2007-2008 NBA Season

[Bodhi]

Stockton and Malone got a lot of numbers due to the amount of years they played etc.

They never won a title though, so that drops them to third tier.

dude you are out of your fucking mind...who came up with this tier system...you??  Stockton and Malone were named to the best 50 players of all time back in 1997..Karl Malone is the greatest power forward to ever play the game and a 2 time NBA Mvp...and John Stockton is the best pure point guard to play the game..with an assist record that will NEVER be broken...(yes I know Magic played point, but he was a swing player, not really a point guard)

[D]

Karl Malone isnt better than Tim Duncan or Kevin Mchale so i dont know where u got he was the greatest.

if Magic Johnson doesnt get aids, Stockton doesnt sniff the assist record.

Third Tier is still top 25 of all time but would u be stupid enough to put malone and stockton in a class with Bird and Magic? NO WAY

U would put Patrick Ewing on the same level as Hakeem Olajuwon or Kareem?

[Bodhi]

Karl Malone isnt better than Tim Duncan or Kevin Mchale so i dont know where u got he was the greatest.

if Magic Johnson doesnt get aids, Stockton doesnt sniff the assist record.

Third Tier is still top 25 of all time but would u be stupid enough to put malone and stockton in a class with Bird and Magic? NO WAY

U would put Patrick Ewing on the same level as Hakeem Olajuwon or Kareem?

HAHA your kidding me..  Stockton broke that assist record in less time than it took Magic Johnson to get it...so that detroys that arugment right there..Stockton murdered that record and led the league in assists for 9 straight seasons...a few of those Magic was actually playing.....not too mention Magic was on his way down when he got Aids anyway...he wasnt going to play much longer.... and even if he did Stockton still would have broken that record...he slaughtered that record


and yes I put Ewing on Hakeems level...not Jabbars though

[Bodhi]

still about 6 minutes left in the game.....this might one of the worst officiated games I have ever seen.....seriously i hope someone here is watching the Lakers get all these foul calls when there is literally no contact whatsoever.....

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

still about 6 minutes left in the game.....this might one of the worst officiated games I have ever seen.....seriously i hope someone here is watching the Lakers get all these foul calls when there is literally no contact whatsoever.....

Axl Rose- "ARE YOU BLIND!?!?!?"

A beautiful victory for the Lake show, hopefully Kobe's back is better so they can celebrate in front of all the Jazz fans.

[BigCombo]

still about 6 minutes left in the game.....this might one of the worst officiated games I have ever seen.....seriously i hope someone here is watching the Lakers get all these foul calls when there is literally no contact whatsoever.....

I agree Luke Walton got bailed out on his fall-away.  However, its called home court advantage.  You won't be complaining when Utah gets those same calls Friday. 

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

still about 6 minutes left in the game.....this might one of the worst officiated games I have ever seen.....seriously i hope someone here is watching the Lakers get all these foul calls when there is literally no contact whatsoever.....

I agree Luke Walton got bailed out on his fall-away.  However, its called home court advantage.  Enjoy those calls Utah will get on Friday.

So when Kirilenko is leveling Fish, that's just hard D right?

[Bodhi]

still about 6 minutes left in the game.....this might one of the worst officiated games I have ever seen.....seriously i hope someone here is watching the Lakers get all these foul calls when there is literally no contact whatsoever.....

I agree Luke Walton got bailed out on his fall-away.  However, its called home court advantage.  Enjoy those calls Utah will get on Friday.

So when Kirilenko is leveling Fish, that's just hard D right?

it was a good game tonight....Utah let one slip away...i wouldnt count on Kobe celebrating in Utah on friday..considering he is 0-7 lifetime there in the playoffs....the Lakers looked very vulnerable tonight....tough loss...i have a feeling that this might have been the series tonight...that was the one for Utah to steal....going in there for a game 7 if they are able to win on friday is going to be tough....

p.s Archie...i know we have been talking about b-ball for a while on this thread...are you really only 19?  You have a good knowledge of 90s basketball if that is the case...i remember watching all those Utah playoff series against the Lakers...you would have been 8 years old at that time....i got the impression that you were older from some of your posts.

