Al-Qaeda leader Bin Laden 'dead'

[Grouse]

Pyrrhic victory anyone?

[Bodhi]

Pyrrhic victory anyone?

that implies that another victory such as this will result in defeat, so I am going to have to say no.  America can do this 100 more times and still be standing.  It is also not a "victory."  Al Qaeda is not dead, one leader from the group is.

[GeorgeSteele]

We are all united. That's clear. Everybody in the world (except the taliban and maybe some other fundamentalist groups) is HAPPY to see Bin Laden dead.

Killing Bin Laden is an important step to stop Al Qaeda. Its not enough, but it was probably the biggest step. Today is a great day in terms of the fight against worldwide terrorism, and we all agree and are united in this.

BUT i wont buy the cheap nationalism some of the american guys here and the ones celebrating in front of the white house profess. I wont buy the story of a ''good side called US'', ''an evil side called Al Qaeda'' and a ''defenseless rest of the world who needs the good-old USA to save their asses''. Thats american bullshit only americans can buy.

Basically, you're happy it happened, you just wish someone other than an American pulled the trigger.  Any consolation, there's a good chance the gunman had Spanish ancestry.

Americans bring back memories depending on how useful they are for their arguments. Talking about 9/11 is acceptable. Talking about Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Vietnam, Iraq, Cuba, etc is not. All these episodes involves HUMAN DEATHS.

Guess which one of those memories you listed has something to do with bin Laden.

And there is no other country in the world who caused more deaths than the USA. Divide history from 1900 to now in decades: USA will be #1 in the ranking in all of them.

Source?

[chineseblues]

Whether or not he was a threat anymore is irrelevant, he WAS responsible for 9/11 and was brought to justice.  

Well I think had they captured him alive he would have been brought to justice. Now he's just dead, which to the terrorists means he is now a martyr resting in heaven with 71 virgins or whatever. At least if he was alive he would have to face charges for what he did.

[estebanf]

And there is no other country in the world who caused more deaths than the USA. Divide history from 1900 to now in decades: USA will be #1 in the ranking in all of them.

Funny. That's exactly how that old man at the airport in Montevideo thought.

"It's ok, I speak the language of a country who colonized most of this continent and killed a lot of people, but it happened before 1900 so it's ok!"

 





/jarmo

Sorry, but I cant find the fun. I cant find it in my words, I cant find it in yours.

Cant understand what ''languages'' have to do with all this neither.

Yes, i know your intention is to make southamericans (you mentioned Uruguay, not Malaysia or India) look like ignorant fundamentalists, like barbarians invading your civilized world. But trust me you're miserably failing.

Justice has been made: Bin Laden is dead. Now its Bush's turn. He must pay too (but obviously, he will not be ''shot in a counter-terrerorism procedure''... ha! he's american!: he will be penally judged like all human beings!)

[estebanf]

Basically, you're happy it happened, you just wish someone other than an American pulled the trigger.  Any consolation, there's a good chance the gunman had Spanish ancestry.

Im not related with spain or spaniards. Sorry to take down your incredibly childish argument (oh my god... ).

PS: if you're gonna import someone else's argument, do it from someone offering a good one. Jarmo's one is ridiculous and have no basis at all.

[GeorgeSteele]

Basically, you're happy it happened, you just wish someone other than an American pulled the trigger.  Any consolation, there's a good chance the gunman had Spanish ancestry.

Im not related with spain or spaniards. Sorry to take down your incredibly childish argument (oh my god... ).

PS: if you're gonna import someone else's argument, do it from someone offering a good one. Jarmo's one is ridiculous and have no basis at all.

If you're going to state things as fact, post a source...

[jarmo]

And there is no other country in the world who caused more deaths than the USA. Divide history from 1900 to now in decades: USA will be #1 in the ranking in all of them.

Funny. That's exactly how that old man at the airport in Montevideo thought.

"It's ok, I speak the language of a country who colonized most of this continent and killed a lot of people, but it happened before 1900 so it's ok!"

 





/jarmo

Sorry, but I cant find the fun. I cant find it in my words, I cant find it in yours.

Cant understand what ''languages'' have to do with all this neither.

