by Axl himself, Axl saying they were gonna finish the album, a successful tour, an update saying the recording is done, it's being mixed.


Did you see any of those in 2001?


Just by sticking to the facts, you can see that it's not the same as in 2001.




/jarmo

That depends on your definition. The words and claims are different, and I'll agree the state of the project is different as to being more complete, but they're still just words. There are no hard evidence suggesting CD is imminent. When I see a tracklist, cover art, single or Universal statement I'll jump on the train, but at this point we're still pretty much in the same mode of waiting as before.

[Communist China]

Good post, but the members have been there. Several of them for near a decade. The songs we hear are all at least 4-5 years old now too, so it's not like it's been an ongoing process. The new band's growth is not a y=x graph. It's had many dips and haults, and those are due to member problems (at least not all of them).

The problem in the process stems from Axl's insecurity imo. It took him a long time to be able to do anything, and then when he finally had a product he was proud of (Oh My God) and it got a cold response, his confidence was shattered. He even changed his opinon of the song from 'it's great' to 'it's just a demo'. He refused to respect his own work just because others didn't like it. That's too bad, because it probably derailed the first steady CD train and added years onto the release of the album.

[Luigi]

That was well said, perfect post my friend    

[ppbebe]

nowhere those say that he didn't sing between 94 and 98. isn't it just your speculation?

The songs didn't have any vocals, what else do you need? Moby even described him as getting 'testy' for just bringing up the subject. If that isn't indication of some sort of temporary inability I don't know what it is. What he does in the shower doesn't concern me.

The daily voical exercises and such singers do are already singing.

How can you decide that axl didn't sing at all from 94 to 98  just because moby didn't hear him sing on the songs?

The fact that he didn't even sing between 94 and 98 is evidence enough (source Moby).

an assumptive remark. now you call it  indication but it was the source of a fact . 

maybe that where the root of your negativity is.

We're not debating wether or not he sung at all, but rather if there are indications that there are psychological reasons for him not being able to finish. I'll say that quote is a pretty strong indication of that.

say so from the start.
and if you think he couldn't put the vocals for some psychological reasons then, you must know how things have changed.

[novrain91]

All of the mitigating factors need to be taken into account, but this whole thing with Chinese Democracy is still a disgrace!  I agree with wanting to be your best and maintaining the credibility of GNR (although that seemed to be going down for years before the orginal band broke up).  BUT sitting around fretting about the shit is a complete pussy move.  A bad ass rock band (like GNR was and hopefully will be again) would cut the tracks and go out and play it the best that they can play it. End of story. If it was me I'd think I'd rather do that than wait til I'm 45+ years old to release another album. But that's just me. (By the way, I still support Axl and I'm anxiously awaiting CD but i'm just saying!)

[Randy Jesus]

All of the mitigating factors need to be taken into account, but this whole thing with Chinese Democracy is still a disgrace!  I agree with wanting to be your best and maintaining the credibility of GNR (although that seemed to be going down for years before the orginal band broke up).  BUT sitting around fretting about the shit is a complete pussy move.  A bad ass rock band (like GNR was and hopefully will be again) would cut the tracks and go out and play it the best that they can play it. End of story. If it was me I'd think I'd rather do that than wait til I'm 45+ years old to release another album. But that's just me. (By the way, I still support Axl and I'm anxiously awaiting CD but i'm just saying!)

How long did it take Michelangelo to paint the chapel? It was no disgrace in the end. However the pope was pissed that it took so long...  So stop your Bullshit, Axl is an artist...

[25]

How long did it take Michelangelo to paint the chapel? It was no disgrace in the end. However the pope was pissed that it took so long...  So stop your Bullshit, Axl is an artist...

Well, Michaelangelo didn't want to paint the Sistine Chapel - it was a pre-condition of him getting the job of sculpting 40 or so statues for another place (which ended up not happening). I'm guessing it took so long because the Sistine Chapel is frigging huge, not because of any artistic block. 

[fink_owns_slash]

All of the mitigating factors need to be taken into account, but this whole thing with Chinese Democracy is still a disgrace!? I agree with wanting to be your best and maintaining the credibility of GNR (although that seemed to be going down for years before the orginal band broke up).? BUT sitting around fretting about the shit is a complete pussy move.? A bad ass rock band (like GNR was and hopefully will be again) would cut the tracks and go out and play it the best that they can play it. End of story. If it was me I'd think I'd rather do that than wait til I'm 45+ years old to release another album. But that's just me. (By the way, I still support Axl and I'm anxiously awaiting CD but i'm just saying!)

How long did it take Michelangelo to paint the chapel? It was no disgrace in the end. However the pope was pissed that it took so long...? So stop your Bullshit, Axl is an artist...

compairing axl writing and singing about 13 tracks with painting the sistine chapel... wow. absurd.

[alternativemonkey]

The original line-up of GNR had incredible chemistry.?

Now imagine being in Axl's shoes and having to start over from scratch.

If you believe that Axl is taking too long of a time to rebuild the band...then think about this...? Name one other band in the history of rock n roll that has replaced all but one original member and has remained as important, popular, and as relevant as ever. ?

This is a specious arguement. There is no relationship between time and building chemistry. I'll ?"name another band" for you. ?. .

Ever hear of the The Yardbirds (#89 on Rolling Stones greatest artists of all time)? A guy named Jimmy Page joined the Yardbirds in 1966 to play bass guitar. After everyone else quit in the summer of 1968. . . he hired Robert Plant , John Bohnam, and John Paul Jones to complete The Yardbirds tour of Scandinavia as contractually obligated. By the end of the year, they changed their name to . . . . let me clear my throat . . . Led Zeppelin. I think their first album came out in January 1969 - six months after he replaced everyone.

[Danny]

This is a specious arguement. There is no relationship between time and building chemistry. I'll  "name another band" for you.  . .

Ever hear of the The Yardbirds (#89 on Rolling Stones greatest artists of all time)? A guy named Jimmy Page joined the Yardbirds in 1966 to play bass guitar. After everyone else quit in the summer of 1968. . . he hired Robert Plant , John Bohnam, and John Paul Jones to complete The Yardbirds tour of Scandinavia as contractually obligated. By the end of the year, they changed their name to . . . . let me clear my throat . . . Led Zeppelin. I think their first album came out in January 1969 - six months after he replaced everyone.

Yeah, but Axl doesn't wanna do this by ripping off a bunch of old blues musicians.

[ppbebe]

Michaelangelo didn't want to paint the Sistine Chapel

Really? I hear during the work he himself went around searching for founds.

I'm guessing chinese democracy took long because it is frigging huge, rather than because of artistic block.

Good example hellhole.

[novrain91]

HellHole you're a douche. ?This ain't the sistine chapel bud, it's a cd. ?I'm fairly sure the Beatles knocked out classic cds year after year in the 60's. ?Appetite took an hour to make compared to Chinese Democracy. ?You'll have a difficult time finding someone who actually thinks this is going to be better than Appetite (although we can only hope it is!). ?My point is, just because an artist takes a long time to complete something doesn't make it better. ?In GNR's case look at Use Your Illusions. ?