[pilferk]

Tim Duncan's a douche, don't feel too bad.  But so were Stockton and Malone.  Stockton went to the Vlade Divac School of Acting, and Malone had this annoying kick anytime he would take a fadeaway shot from the perimeter.

I don't disagree.  But statistically...Stockton is one of the, if not the, greatest point guard of all time.  That assist record says it all.  Malone was VERY good, too...but I agree about that damn kick!

Duncan has gotten old and the only reason he is still a decent player is because he knows how to use the backboard.

Something EVERY NBA PLAYER SHOULD RE-LEARN!

Jesus, I've coached kids in basketball, on and off, for abuot 15 years.  Young kids.  We DRILL it into their heads, when shooting layups..but it makes it SO hard when the guys they're watching play in the NBA finger roll and float every damn shot. 

Sorry...pet peeve.

[pilferk]

bullshit...stockton broke that assist and steal record in 95 and 96...8 seasons before he retired...

i hear the title argument....a championship looks nice on the resume...but Barkely, Ewing. Miller, Stockton and Malone are better than most players who actually have won championships.... a championship isnt everythng...

I agree.

And it took me a second to think about it, to get there.

Travis fucking Knight has an NBA championship ring.  Travis Knight couldn't carry the jock strap of any of the guys mentioned above.

[pilferk]

Karl Malone isnt better than Tim Duncan or Kevin Mchale so i dont know where u got he was the greatest.

if Magic Johnson doesnt get aids, Stockton doesnt sniff the assist record.

Third Tier is still top 25 of all time but would u be stupid enough to put malone and stockton in a class with Bird and Magic? NO WAY

U would put Patrick Ewing on the same level as Hakeem Olajuwon or Kareem?

Malone is about, statistically speaking, the equivalent of McHale....a bit better, actually.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mchalke01.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/malonka01.html


Ditto with Duncan:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/duncati01.html


The ONLY BIG difference are the number of rings won.

[D]

Karl Malone is nowhere near the Defensive player that Tim Duncan is or the leader or the intangible presence. Duncan 4 rings with no other top 25 player on his roster. Malone had the "Greatest" PG of all time and they made it to a grand total of 2 NBA finals.

Malone choking at the Free Throw line to cost them.


U guys only look at points. Malone was a great scorer but thats about it, Stockton was a great PG but they arent top 10 players of all time.

Malone and Stockton would be somewhere in the mid 20's.

Not many would take Karl Malone over Kevin Mchale.  Mchale was overshadowed by Bird but he revolutionized the post game.

[Thorned Rose]

Malone at the foul line? Dude was like 74% career

I think you mean when Jordan came around and swiped the ball from him in game 6 in 1998, that set up that infamous jump shot.

Karl Malone is a top 20 player of all time, for sure. I don't care how many years you play, but when you put up 36,000 points... you gotta be somebody.

Stockton? Great PG.

The argument here? Duncan is the defensive player Malone wishes he was.. 

[pilferk]

Karl Malone is nowhere near the Defensive player that Tim Duncan is or the leader or the intangible presence. Duncan 4 rings with no other top 25 player on his roster. Malone had the "Greatest" PG of all time and they made it to a grand total of 2 NBA finals.

Malone choking at the Free Throw line to cost them.

Malone avg more steals, Duncan more blocks.  Duncan is a pf/center who's played, at least partially, in an NBA that allows limited zone defense.  Malone played in an era where you could only play straight up man. 

Again, statistically, they're roughly equivalent.

And again, you're saying it's all about the rings.

U guys only look at points. Malone was a great scorer but thats about it, Stockton was a great PG but they arent top 10 players of all time.

Malone and Stockton would be somewhere in the mid 20's.

On the contrary, I look at the stats line as a whole.  The numbers look roughly equivalent to me.  Rebounding, assists, turnovers steals vs blocks, points....every statistical category looks pretty close.  If you disagree, please point out where Duncan or McHale excelled. 

And please...don't say "intangibles".  That's a cop out.