Yes, i know your intention is to make southamericans (you mentioned Uruguay, not Malaysia or India) look like ignorant fundamentalists, like barbarians invading your civilized world. But trust me you're miserably failing.

Nope. I have no problems with South Americans. Or any other Americans, or non-Americans for that mater.

I don't base my opinion on people on where they were born.


I found it somewhat amusing that just like other extremists, this person had made up his mind.

It didn't matter to him that ENGLISH has very little to do with USA, the language originated somewhere else. But to him, it reminded him of the evil USA and that was enough. He had his mind made up.

His own language obviously didn't remind him of the horrible things the Spanish had done hundreds of years earlier.

If it had, maybe he would be speaking Finnish... That's humor by the way. I don't think Finland is better than any other place. If you wanna insult Finland go ahead. I couldn't care less.


Now, over a year later, I see the same exact thinking here. "The USA is the worst if you use the formula that fits my agenda".

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. All I'm saying that it's deja vu! Seen it before!




The one failing is you. As soon as something even remotely negative is said about your region, you take it as an personal insult and try to make me seen as some kind of racist scum. Better think again.


There's something a bit comical about having some random old man start spewing his hatred against the USA to me only because I speak English and not Spanish...

Don't you worry, I don't think everybody in South America is that way.



Just like I don't blame the entire population of the USA for their foreign policy. Not everyone there agrees with everything their government does either....



/jarmo

[jarmo]

Basically, you're happy it happened, you just wish someone other than an American pulled the trigger.  Any consolation, there's a good chance the gunman had Spanish ancestry.

Im not related with spain or spaniards. Sorry to take down your incredibly childish argument (oh my god... ).

PS: if you're gonna import someone else's argument, do it from someone offering a good one. Jarmo's one is ridiculous and have no basis at all.

If you're going to state things as fact, post a source...

He knows everything, and the rest of us are ridiculous.

Doesn't need a source.

Come on!



I learned this ages ago... 





/jarmo

[estebanf]

Basically, you're happy it happened, you just wish someone other than an American pulled the trigger.  Any consolation, there's a good chance the gunman had Spanish ancestry.

Im not related with spain or spaniards. Sorry to take down your incredibly childish argument (oh my god... ).

PS: if you're gonna import someone else's argument, do it from someone offering a good one. Jarmo's one is ridiculous and have no basis at all.

If you're going to state things as fact, post a source...

He knows everything, and the rest of us are ridiculous.

Doesn't need a source.

Come on!



I learned this ages ago... 





/jarmo

emmm, you really think im ''all alone'' in this? You really think i'll consider i'm all alone because of a bunch of americans posting ''america is da man'' in a GNR message board?

Want to see some pictures? Want to hear the voices of millions of people around the globe talking about bush's government?

Taking what is said in this forum as a worldwide tendency is exactly the same ostrichs do: hiding the head in a hole.

What do you want me to proove that you need a source? You really need a ''link'' to acknowledge the fact the USA has caused more deaths than any other country in the world?

Im so sorry you cant live with the fact that many many people in the world dont agree with the historic US imperialism that has hurt humanity a lot more than Al Qaeda.

Here you have some proofs that i'm not alone at all. Justice with Bin Laden has been made. Now its turn for Bush.

http://www.impeachbush.org/images/content/pagebuilder/veterans-indict-bush-banner.jpg
http://www.takeoverworld.info/images/Bush_Engineered_9-11_Banner.jpg
http://newsgrist.typepad.com/photos/grand_central_station/banner1.JPG
http://www.paperpk.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/bush-banner.jpg
http://th49.photobucket.com/albums/f296/zoltar666/th_bush_jail.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3336/3228069274_f6821bb23e.jpg
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2007/03/13/bush372.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3004/2922094785_51082f6009.jpg
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/images/2008/01/09/bush_hate_hamas.jpg
http://images.wikia.com/wikiality/images/4/4d/Brazilian%27ForaBush%27Banner.jpg
http://www.freakinsweet.com/images/burning_bush/burning_bush_banner.jpg
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/38960000/jpg/_38960337_sydney203afpbody.jpg
http://www.sspglenrothes.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/G8Gleneagles/Bush-banner01.jpg
http://www.actagainsttorture.org/img11Jan2008/impeach_bush_wcw.jpg
http://www.quelapaseslindo.com.ar/wp-content/uploads/fuera_bush.jpg
http://uploads.blogia.com/blogs/j/ja/jaq/jaquematepress/upload/20070324035444-fuera-bush.jpg
http://www.losblogueros.net/mt-weblog/fotos/fuera%20bush.jpg
http://uruguay.indymedia.org/uploads/2007/02/fuera_bush.jpg
http://www.radio36.com.uy/imagenes/2007/02/14/Gobierno%20de%20Bush%20.gif
http://www.esacademic.com/pictures/eswiki/70/Fuera-Bush-PO.jpg
http://www.izquierdasocialista.org.ar/es/058/bush.jpg
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/9167/bushfuerajb5.jpg
http://www.radio36.com.uy/imagenes/2007/03/06/fuera%20bush_arr2.jpg
http://www.mujeresaloeste.org.ar/no_bush2.gif
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/110889417_b037635f58_m.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_9lWDuIAYW6c/R9AAEQDltiI/AAAAAAAAAAs/y2tIKimYdyk/S259/Fuera+Bush+asesino.bmp
http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z168/vozrebelde/070311-FueraBushDeColombia-13.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_W2tiqcNtimI/R8eVNfaOo6I/AAAAAAAAAA4/gaEgtf2QVPw/S240/fuera%2BBush!!!.jpg
http://www.soberania.org/Images/george_bush_and_adolf_hitler_same_shit.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_HSQqEHdYGAA/SSpRpqT7IqI/AAAAAAAAAEk/CWyBhGtAf5c/s320/4.jpg

[Bodhi]

the historic US imperialism that has hurt humanity a lot more than Al Qaeda.

its comments like this that make it impossible to take you seriously.

[D]

US isn't perfect, sure we've had our black eyes like a lot of other countries, slavery being number 1 the Native Americans number 2, but I don't think the US have ever intentionally murdered innocent people. has it happened? unfortunately yes but I think those that say the US should mind their own business need to remember what happened back in the 1930's when we minded our own business and a certain evil bastard named Hitler almost ruled the entire eastern world.

[jarmo]

Want to see some pictures? Want to hear the voices of millions of people around the globe talking about bush's government?

I know.

And once again, what does it have to do with what happened about a day ago?

We get it, you don't agree with the US foreign policy.

But this topic isn't about that! When will you get it?

You're just using this topic to post the same shit over and over again.


I wasn't a fan of GWB or his policies. I was glad Obama was elected.

Im so sorry you cant live with the fact that many many people in the world dont agree with the historic US imperialism that has hurt humanity a lot more than Al Qaeda.

Does that make terrorist networks the "good guys"?





/jarmo

[estebanf]

I know.

And once again, what does it have to do with what happened about a day ago?

We get it, you don't agree with the US foreign policy.

But this topic isn't about that! When will you get it?

You're just using this topic to post the same shit over and over again.


I wasn't a fan of GWB or his policies. I was glad Obama was elected.

Ok, great. I knew from moment zero this topic was not about US foreign policy.

I just reacted after a post by someone who made all this thing look as a ''USA vs The Evil'' which I think its bullshit.

End of off-topic, I promise.

Im so sorry you cant live with the fact that many many people in the world dont agree with the historic US imperialism that has hurt humanity a lot more than Al Qaeda.


Does that make terrorist networks the "good guys"?


/jarmo

This is a war between two different kinds of evil. The only victims here are US/Iraq civilians.

[Ulises]

Whether or not he was a threat anymore is irrelevant, he WAS responsible for 9/11 and was brought to justice.  We have no way of knowing how much of a threat he was, only the government knows that.

Yes, America has been responsible for a lot of deaths, but a lot of them were as a result of being attacked in the first place.  Aside from Vietnam and the Iraq War, the USA was provoked were they not?  You are acting as if the US just started bombing countries at random just for fun.

Death is a terrible thing.  Nobody wants war, and nobody is happy to see people die.  Unfortunately we do not live in a peaceful world.  But to say America is mostly responsible for that is just crazy.

US is responsible in a...let's say...75%, 80% for that. US spread violence and opression for many many years to all the globe.