Stockton has been rated as one of the top 5 point guards of all time...rolled in with Magic, Oscar Robertson, and Isiah Thomas.  How you put him in the "mid 20's", I don't know.  Actually, I do know.  Stockton wasn't flashy, mouthy, or media friendly.  He was vastly underappreciated when he played...so I'm not all that surprised by the reaction.

Malone was, quite simply, one of the greates low post scorers ever.  He's rated as one of the top PF ever (with Duncan, Mchale, and Barkley).  Again, how you get him into the "mid 20's", I don't get.

Not many would take Karl Malone over Kevin Mchale.  Mchale was overshadowed by Bird but he revolutionized the post game.

Would I take Malone OVER McHale?  Don't know.  It would depend on the team I was running and at what point in their careers we're talking.  It's also AWFUL tough for me to put aside my "Celtic love"...Bird, McHale, Parish, Ainge and DJ were the team of my boyhood and I idolized those guys in the days when basketball was a HUGE part of my life.  But, if I go beyond the emotional attachment.....I'd put them both on pretty equal footing.  McHale may have revolutionized post play, but in the end Karl played a pretty similar game.

Oh, and ESPN says Karl is better (or did about 3 years ago):
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2074360

[pilferk]

The argument here? Duncan is the defensive player Malone wishes he was.. 

I don't ENTIRELY disagree.  The thing is..Duncan gets a lot more help (by way of NBA rule changes...both allowable defense and the "charging rule") than Malone got.

Duncan is more of a shot blocker.  Karl had, IMHO, better hands. 

I think the fact Duncan is a current player AND the fact he has a lot of jewelry, makes him look like a much better player than the Mailman.  I think, ultimately, IF Duncan is better...its not by much.  Not by "enough" to put them on different tiers IMHO.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

p.s Archie...i know we have been talking about b-ball for a while on this thread...are you really only 19?  You have a good knowledge of 90s basketball if that is the case...i remember watching all those Utah playoff series against the Lakers...you would have been 8 years old at that time....i got the impression that you were older from some of your posts.

Really and truly.

Can the Hornets close things out in San Antonio tonight? 

Methinks not.  Why can't road teams win a game?  I would rather face San Antonio than New Orleans, truth be told.

Detroit/Boston is gonna be one killer series.  Unfortunately Detroit is going to be well rested and I honestly don't think the Celtics match up very well against Detroit, I've said that all season.

[faldor]

p.s Archie...i know we have been talking about b-ball for a while on this thread...are you really only 19?  You have a good knowledge of 90s basketball if that is the case...i remember watching all those Utah playoff series against the Lakers...you would have been 8 years old at that time....i got the impression that you were older from some of your posts.

Really and truly.

Can the Hornets close things out in San Antonio tonight? 

Methinks not.  Why can't road teams win a game?  I would rather face San Antonio than New Orleans, truth be told.

Detroit/Boston is gonna be one killer series.  Unfortunately Detroit is going to be well rested and I honestly don't think the Celtics match up very well against Detroit, I've said that all season.

I think Detroit should be the favored team IF Boston gets by Cleveland, even though the C's would have home court.  The Pistons have played better and proved they can win on the road in the post-season.  The Celtics, unless they win tomorrow night haven't done that yet.  And if the Cavs somehow survive (without Daniel Gibson now), the Pistons would be a heavy favorite.

[Bodhi]

as far as the whole ring thing...yes Duncan has 4 rings....but look at the teams he played in the finals...the 03 nets, 99 Knicks, 07 Cavaliers and the 05 Pistons.....the late 90's Jazz teams would have beaten all of those teams...the only really talented team in that bunch was the Pistons....Duncan played in a weaker era...no doubt about it...karl malone played in the greatest era in the history of the NBA...the early 80's to late 90's.....I didnt see Duncan go through Jordan to get any of those rings...or Olajuwon for that matter...4 titles is impressive no matter how you look at it...but put those in perspective...

[Thorned Rose]

The point is that he faced the best team in the east each year...

stop crying about it...

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

The point is that he faced the best team in the east each year...

stop crying about it...

Hahaha.....the East.