To name a few: the "Manifest Destiny" (I heard shit about Lebensraum but nobody says nothing about "Manifest Destiny") , "The Monroe Doctrine"and Rossevelt's actions invoking that doctine (simple: central and south america total domination), the big stick, etc. etc. and many military ocupations though history (Haiti, Cuba, Dominican Republic, Cuba), the interference in the politics of many countries, the interference in many war where YOU HAD NOTHING TO DO THERE (Oh...wait...no...you were guaranteeing peace and democracy...go...how ass am I?!), the imposition of politics and economic doctrines around the globe, etc. etc., etc. . You spread violence for so many years...

You think you own the world and that's simply disgusting. You don't know where many countries are in the map (because of your fuckin and big ego) but we, the poor guys, knows about everything and we haven't been brainwashed. We don't buy your stories and your lies.

But...well..this is not about what Ulises think about US, is about Bin Laden being dead and we all celebrate that. But we celebrate because a dangerous terrorist dissapear from the face of the earth, not because "the guy who attacked US is dead". Never hear about "you get what you give"? Well...take a look on that.

[One.In.A.Million]

Did anyone see what that video was "anything goes" posted?, was it crap or what?.   (It's taken down now)

So it turns out that the US might have took some DNA, to prove that it was Bin Laden. But I think it would have been better all round if they took a photo, as conspiracy theorists are always going to claim that DNA isn't enough and that they should have took a picture before dumping the body.  

[FunkyMonkey]

EXCLUSIVE: Video Inside Bin Laden's Lair

ABC News obtains exclusive footage inside Osama bin Laden's Abbottabad compound.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/osama-bin-laden-dead-inside-pakistan-kill-site-13507839

Osama Bin Laden Dead- Graphic Footage Inside Bin Laden`s Compound, 2011

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1bwf0RnDsM

[jarmo]

You think you own the world and that's simply disgusting. You don't know where many countries are in the map (because of your fuckin and big ego) but we, the poor guys, knows about everything and we haven't been brainwashed. We don't buy your stories and your lies.

Problems usually start when somebody thinks they're better than somebody else...

I'm not part of the "poor guys", I know geography.

I still don't know anything according to your way of thinking.

Apparently only people in certain areas of the world know shit!

What the fuck is up with that way of thinking...



Ignorance doesn't discriminate. It's global.



By the way, it's a bit naive to talk about people in USA like they know nothing. First off, the person you think is a "stupid American" might be an immigrant from Argentina. For example!

Secondly, it's not very clever to assume the people you are talking to here have no clue about anything. You don't know them. You have a stereo type and you assume the whole country is like that.


You should know better.






/jarmo

[Ulises]

Maybe I generalized, yes, my mistake.

But I wasn't trying to say what you think (i,e, "Apparently only people in certain areas of the world know shit!" and stuff) . Maybe because my english is very poor and sometimes it is hard to explain some things I want to say. I'll work on that.

[One.In.A.Million]

I agree with both sides of the argument here... 

I think it's obvious that alot of Western countries have alot to answer for in regards to killing innocent people, whether it's indirectly or behind a form of "politics" that we will never hear of, because "they" don't want us too.

In short there's alot of things going on in the world, that us civilians can't even begin to comprehend. And yes I agree, that countries like the US, UK and other westernised societys, have injured or killed people in the name of oil, foreign interests and nuclear planning.

The Taliban are evil and so was Bin Laden, and it was right for him to be killed on the spot, same with any other terrorist. An organisation that promotes evil, deserves to be wiped out, in whatever manner. And I really do believe that this is a big blow for the Taliban, and they really are "wounded" by this.

But regarding what esteban, Ulises and jarmo are debating. I can't argue against either, because alot of things that esteban has said does make sense. But I'm not going to entertain people by trying to explain it, because I don't think anyone really has a clue what goes on behind closed doors in countrys like the US and UK. I don't think anyone can argue against some people forming the opinion that "we" are just as bad as countrys in the middle-east.

There's alot of propaganda, secrets and lies involved. And we will never really know what has gone on or whats behind the inner workings of the world, in which we as civilians have no control over.


"There's Alot Goin On"